Bowl and APR Situation

[FirefightnRick]

6 hours ago, Cerebus said:

It is,  but being in a bowl game is one more thing to sell to a recruit.  SL walking into someones living room and telling them he took a 1-11 team to a bowl game in one year is a great selling point.  

Even if some of the shine is knocked off if we have less than 6 wins, the PARENTS will really like that we got in via an academics waiver.  

 

I can agree with some of this, but the quiet period is for contact purposes...not research on recruits.  Our staff can utilize the time to narrow their targets.  They won't let this period go to waste.  

And counter to the arguement that we could sell  recruits about attending a bowl game in a one year turnaround would be the chance that we go bowling at 5-7 and get our asses WKY'd on TV. 

Id rather us be 5-7, spend the quiet time researching our recruit targets and not get WKY'd on TV and still be able to sell recruits that we were a game away from going 1-11 to bowl eligible in a single season turnaround.

 

Rick

Edited November 15, 2016 by FirefightnRick

[shaft]

I like how Rick keeps making weaker and weaker arguments...more time to research recruits.  Next thing you know he'll be trying to sell us on "stealth recruiting."

Bowl game > staying home

 

 

[BTG_Fan1]

On 11/14/2016 at 11:21 AM, MeanGreenMailbox said:

Agree!

Hey, Nebraska - NEBRASKA...stacks of national titles and Heisman winners and all - accepted a bowl invitation last season after finishing 5-7:  http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/active/n/nebraska/2015-2019_yearly_results.php

So, if a "traditional power" school does it, give me a good reason as to why we should not do it.

Any bowl game means extra practice time for the coaches and players.  You think the coaches, constantly under NCAA scrutiny for practice time, don't value the opportunity to get more practices in?  They absolutely do, and we'd be nuts not to accept a bowl invite at 5-7.

To me, it's a reward to players, and unseen academic staff as well, for taking care of business off the field.  These are student-athletes after all...remember?

Yes the extra practice time is great, it helps us present something to the recuits that we can turn it around.. Also, no matter what the result is... We can chalk it up to making a bowl game and chipping in some money into the C-USA pot... Also, just playing in another bowl game will add to our very weak resume when it comes to conference expansion in the coming years... Also, we saw what EK and Reff could do with 2 weeks to prep for Army, would be interesting to see them prepping the defense for someone with possibly 3 weeks..

On 11/14/2016 at 5:47 PM, FirefightnRick said:

.....or the additional recruiting time.

 

Rick

People have already brought up the quiet period, as no recruiting will be done, but we have already filled a descent chunk of this class with the 11 current verbals and more in the future.. Playing in a bowl game will help us get those kids that get snubbed by other schools, and could even help with Dec. Grads and Transfers as well.. 

 

But another thing for us to think about, if Morris could get rolling, it could be very interesting bowl game. 

[FirefightnRick]

28 minutes ago, shaft said:

I like how Rick keeps making weaker and weaker arguments...more time to research recruits.  Next thing you know he'll be trying to sell us on "stealth recruiting."

Bowl game > staying home

 

 

Nah, you just like you some me.  

I'm not offering up a weak or strong arguement, just an opinion.

The dead period starts December 14th.  

Midterm JUCO signing is two days later.

The first 5 bowl games start the day after that. 

2 of the bowls we have seen us projected for are 7 and 11 days after that.

So if we were to say...get an invite to the Bahamas Bowl on the 23rd we would get an additional 27 days practice but forfiet 17 and 20 days of concentrated time recruiting high school and JUCO kids getting ready for it.

If we were to say get an invite to a game on the 17th we'll get 20 additional days of practice, and I have no idea if we're in line for any of those.

If we're 6-6, yeah, it's worth it and if we get killed, that's ok.  We at least met the minimum that everyone else expects us to meet to get eligible and earn the invite.

But if we're 5-7 and get killed, we'll be scoffed at like everyone does when those random 2-8 and 3-7 high school teams make the playoffs.

I would just prefer us use the additional 17 days recruiting HS kids and 20 days recruiting JUCO's than spend that time bowling on a 7 loss season.

 

Rick

 

 

 

[BTG_Fan1]

I think the staff would be able to recruit and prep these guys for a bowl game.. I also think kids would understand with a bowl game coming up as well

[Army of Dad]

7 hours ago, BTG_Fan1 said:

Yes the extra practice time is great, it helps us present something to the recuits that we can turn it around.. Also, no matter what the result is... We can chalk it up to making a bowl game and chipping in some money into the C-USA pot... Also, just playing in another bowl game will add to our very weak resume when it comes to conference expansion in the coming years... Also, we saw what EK and Reff could do with 2 weeks to prep for Army, would be interesting to see them prepping the defense for someone with possibly 3 weeks..

People have already brought up the quiet period, as no recruiting will be done, but we have already filled a descent chunk of this class with the 11 current verbals and more in the future.. Playing in a bowl game will help us get those kids that get snubbed by other schools, and could even help with Dec. Grads and Transfers as well.. 

 

But another thing for us to think about, if Morris could get rolling, it could be very interesting bowl game. 

Quiet doesn't mean "no recruiting".

http://www.ncaa.org/student-athletes/resources/recruiting-calendars

[DeepGreen]

Possible bowl game courtesy of our APR ranking?  Seriously, has anything ever gone our way?

[BTG_Fan1]

3 hours ago, DeepGreen said:

Possible bowl game courtesy of our APR ranking?  Seriously, has anything ever gone our way?

