Johnny Jones?

Greendylan · February 7, 2017

3 hours ago, Censored by Laurie said:

JJ was 2-2 against Cross.

the blow-out loss in '11, which seems to be all anyone around here remembers, was the 2nd D-1 game of the year for a basically entire new squad (the first game a pretty narrow loss at Tech), played in what was such a foreign setting to any of the new kids and was, without question, the biggest anomaly of JJ's entire tenure. that team still made the conference championship game. do you remember what those were like?

despite all that...find me anywhere that anyone said "JJ is our best option at all costs". go ahead...find it. oh? nothing? sort of like what fills that bag you're dragging around? hmm.

the conversation around JJ started as a noting of the fact that he'll likely be out of a job the same day UNT starts it's well over-due coaching search. nobody said "hire him!!" or "our savior!!"...only that here is a guy who is familiar with UNT, has already once brought at the very least respectability and conference competitiveness to a program in effing ashes...maybe we should at least consider walking him through the still smoldering pile of shit we made of his work and say, "whatta think of what we did with the place? wanna help us redecorate again?"

these are such generic sports guy lines..."strive for better success"..."mediocrity has been our standard"... what the hell does that even mean? you won't find a soul amongst any of even JJ's most fervent supporters who will say he's a perfect coach. I have a well-chronicled history through this basketball forum and other media (when I actually gave a shit about basketball) of being highly critical of a number of his coaching qualities. that said...the "perfect" coach sure as hell isn't coming to a directional school with a 40% winning percentage over the last half-decade. mediocrity would be a be a giant improvement.

The irony is that if it weren't for JJ's success prior to the last half-decade dumpster fire, no one could possibly mount an argument that we should aspire to greater heights than the very coach who made us believe that we deserve nice things in the first place.

FirefightnRick · February 8, 2017

12 hours ago, Greendylan said:

The irony is that if it weren't for JJ's success prior to the last half-decade dumpster fire, no one could possibly mount an argument that we should aspire to greater heights than the very coach who made us believe that we deserve nice things in the first place.

For me and many others that was Jimmy Gales. And many more that would be Bill Blakely.

Rick

TreeFiddy · February 8, 2017

Got to admit that I am not a big fan of bringing back someone that left, but when you start looking for candidates that we can realistically bring in, assuming we keep our salary package at the current ~$350K range, the prospects all start blending together and each direction you could go have certain risks. You could certainly do a lot worse than JJ. He does appear that he could bring some stability and respectability back to the program.

I hope we go in a different direction and are wildly successful, but I have come to the realization that I would not be totally disappointed if JJ was back on the bench next year (with an extra large buyout of course).

GrandGreen · February 8, 2017

10 hours ago, FirefightnRick said:

For me and many others that was Jimmy Gales. And many more that would be Bill Blakely.

Rick

Unfortunately, most NT fans are not old enough to have witnessed the best area of NT basketball. Spika and Blakeley were much better coaches than Jones. Gales had some good teams but was not consistent. Since Gales, and what most fans are familiar with; the NT coaches were Jankovich, Trilli, Jones and Benford. Jones looks mighty good in comparison. Jankovich was too green to coach the Mean Green when he was here, but now is a very successful coach. Trilli and Benford are two of the worst coaches to ever coach a division 1 ball club.

I doubt Jones will even be considered. However, Cross should be a candidate. I doubt he would be interested, but definitely worth a look. Those concerned about his overall record maybe overlooking UTA 24-11 record last year. UTA may be fourth currently in the Belt, but they are also number 57 in rpi rankings.

Wag Tag · February 8, 2017

36 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

Unfortunately, most NT fans are not old enough to have witnessed the best area of NT basketball. Spika and Blakeley were much better coaches than Jones. Gales had some good teams but was not consistent. Since Gales, and what most fans are familiar with; the NT coaches were Jankovich, Trilli, Jones and Benford. Jones looks mighty good in comparison. Jankovich was too green to coach the Mean Green when he was here, but now is a very successful coach. Trilli and Benford are two of the worst coaches to ever coach a division 1 ball club.

