Silver lining

PlummMeanGreen · December 29, 2016

I'd rather have a coach someone else wants than not. We've had enough "nots" many of our older alums adult lives since the late 1970's.

Boise State lost 4 or 5(?) HFC's in the course of a little over a decade, but kept reloading with new ones who still kept the Broncos in the Top 25 after each coaching change. It was amazing to observe that happening with their program.

A UNT HFC needs 3-4 consecutive good recruiting classes, defeating a P5 or 2 or a ranked team for any school to look toward Denton again, but thats just my opinion on that subject.

Seth Littrell will probably be our first HFC with apparent desires of staying who will use Apogee & the Mean Green Village as true positive selling points (which they truly are). Not sure after McCarney had his stroke if he saw UNT as a long term job. A stroke for many of middle age usually means a time to slow down or even retire.

GMG!

Edited December 29, 2016 by PlummMeanGreen

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

Everyone worrying about where he is going when we don't even know if he can recruit to UNT. If he can't recruit to UNT, he can't win at UNT. Pretty simple.

The cart is 5 miles ahead of the horse in this thread.

PlummMeanGreen · December 29, 2016

1 minute ago, UNT90 said:

Everyone worrying about where he is going when we don't even know if he can recruit to UNT. If he can't recruit to UNT, he can't win at UNT. Pretty simple.

The cart is 5 miles ahead of the horse in this thread.

Haven't we seen this "Oh God we're going to lose our coach" theme just a few times, UNT90??

When I was much younger I was probably just as guilty!?

Best part of this is many give a damn to care.

untjim1995 · December 29, 2016

If you've been a UNT fan in the last 40 years, you've seen Fry and Moore get bought away, then have seen or heard whispers about coaches like Simon, Dickey, Dodge, and McCarney having any sustained success here against people that the college football world cares about leading to new jobs up the totem pole, like Johnny Jones did.

And then the success never happened. Until or unless recruiting can pick up here, Littrell will be no different. If he can do it, and the wins follow like it should, then he will have his choices of jobs at the P5 level. If not, and we have no idea if it can be done here with him or anyone else, quite frankly, then he will be a coordinator or position coach somewhere else. It always amazes me on here just how much people think we should be able to get great talent here because of our location and Texas HS football being a hotbed, yada, yada, yada...until it's done here, we are still going to be looking up at the other schools we want to be associated with athletically.

PlummMeanGreen · December 29, 2016

33 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

If you've been a UNT fan in the last 40 years, you've seen Fry and Moore get bought away, then have seen or heard whispers about coaches like Simon, Dickey, Dodge, and McCarney having any sustained success here against people that the college football world cares about leading to new jobs up the totem pole, like Johnny Jones did.

And then the success never happened. Until or unless recruiting can pick up here, Littrell will be no different. If he can do it, and the wins follow like it should, then he will have his choices of jobs at the P5 level. If not, and we have no idea if it can be done here with him or anyone else, quite frankly, then he will be a coordinator or position coach somewhere else. It always amazes me on here just how much people think we should be able to get great talent here because of our location and Texas HS football being a hotbed, yada, yada, yada...until it's done here, we are still going to be looking up at the other schools we want to be associated with athletically.

Couldn't have said it any better & had I tried it would have been much longer.?

We're all hoping Seth Littrell breaks this long cycle.

GMG!

Edited December 29, 2016 by PlummMeanGreen

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

4 hours ago, untjim1995 said:

If you've been a UNT fan in the last 40 years, you've seen Fry and Moore get bought away, then have seen or heard whispers about coaches like Simon, Dickey, Dodge, and McCarney having any sustained success here against people that the college football world cares about leading to new jobs up the totem pole, like Johnny Jones did.

