Now it's USM's AD

untjim1995 · May 11, 2017

1 hour ago, GrandGreen said:

I like how you concede that MTSU will be a better program than NT in 7 years and automatically assume NT will not be in a position to move up. Then further this theory by implying NT won't even be in the second group with Rice, etc. and will be destined to the lowest possible league. NT is spending a lot of money for nothing, and apparently has made a bunch of bad personnel decisions if this comes to fruition.

I just recognize that MTSU is a better program than us in the two sports that matter over the last decade--by quite a lot, actually. Now here comes the part that matters the most. MTSU gets you exposure in Nashville, where only P5 Vanderbilt exists. North Texas gets you exposure in DFW, but the rest of the college football world looks at DFW and values SMU and TCU higher than us. MTSU doesn't have an SMU to block them from joining a league above them--we always have, we always will...it sucks royally, but its the honest truth that we are blocked in the same way La Tech blocks ULM and UTEP blocks NMSU.

forevereagle · May 11, 2017

22 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

And then of course the 8 or 9 other FBS universities statewide.

There are 11 other FBS schools statewide.

Ben Gooding · May 11, 2017

5 minutes ago, forevereagle said:

There are 11 other FBS schools statewide.

Outside of UTA, SMU, and TCU?

Either way, point is there.

Arkstfan · May 11, 2017

I don't buy into the all-sports trophy thing that much but if I were evaluating program I would want to know if you can bring any value to football or basketball, can get anyone to come to your games, and then I would look at the all-sports stuff. Not so much caring if you win swimming and diving every year but is your program solid. If a school has good football and is finishing last in half their other sports I'm not so interested.

UNTLifer · May 11, 2017

1 hour ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Should we count the NCAA tourney WIN MT had JUST 2 MONTHS AGO??

Program = All of your Athletics teams. MT's has been better than ours for quite some time.

Sad reality, I know. Tough to come to grips with this.

I'm here for you buddy.

I believe they also sponsor more sports which would lead to a higher ranking in the Bubas Cup standings.

MeanGreenTexan · May 11, 2017

3 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

I believe they also sponsor more sports which would lead to a higher ranking in the Bubas Cup standings.

Not necessarily if those sports suck.

forevereagle · May 11, 2017

1 hour ago, Ben Gooding said:

Outside of UTA, SMU, and TCU?

Either way, point is there.

FBS statewide, including SMU and TCU, excluding UTA (not FBS), is 12 total schools (counting us). If you want to get into Division 1, there are a ton more of those.

Ben Gooding · May 11, 2017

4 minutes ago, forevereagle said:

FBS statewide, including SMU and TCU, excluding UTA (not FBS), is 12 total schools (counting us). If you want to get into Division 1, there are a ton more of those.

Oh, well of course UTA isn't FBS, duh. But they play a major sport at the D1 level and are also located in the DFW metroplex. The point I was trying to make is we have a lot more competition to get the general population to rally around our university and the athletic programs within.

forevereagle · May 11, 2017

Just now, Ben Gooding said:

Oh, well of course UTA isn't FBS, duh. But they play a major sport at the D1 level and are also located in the DFW metroplex. The point I was trying to make is we have a lot more competition to get the general population to rally around our university and the athletic programs within.

I agree with your point, just making sure that you are showing what we are up against. We have every major pro sport in the area and 4 D1 universities plus a bunch of D1s in the state.

GrandGreen · May 11, 2017

4 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Sorry to break this to you, but MTSU has been a better program than UNT for a very long time now... like since both schools were in the SBC.
MT continually won the SBC BUBAS Cup, while the best we ever did was 4th-or-so. There is a lot of work to be done.

Gosh, I was not aware of that. Do you bother to read a post before you respond to it. You or I have no idea who will be in the top tier of G5 schools in seven years. There is obviously a lot to be done for NT to close the gap not only between the MUTS; but most of other G5 schools.

3 hours ago, Ben Gooding said:

Very true. They have a sense of pride there in Murfreesboro, much like in Hattiesburg. Small town universities typically out perform metropolitan universities. It's a sense of community and pride thing in the smaller towns. And it drives their athletic programs to perform well.

You can throw Ruston in there with those 2 towns as well. And Jonesboro for that matter.

I really love how fans like to list all these advantages that other schools have over NT, but never consider the advantages NT has over those same schools. Better tell Houston and UTSA that they can't compete with those more rural colleges.

MTSU by the way is very similar to NT in terms of location. It is in a metro area, about 30 miles from Nashville. On the other side, there are many more recruits in the DFW area than the state of Tennessee and MTSU's football stadium is closer to Fouts than Apogee.

Ben Gooding · May 11, 2017

16 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

Gosh, I was not aware of that. Do you bother to read a post before you respond to it. You or I have no idea who will be in the top tier of G5 schools in seven years. There is obviously a lot to be done for NT to close the gap not only between the MUTS; but most of other G5 schools.

I really love how fans like to list all these advantages that other schools have over NT, but never consider the advantages NT has over those same schools. Better tell Houston and UTSA that they can't compete with those more rural colleges.