I doubt Jones will even be considered. However, Cross should be a candidate. I doubt he would be interested, but definitely worth a look. Those concerned about his overall record maybe overlooking UTA 24-11 record last year. UTA may be fourth currently in the Belt, but they are also number 57 in rpi rankings.

I also think Cross should be the #1 option. He has consistently beaten P5 programs on their home court, he is very in touch with the local recruits both through schools and AAU. UNT attraction for him would be large pay increase, good facilities, and his family can stay local with having 3 kids. GMG

FirefightnRick · February 8, 2017

2 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

Unfortunately, most NT fans are not old enough to have witnessed the best area of NT basketball. Spika and Blakeley were much better coaches than Jones. Gales had some good teams but was not consistent. Since Gales, and what most fans are familiar with; the NT coaches were Jankovich, Trilli, Jones and Benford. Jones looks mighty good in comparison. Jankovich was too green to coach the Mean Green when he was here, but now is a very successful coach. Trilli and Benford are two of the worst coaches to ever coach a division 1 ball club.

I doubt Jones will even be considered. However, Cross should be a candidate. I doubt he would be interested, but definitely worth a look. Those concerned about his overall record maybe overlooking UTA 24-11 record last year. UTA may be fourth currently in the Belt, but they are also number 57 in rpi rankings.

Of course I never got the chance to see either coach and their teams play, but after hearing so many great stories about them I truly wished I had. The Snake Pit era games sounded like they were incredibly fun to be a part of.

Rick

GrandGreen · February 8, 2017

53 minutes ago, FirefightnRick said:

Of course I never got the chance to see either coach and their teams play, but after hearing so many great stories about them I truly wished I had. The Snake Pit era games sounded like they were incredibly fun to be a part of.

Rick

I have never had a better sport attendance experience than going to MVC games in the Snake Pit. Night games were always sold out, a little over 4000 in an ultra loud old gym with more than half students. The best basketball conference in the nation, at that time. NT was maybe an average MVC team on the road, but they were very hard to beat at home.

Drake coach Maury John, commented after a double-overtime loss to North Texas that "This is the worst damn place in the world to play basketball! This place is a snake pit!" Saw that game as well as NT's only victory over Louisville. Big time athletics at it's best.

I have been to my share of pro games, NT bowl games and big wins by NT in both football and basketball. Nothing matched the intensity and fun of those games in the original pit.

Edited February 8, 2017 by GrandGreen

wardly · February 8, 2017

I was there in 1961/1966, witnessed coach Johnson burned in effigy in front of old English Building, and saw my all time round ball player John Savage pack them in at the PIT. In a home game against SMU a friend of mine, whom I met later in life,Charles Robinson, had a breakaway for the Ponies and as he was taking it to the house down the sideline he was tripped by a fan and fell flat on his face. Charles said that the Pitt was toughest place he ever played against one of the best opponents, John Savage. I don't know if it was just the excitement of being college freshmen, but me and my buddies tried never to miss a game. Great memories.

shootermcgavin44 · February 9, 2017

2012–13	LSU	19–12	9–9	T–8th
2013–14	LSU	20–14	9–9	T–6th	NIT Second Round
2014–15	LSU	22–11	11–7	T–3rd	NCAA Second Round
2015–16	LSU	19–14	11–7	T–3rd

Are there any coaches with this level of success in a power conference that have gotten a mid major team to the tournament multiple times going to apply for this job?

2006–07	North Texas	23–11	10–8	3rd (West)	NCAA First Round
2007–08	North Texas	20–11	10–8	3rd (West)
2008–09	North Texas	20–12	11–7	2nd (West)
2009–10	North Texas	24–9	13–5	1st (West)	NCAA First Round

These days were fun...... Now we are 4 games out of qualifying for our own flipping conference tournament.

UNTFan23 · February 9, 2017

8 hours ago, Wag Tag said:

I also think Cross should be the #1 option. He has consistently beaten P5 programs on their home court, he is very in touch with the local recruits both through schools and AAU. UNT attraction for him would be large pay increase, good facilities, and his family can stay local with having 3 kids. GMG

He won't come cheap either. Buyout of current contract plus throw enough money at him to make a lateral move (at best).