And then the success never happened. Until or unless recruiting can pick up here, Littrell will be no different. If he can do it, and the wins follow like it should, then he will have his choices of jobs at the P5 level. If not, and we have no idea if it can be done here with him or anyone else, quite frankly, then he will be a coordinator or position coach somewhere else. It always amazes me on here just how much people think we should be able to get great talent here because of our location and Texas HS football being a hotbed, yada, yada, yada...until it's done here, we are still going to be looking up at the other schools we want to be associated with athletically.

The problem isn't UNT, the problem has been who has been hired to recruit to UNT.

Hopefully that changed with Littrell. We shall see.

Harry · December 29, 2016

We had Wren Baker on the show tonight and he shared some of his philosophies on recruiting if you are interested:

http://gomeangreenbarbershop.libsyn.com/podcast/barbershop-podcast-176

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

33 minutes ago, Harry said:

We had Wren Baker on the show tonight and he shared some of his philosophies on recruiting if you are interested:

http://gomeangreenbarbershop.libsyn.com/podcast/barbershop-podcast-176

That's what people say when they have a low rated class. Coachspeak at its finest.

Ryan Munthe · December 29, 2016

I still refuse to believe that recruiting rankings are the be all end all. Our issues in Mac's final year were things behind the scenes. Littrell took one of the worst ranked recruiting classes and nearly beat one of the better G5 teams in a mid-tier bowl game. My two cents. If you get players who fit your system and you're a good enough coach, you overcome recruiting flaws. Much like if you're a bad coach but a good recruiter you don't magically win games (UT, for example.)

Army of Dad · December 29, 2016

7 minutes ago, Ryan Munthe said:

I still refuse to believe that recruiting rankings are the be all end all. Our issues in Mac's final year were things behind the scenes. Littrell took one of the worst ranked recruiting classes and nearly beat one of the better G5 teams in a mid-tier bowl game. My two cents. If you get players who fit your system and you're a good enough coach, you overcome recruiting flaws. Much like if you're a bad coach but a good recruiter you don't magically win games (UT, for example.)

Army is not one of the "better G5 teams".

Ryan Munthe · December 29, 2016

20 minutes ago, Army of Dad said:

Army is not one of the "better G5 teams".

This year they absolutely were

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

34 minutes ago, Ryan Munthe said:

I still refuse to believe that recruiting rankings are the be all end all. Our issues in Mac's final year were things behind the scenes. Littrell took one of the worst ranked recruiting classes and nearly beat one of the better G5 teams in a mid-tier bowl game. My two cents. If you get players who fit your system and you're a good enough coach, you overcome recruiting flaws. Much like if you're a bad coach but a good recruiter you don't magically win games (UT, for example.)

Army wasn't "one of the better G5 teams." They were an average G5 team, as their 7-6 pre-bowl record indicated.

Mac was ABSOLUTELY about recruiting. Don't you recall the multiple warnings from BillySee?

Look bo further than Western Michigan, who had the 3 highest rated classes in their conference the last three years and are 12-0 and playing in the Cotton Bowl.

It amazes me how people in this fan base will change facts and history to put a better face on this program.

Its like they never learn.

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

11 minutes ago, Ryan Munthe said:

This year they absolutely were

You know, repeating it endlessly doesn't make it so. lol. Very millennial of you, though.

Sagrin has Army rated #90

GreenMachine · December 29, 2016

13 minutes ago, UNT90 said:

You know, repeating it endlessly doesn't make it so. lol. Very millennial of you, though.

Sagrin has Army rated #90

Yes, repeating something ENDLESSLY, doesn't necessarily make it true.

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

2 minutes ago, GreenMachine said:

Yes, repeating something ENDLESSLY, doesn't necessarily make it true.

Well, hello sweetheart.

Actually, it can. I mean I repeated endlessly how RV sucked and should be fired... And then he was... So...

Edited December 29, 2016 by UNT90

GreenMachine · December 29, 2016

Just now, UNT90 said:

Well, hello sweetheart.

It's over, move on.

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

1 minute ago, GreenMachine said:

It's over, move on.

Good advice. Try following it.