MTSU by the way is very similar to NT in terms of location. It is in a metro area, about 30 miles from Nashville. On the other side, there are many more recruits in the DFW area than the state of Tennessee and MTSU's football stadium is closer to Fouts than Apogee.

You must not have read my previous posts comparing Nashville/DFW and Texas/Tennesee. The cons can be flipped into pros as far as location. But they can easily be negative toward a program. Our experiences at UNT in regards to the topic at hand has typically not worked in our favor. A lot of DFW prospects want out of DFW and many out of Texas in general. Don't believe me, go ask the big12, particularly the big12 Texas schools. They'll tell you all about their lack of recruiting success in metropolitan Texas. Go look at the 14 big12 players drafted in last months draft. There were more non-big12 players from the state of Texas drafted than all of the big 12 combined. I believe the number was actually doubled up if I remember correctly.

ColoradoEagle · May 11, 2017

4 hours ago, Ben Gooding said:

Except we have roughly quadruple the population to compete against and for. Not to mention 5 pro sport teams and 3 other local FBS colleges to compete with. It's harder to be a small fish a big lake than a small fish in a small pond.

And then of course the 8 or 9 other FBS universities statewide.

Quadruple the population is an asset, not a liability. The Titans and Predators play in Nashville. Vanderbilt is in Nashville. Their enrollment is 2/3 the size of ours, but they spend the same amount in athletics. They're not a small fish in a small pond.

I'm not trying to come after you, I just get tired of excuses as to why one school is successful where we are not. Especially when it's a school in our exact same situation. Same conference. They have to compete against the NFL. They have to compete against a P5 school. Outside of a major city. Directional school.

Ben Gooding · May 11, 2017

3 minutes ago, ColoradoEagle said:

Quadruple the population is an asset, not a liability. The Titans and Predators play in Nashville. Vanderbilt is in Nashville. Their enrollment is 2/3 the size of ours, but they spend the same amount in athletics. They're not a small fish in a small pond.

I'm not trying to come after you, I just get tired of excuses as to why one school is successful where we are not. Especially when it's a school in our exact same situation. Same conference. They have to compete against the NFL. They have to compete against a P5 school. Outside of a major city. Directional school.

Touche.

But Dallas has 3 more pro sport teams than Nashville. 3 other D1 universities. 12 FBS universities in the state. DFW is a busier city or metro area with far more to do with different demographics that have different priorities. People are pulled in different directions and it spreads fandom thin.

Now I'm not making excuses. These are just facts. With that said, we do have almost 40k students and almost a 31k seat stadium that we have never sold out. That is inexcusable. We don't spend enough because a university commitment has never been present. But that too is changing. The ingredients are falling in place to create a foundation to springboard from. But for whatever reason or another it's trendy right now among the kids to go outside of Texas if the opportunity presents itself. And that is hurting G5 programs. Because the Texas P5 schools and OK P5 schools aren't getting their share of Texas players they're used to, so they are taking the borderline players that would have been a prefect fit in CUSA. It has been trickling down to on the field play and now consequently in the last few NFL drafts. In the current setup and in the grand scheme of things, we need the big12 to form back into their old selves so they can start landing top in state talent and the borderline players can trickle into to the CUSA schools, where their skillset fits. JMO.

untjim1995 · May 12, 2017

9 hours ago, ColoradoEagle said:

Quadruple the population is an asset, not a liability. The Titans and Predators play in Nashville. Vanderbilt is in Nashville. Their enrollment is 2/3 the size of ours, but they spend the same amount in athletics. They're not a small fish in a small pond.

I'm not trying to come after you, I just get tired of excuses as to why one school is successful where we are not. Especially when it's a school in our exact same situation. Same conference. They have to compete against the NFL. They have to compete against a P5 school. Outside of a major city. Directional school.

MTSU spends the same as we do on sports despite being a third smaller enrollment. Why is that? Because sports are their window to the university. It's the same at every other school we compete with. Not here, though--and it never will be, because it is not what our university wants to change.

UNTLifer · May 12, 2017

9 hours ago, untjim1995 said:

Not here, though--and it never will be, because it is not what our university wants to change.

You sure about that?

wardly · May 13, 2017

I find it difficult to accurately compare sports spending as a percent of a university's budget as many states fund athletics in ways that the state of Texas does not allow.On another note, if UNT is not making a much belated attempt to use athletics as a window to the university then count me fooled.We have spent money like Democrats in beefing up exective manpower in our Athletic Department and are paying coaches near the top of CUSA and above the MAC,SBC, and some MWC programs.Again, I don't know where Baker is getting the money, and am awaiting his published road map for success. However, from the outside looking in he appears to be his own man and makes decisions, such as scheduling, with a plan in mind. We just don't know what it is, so" wait and" see seems to be appropriate at this point in time.

