Basketball Long Term Problems?

[UNT90]

24 minutes ago, MeanGreen_MBA said:

Not meaning to poke the bear here.  But can you give an example of ANYBODY on this board making any kind of a statement where they "accept abject failure"?  I am pretty certain that myself, and suspect everybody else on this board, and/or associated with the "U", want the B-ball team and all other programs to be successful.  We may have different ways of stating this.  Some get hot and angry, some more stoic, some in a positive proactive way....many different approaches.....but to say they anybody wants or accepts the program to fail....I don't buy it...  I have not seen 1 posting to keep Benford probably this year.  I will admit, I thought we would do better this year based on talent alone...I was wrong and admitted it....Coaching matters.  We are not getting that....  But nobody wants failure.... amiright???

Some are perfectly fine with failure. Some didn't want RV gone. Some still regret he left. That's a fact. 

Like i saId above, some wear the badge of angst and losing proudly. It's the damndest thing I've ever seen.

[GrandGreen]

1 minute ago, Army of Dad said:

I never stopped going to the home games. 

If UNT does as some of you suggest and continues to accept abject failure then it doesn't care as much as I do.

I'll stop going to games then, and it's almost a certainty that I will not return. 

Both McCarney and RV were finally terminated.  In RV's case, I think him being around 15 years was many times more harmful than anything that Benford could possibly do.   

I am not quite sure what you saying.  Benford is gone, its just going to be delayed another month.  Are you saying if he is not fired before the end of the season, you are giving up on NT MBB?  If you are still going to games, that doesn't really doesn't make sense.  I have went from having 4 season tickets to going to a few games a year, so you are currently supporting the team much more than me.   

2 hours ago, UNT90 said:

And I think certain fans wear that badge with pride and wouldn't have it any other way. 

Pretty sad.

Several of us answered in another thread. Yes, we would come back this year. 

The problem is what happens if this continues. I'm out. @Army of Dad has been there through this entire mess. He is out. Tasty, one of the most knowledgeable basketball posters and biggest fans, is out. 

You know who else is out? All three rows surrounding my former seats behind the UNT bench. Who knows if they will come back. 

You will have let the worst coach if UNT history complete a 5 year contract. UNT doesn't care enough about this to do something? I don't care enough to ever give them any money for anything basketball related other than a single game ticket. Once a year. And only because it's a tradition. 

And it will affect my giving in other areas.

So you are definitely not going to support NT MBB if the symbolic gesture of terminating Benford is not done?    Odds are you have seen your last NT MBB game.   I don't want you sneaking back in if NT hires the right coach and becomes a basketball power.   

I do know you will also continue to flood the message board with your MBB opinions, so all is not lost.  

I doubt you will find many or any that are going to try to defend Benford as a coach or RV and now Baker for allowing him to continue to be over NT's program.   It is obvious to all that failure to terminate him has needlessly damaged the program.   If Baker promised Benford as insinuated that he would get to finish the season, than Baker made a rookie mistake.  

I have been following NT sports for a very long time, and have watched countless once most ardent fans walk away from the program.  Most cited incompetent leadership and/or any real commitment by NT to athletics.   Frankly, for the most part; these criticisms were accurate and proven out by decades of NT just doing enough to hang around the fringes of major college athletics.   

Now, after decades; NT has finally made the financial commitment necessary to compete at least at the G5 level.  That along gives hope that things are finally headed in the right direction.  So you can join that huge group of of ex-fans that have opted out or hang around a little longer to give the new regime a chance and see what develops.  

[97and03]

1 hour ago, Army of Dad said:

I never stopped going to the home games. 

If UNT does as some of you suggest and continues to accept abject failure then it doesn't care as much as I do.

I'll stop going to games then, and it's almost a certainty that I will not return. 

 

Wait, you continued to go to games knowing that Benford was an abject failure and we would likely lose every game? 

[Greendylan]

Yes, firing him now would be (mostly) symbolic, but that is a symbol this fanbase desperately needs to see.  How many times in recent years was a North Texas coach/AD employee fired too soon?  I can think of MAYBE one or two highly arguable examples but then way more catastrophic examples of keeping someone far too long where lasting damage occurred.  Maybe it's time to change how we do things?

Also, it might not ENTIRELY be symbolic, as there are examples of interim coaches producing a little bump in the level of play.  What do we have to lose?  With Benford we have zero shot of making noise in the CUSA tournament and almost certainly won't even get there.  With an interim, maybe 0% jumps to 5%.  Who knows?  I'm obviously just making up numbers here, but it would at least inspire a tiny modicum of hope that could, in turn, boost attendance.  Right now our seniors are just sort of limping to a lonely, depressing end of their careers in front of almost no one at the Super Pit.