TreeFiddy · February 9, 2017

Very unlikely we pursue someone that requires a buyout IMO. Plus, we are still paying off the note on two other contracts.

Wag Tag · February 9, 2017

1 hour ago, TreeFiddy said:

Very unlikely we pursue someone that requires a buyout IMO. Plus, we are still paying off the note on two other contracts.

Then that will mean no existing head coach unless it is a lower conference. Maybe like the Southland?

TreeFiddy · February 9, 2017

1 hour ago, Wag Tag said:

Then that will mean no existing head coach unless it is a lower conference. Maybe like the Southland?

There will be plenty of guys that don't require a buyout. Certainly, the best candidates will be more likely to be under contract. Maybe I should amend the statement to say that I don't think there will be a significant buyout. I am sure Smatresk will tell WB to find the best candidate and let him worry about the money part, but a large buyout might be pretty tough to pull off.

Edited February 9, 2017 by TreeFiddy

TreeFiddy · February 9, 2017

22 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

I have never had a better sport attendance experience than going to MVC games in the Snake Pit. Night games were always sold out, a little over 4000 in an ultra loud old gym with more than half students. The best basketball conference in the nation, at that time. NT was maybe an average MVC team on the road, but they were very hard to beat at home.

Drake coach Maury John, commented after a double-overtime loss to North Texas that "This is the worst damn place in the world to play basketball! This place is a snake pit!" Saw that game as well as NT's only victory over Louisville. Big time athletics at it's best.

I have been to my share of pro games, NT bowl games and big wins by NT in both football and basketball. Nothing matched the intensity and fun of those games in the original pit.

This one is for @GrandGreen and the others that saw games in the Snake Pit circa 1959. Here is a photo of a visit by Oscar Robertson to the pit. Damn, illumination has come a long way since then.

Cr1028 · February 9, 2017

Just a question, but if we were to bring back JJ, would we be able to pay him like $20k/year and just let him collect the LSU buyout? Leaving extra money for basketball assistants or maybe another sport's athletic budget? Hint, hint.

MeanGreenTexan · February 10, 2017

17 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

Just a question, but if we were to bring back JJ, would we be able to pay him like $20k/year and just let him collect the LSU buyout? Leaving extra money for basketball assistants or maybe another sport's athletic budget? Hint, hint.

You'd probably have to sign him to a 4-5yr deal. So however long he's on LSU's payroll, yeah, you could do that (it's what Charlie Strong is doing to the Longhorns), but once his buyout money from LSU is up, you'd have to jump his salary way up.

Plus, Wouldn't this negatively affect his TRS retirement? Don't you get the "average" of your final 5 years of service? If so, a season or two of $20k, would really bring down that number.

Cr1028 · February 10, 2017

22 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You'd probably have to sign him to a 4-5yr deal. So however long he's on LSU's payroll, yeah, you could do that (it's what Charlie Strong is doing to the Longhorns), but once his buyout money from LSU is up, you'd have to jump his salary way up.

Plus, Wouldn't this negatively affect his TRS retirement? Don't you get the "average" of your final 5 years of service? If so, a season or two of $20k, would really bring down that number.

I believe it is based on the highest 5 years not the final 5 years. He could collect his LSU check over the next several years while acquiring more TRS service credit, he could even purchase credit for the time he was at LSU if he wanted. Right now I believe his 5yr average would be around $400k. Once his LSU buyout is paid out, we could make the decision whether we'd want to keep him and pay him in the $500k range or let him go.

Edited February 10, 2017 by Cr1028

shootermcgavin44 · February 10, 2017

1 hour ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You'd probably have to sign him to a 4-5yr deal. So however long he's on LSU's payroll, yeah, you could do that (it's what Charlie Strong is doing to the Longhorns), but once his buyout money from LSU is up, you'd have to jump his salary way up.

Plus, Wouldn't this negatively affect his TRS retirement? Don't you get the "average" of your final 5 years of service? If so, a season or two of $20k, would really bring down that number.

It's your highest 5 years averaged together.

He may be eligible for a retire/ rehire. He can retire, collect his TRS and then UNT can rehire him and pay him a salary on top of his TRS.