Arkstfan · May 16, 2017

On ‎5‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 9:34 PM, wardly said:

I find it difficult to accurately compare sports spending as a percent of a university's budget as many states fund athletics in ways that the state of Texas does not allow.On another note, if UNT is not making a much belated attempt to use athletics as a window to the university then count me fooled.We have spent money like Democrats in beefing up exective manpower in our Athletic Department and are paying coaches near the top of CUSA and above the MAC,SBC, and some MWC programs.Again, I don't know where Baker is getting the money, and am awaiting his published road map for success. However, from the outside looking in he appears to be his own man and makes decisions, such as scheduling, with a plan in mind. We just don't know what it is, so" wait and" see seems to be appropriate at this point in time.

I think you can look at the numbers for ODU and James Madison and see that it is pretty obvious they are reporting expenses and revenue differently.

Aquila_Viridis · May 16, 2017

Not many Nashvillains will ever think of themselves primarily as Middle Tennesseans. Middle will always be Middle, but they have had a better commitment to their athletics than NT, especially on a relative basis. Nashville metro is tiny compared to the North Texas region. That is only an advantage for Middle if NT keeps playing the same game. It should not be an advantage for them.

Aquila_Viridis · May 16, 2017

Also I thought I should add some perspective after having gone through two admission cycles with Texas and Tennessee residents respectively. From the prospective student perspective NT is in a better place overall than MT. MT is behind Memphis and even Chattanooga. While NT is behind Houston, it is not behind SFA for example. Sure there are some students who would choose SFA for unique reasons, but that would not be the general perspective of pedigree. In Texas yes there are more schools to be behind, but there are many times more people, and many more schools that NT is ahead of.

I definitely think that MT is a team that NT should play regularly but not necessarily every year. Southern Miss I can totally live without.

MeanGreenMailbox aka TFLF · May 16, 2017

On 5/10/2017 at 4:00 PM, Arkstfan said:

Says he is interested in USM being in a more regional league.

http://www.sunherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/patrick-magee/article148897724.html

What I got from the article:
(1) Cat is out of the bag on C-USA AD's waking up, sobering up, looking over at their late night pick ups, and wanting to get out and go back home. It will happen.
(2) Frisco angling for the C-USA baseball tournament. Is there anything Frisco will not try to land in college sports?

Arkstfan · May 17, 2017

8 hours ago, MeanGreenMailbox said:

What I got from the article:
(1) Cat is out of the bag on C-USA AD's waking up, sobering up, looking over at their late night pick ups, and wanting to get out and go back home. It will happen.
(2) Frisco angling for the C-USA baseball tournament. Is there anything Frisco will not try to land in college sports?

Frisco is following the Indianapolis strategy for trying to pick around the edges on sports events rather than the big obvious stuff. Gained a lot of expertise.

wardly · May 17, 2017

Frisco has the 1AA championship football game, a new yet to be named minor football bowl game, and CUSA basketball tournament. They also had either a Division or NAIA championship basketball game[I forget which]. Lack of hotel rooms has limited their ability to compete for other college events, but that is changing rapidly with 4 or more upscale hotels under construction. With a great AA baseball venue [Rough Riders]look for them to seek college opportunities in that sport.And no, there is not anything Frisco will not try to land. As Arkstfan duly noted, Indianapolis is a great roll model.

UNTFan23 · May 17, 2017

10 hours ago, wardly said:

Frisco has the 1AA championship football game, a new yet to be named minor football bowl game, and CUSA basketball tournament. They also had either a Division or NAIA championship basketball game[I forget which]. Lack of hotel rooms has limited their ability to compete for other college events, but that is changing rapidly with 4 or more upscale hotels under construction. With a great AA baseball venue [Rough Riders]look for them to seek college opportunities in that sport.And no, there is not anything Frisco will not try to land. As Arkstfan duly noted, Indianapolis is a great roll model.

There are tons of hotels all along the SRT corridor, which is just 10 minutes or less away from The Star. I expect more hotels to appear north of the SRT/DNT exchange now that the new Cowboys HQ has been finished. The boom along US380 isn't hurting things either.

MeanGreenTexan · May 17, 2017

On 5/15/2017 at 10:54 PM, Aquila_Viridis said:

Not many Nashvillains will ever think of themselves primarily as Middle Tennesseans. Middle will always be Middle, but they have had a better commitment to their athletics than NT, especially on a relative basis. Nashville metro is tiny compared to the North Texas region. That is only an advantage for Middle if NT keeps playing the same game. It should not be an advantage for them.

Actually, (and this is likely just semantics) they probably do...

...Just like The University of North Texas shares the name of the region where we are located. People in DFW would consider ourselves "North Texans". The area where Nashville & Murfreesboro are located is called Middle Tennessee. They would likely consider themselves "Middle Tennesseans".

Ben Gooding · May 17, 2017

2 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Actually, (and this is likely just semantics) they probably do...

...Just like The University of North Texas shares the name of the region where we are located. People in DFW would consider ourselves "North Texans". The area where Nashville & Murfreesboro are located is called Middle Tennessee. They would likely consider themselves "Middle Tennesseans".

This is fact.