Speaking of limping, that's another reason to pull the plug on Benford.  I have no reason to believe that he did anything unethical with his handling of Combs's injury, but what about the player's perspective?  Combs very well may have been rushing to return and pushing himself too hard because he felt immense pressure to save his coach's career.  At this point, Benford and all of his players are either feeling complete desperation or complete apathy.  Either way, it is a dangerous situation and unfair to all parties involved.  Rip off the damn Band-Aid already before someone gets hurt.

[Army of Dad]

12 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

Both McCarney and RV were finally terminated.  In RV's case, I think him being around 15 years was many times more harmful than anything that Benford could possibly do.   

I am not quite sure what you saying.  Benford is gone, its just going to be delayed another month.  Are you saying if he is not fired before the end of the season, you are giving up on NT MBB?  If you are still going to games, that doesn't really doesn't make sense.  I have went from having 4 season tickets to going to a few games a year, so you are currently supporting the team much more than me.   

If/when I stop going to games that is likely to be a permanent condition. I'll love something with real passion, but if that is killed off then it's dead. It should be fairly obvious that it takes a good bit to kill that passion (FFS we've kept our season tickets all this time!), but that point is being reached. 

I see all of this as more of the same old UNT syndrome. Keeping Benford and allowing him to (likely) lose 20 games for a third time is going to be the final straw. 

I fail to see how this time it's really going to be different. Finally firing RV gave me a glimmer of hope. That little bit of hope is fading fast. 

Perhaps you missed where I said we are the local fans that we hear so much about needing. We have only slight ties to the school. UNT is still sending the message that there's little reason to care about athletics or attend the events. That attitude will never build the passion needed in large segments of the local and alumni groups. 

19 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

NT hires the right coach and becomes a basketball power.   

I don't see how that scenario is likely to happen. Baker made a mistake in retaining Benford. IMO, he doesn't have time to play wait and see with all of the things wrong in his department. 

6 minutes ago, 97and03 said:

Wait, you continued to go to games knowing that Benford was an abject failure and we would likely lose every game? 

It takes a hell of a lot to make me quit. 

[UNT90]

29 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

Both McCarney and RV were finally terminated.  In RV's case, I think him being around 15 years was many times more harmful than anything that Benford could possibly do.   

I am not quite sure what you saying.  Benford is gone, its just going to be delayed another month.  Are you saying if he is not fired before the end of the season, you are giving up on NT MBB?  If you are still going to games, that doesn't really doesn't make sense.  I have went from having 4 season tickets to going to a few games a year, so you are currently supporting the team much more than me.   

So you are definitely not going to support NT MBB if the symbolic gesture of terminating Benford is not done?    Odds are you have seen your last NT MBB game.   I don't want you sneaking back in if NT hires the right coach and becomes a basketball power.   

I do know you will also continue to flood the message board with your MBB opinions, so all is not lost.  

I doubt you will find many or any that are going to try to defend Benford as a coach or RV and now Baker for allowing him to continue to be over NT's program.   It is obvious to all that failure to terminate him has needlessly damaged the program.   If Baker promised Benford as insinuated that he would get to finish the season, than Baker made a rookie mistake.  

I have been following NT sports for a very long time, and have watched countless once most ardent fans walk away from the program.  Most cited incompetent leadership and/or any real commitment by NT to athletics.   Frankly, for the most part; these criticisms were accurate and proven out by decades of NT just doing enough to hang around the fringes of major college athletics.   

Now, after decades; NT has finally made the financial commitment necessary to compete at least at the G5 level.  That along gives hope that things are finally headed in the right direction.  So you can join that huge group of of ex-fans that have opted out or hang around a little longer to give the new regime a chance and see what develops.  

Let's just say I doubt the last bolded paragraph. If that were the case, Benford would be gone. He isn't 

And you are right, I will join the VAST MAJORITY OF UNT ALUMNI who don't give a crap about UNT basketball. Oh, I'll come back. Once a year. To carry on a tradition. Nothing more. Ever again. Much like I did in the early 2000s. 

 

[97and03]

8 minutes ago, Army of Dad said:

If/when I stop going to games that is likely to be a permanent condition. I'll love something with real passion, but if that is killed off then it's dead. It should be fairly obvious that it takes a good bit to kill that passion (FFS we've kept our season tickets all this time!), but that point is being reached. 

It takes a hell of a lot to make me quit. 

Seems like someone should have told you to expect more!

[UNTFan23]

2 hours ago, UNT90 said:

Some are perfectly fine with failure. Some didn't want RV gone. Some still regret he left. That's a fact. 

Like i saId above, some wear the badge of angst and losing proudly. It's the damndest thing I've ever seen.

And ...

[UNT90]

24 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

And ...

And...