GreenMachine · December 29, 2016

8 minutes ago, UNT90 said:

Good advice. Try following it.

K

UNTLifer · December 29, 2016

1 hour ago, UNT90 said:

It amazes me how people in this fan base will change facts and history to put a better face on this program.

Its like they never learn.

1 hour ago, UNT90 said:

Very millennial of you, though.

1 hour ago, UNT90 said:

Well, hello sweetheart.

And you get upset over perceived name calling.

Some people choose to look at a glass as half full, some choose to look at a glass as half empty.

UNT90 · December 29, 2016

3 hours ago, UNTLifer said:

And you get upset over perceived name calling.

Some people choose to look at a glass as half full, some choose to look at a glass as half empty.

I don't think you get what name calling is.

At all.

UTSA Fan · December 29, 2016

5 hours ago, Ryan Munthe said:

I still refuse to believe that recruiting rankings are the be all end all. Our issues in Mac's final year were things behind the scenes. Littrell took one of the worst ranked recruiting classes and nearly beat one of the better G5 teams in a mid-tier bowl game. My two cents. If you get players who fit your system and you're a good enough coach, you overcome recruiting flaws. Much like if you're a bad coach but a good recruiter you don't magically win games (UT, for example.)

You might loose games with good players, but you don't win games with bad ones. Bigger, stronger and faster trumps slower, shorter and weaker regardless of the system.

greenminer · December 29, 2016

5 hours ago, Ryan Munthe said:

I still refuse to believe that recruiting rankings are the be all end all. Our issues in Mac's final year were things behind the scenes. Littrell took one of the worst ranked recruiting classes and nearly beat one of the better G5 teams in a mid-tier bowl game. My two cents. If you get players who fit your system and you're a good enough coach, you overcome recruiting flaws. Much like if you're a bad coach but a good recruiter you don't magically win games (UT, for example.)

There is no end-all-be-all factor. I don't think I've read anyone say that. People are trying to explain that having higher ranked recruits lends itself to a better chance to win.

Army is a quality bowl team, but I would not qualify them as a top G5 team.

BeatNavy · December 30, 2016

I'd say that on our best Saturdays, Army was on par with better G5 teams: Road win at Temple, road win at Wake Forest, 66 points on the road at UTEP (yes, it was UTEP, but no one else scored 66 on them this year).

On our worst Saturdays, we were far from that: loss at Buffalo, 7 turnovers in regular season vs you guys, loss to Notre Dame.

If you think Navy was among the best G5 teams this year, consider that we beat Temple on the road while Navy lost to them at home (note that Navy was already down 21-0 before QB was injured). Then consider that Navy beat ND and we got demolished by ND.

And of course our special teams were far from a strength, especially after we lost starting kicker on opening KO at Buffalo.

Edited December 30, 2016 by BeatNavy

Ryan Munthe · December 30, 2016

7 hours ago, UNT90 said:

You know, repeating it endlessly doesn't make it so. lol. Very millennial of you, though.

Sagrin has Army rated #90

And just because you repeat the same thing doesn't make it true, either.

FirefightnRick · December 30, 2016

1 hour ago, BeatNavy said:

I'd say that on our best Saturdays, Army was on par with better G5 teams: Road win at Temple, road win at Wake Forest, 66 points on the road at UTEP (yes, it was UTEP, but no one else scored 66 on them this year).

On our worst Saturdays, we were far from that: loss at Buffalo, 7 turnovers in regular season vs you guys, loss to Notre Dame.

If you think Navy was among the best G5 teams this year, consider that we beat Temple on the road while Navy lost to them at home (note that Navy was already down 21-0 before QB was injured). Then consider that Navy beat ND and we got demolished by ND.

And of course our special teams were far from a strength, especially after we lost starting kicker on opening KO at Buffalo.

Yeah, I don't get it either. On Dec 3rd Temple and Navy were ranked in the top 25 and Army beat both?

Rick