After the blow out by Portland State, we got rid of Mac...

which lead to SL and the eventual stepping down of RV, thus bringing us WB... I think those have gone our way.

[97and03]

Going to a bowl at 5-7 is a little embassing - unless you were 1-11 the year before. Then it shows you are turning around a program. 

[Cerebus]

On 11/14/2016 at 11:15 AM, Cerebus said:

1. Duke - 995
2. Northwestern - 992
3. Vanderbilt - 990
4. Army - 989
5. North Texas - 984

 

1. Duke @ Pitt: Will be on WatchESPN at 2:00.  Pitt is slightly over a TD favorite (-7.5)
2. Northwestern @ Minn: On BTN at 2:30.  Minn is the favorite (-4).
3. Vanderbilt vs Ole Miss: On SEC Network at 7:00 PM.  Ole Miss is a (-10) fave.
4. Morgan State @ Army: On CBSSN at 11:00.  No line as they are playing an FCS.  This will most likely be Army's second FCS win of the year.  

Interesting:

• UTEP @ Rice will be on at 11AM on ESPN3.  
• UTEP has a APR only about 10 points worse than us.
• If UTEP can pull the slight upset (Rice -1.5), then they have a very good chance getting into a bowl with an APR exception if they beat us for their 5th win.
• We might head into El Paso against a very motivated Miner team, and if we lose to USM then only the winner will have a shot at an APR bowl.
• In other worse, pull for Rice.

 

[GMG_Dallas]

One of the other big wins related to making a bowl win thanks to our APR is what it means to our seniors. They stuck through some bad seasons and a coaching change, including an interim HC last year, but despite all of that, they still had to focus on school. Would be a great reward for our seniors for sticking through it even though they could have easily given up and left. A true reward for their 4 (or 5) years of hard work in the classroom and it would set a great example for the young guys to focus on their studies if their goal is to play in bowl games.

[THOR]

On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 11:54 AM, Cerebus said:

You can take Army out.  Commandant has already said they won't count either of their two FCS wins.

So even if they beat Navy they will only consider it their 4th FBS win. No bowl for them.

 

Where did you see this?

[Cerebus]

16 hours ago, THOR said:

Where did you see this?

On the Army forums they were talking about the commandant's decision, which they had seen via email.  

[UNT 90 Grad]

15 hours ago, Cerebus said:

On the Army forums they were talking about the commandant's decision, which they had seen via email.  

Hmmm. 

PRESSURE TIME: The Black Knights need a win to remain in the bowl discussion. Army's victory over FCS foe Lafayette a month ago does not count toward bowl eligibility victories. Just like a year ago, some of the 80 bowl slots available likely will be filled with five-win teams. Those teams are selected according to their latest Academic Progress Rate, and Army sits fourth on that list, behind Duke, Northwestern, and Vanderbilt. A year ago, three five-win teams played in a bowl game.

https://www.armytimes.com/articles/army-staring-at-a-rare-opportunity-securing-a-bowl-bid

[Cerebus]

• UTEP loses to Rice, their bowl hopes are over. 
• Duke is down 14-7 early.
• Vanderbilt kick had been moved to 7PM.
• Northwestern is down a TD early.

Win today and an APR bowl is a real possibility.  Win today and @UTEP and we're in a bowl for sure.  

 

[Cerebus]

10 hours ago, UNT 90 Grad said:

Hmmm. 

At this point I no longer know what to believe.  There is a lot of confusion because of how late in the year the Navy game is, it's less than one week from the first bowl game this year.  In the past when Army had a contracted bowl tie in, they had to hit bowl eligibility before that game.  That is not the case this year.

There was also some confusion because Lafayette has so few scholarships that by NCAA rules they would not count as the sole FCS win towards bowl eligibility, but Morgan State does.  

Finally, on the Army forum they said the Commandant had ruled they would not accept a bowl game unless they reach five FBS wins, and they currently only have 4 right now.  However they are now saying that they are bowl eligible on the same board.

My guess is that right now per NCAA rules they are in fact bowl eligible for the APR exemption, but that it is up the the Commandant as to whether they want to take it or not.   I am absolutely sure the players, coaches and fans want it to happen.  

 

---

 

• At half Duke is down 14-28, next game is Miami.
• End of one NW is down 6. Next game is Ill.

 

[Cerebus]

Brett Vito has the correct info on Army's APR situation and he'll report on it later.

[Cerebus]

Duke loses big.

NW trails by 9 going into the 4th.

[JesseMartin]

On 11/17/2016 at 10:08 AM, Cerebus said:

1. Duke @ Pitt: Will be on WatchESPN at 2:00.  Pitt is slightly over a TD favorite (-7.5)
2. Northwestern @ Minn: On BTN at 2:30.  Minn is the favorite (-4).
3. Vanderbilt vs Ole Miss: On SEC Network at 7:00 PM.  Ole Miss is a (-10) fave.
4. Morgan State @ Army: On CBSSN at 11:00.  No line as they are playing an FCS.  This will most likely be Army's second FCS win of the year.  

 

So Duke has one more shot...and I'm assuming even though NW has 5 wins, you're focusing still on the fact that even though they can already get in on APR, that one more win would remove them from the list and we would move up a spot, right?

[FirefightnRick]

What's the Longhorns APR?  LOL

 

 

Rick

[NorthTexan95]

On 11/17/2016 at 0:08 PM, Cerebus said:

1. Duke @ Pitt: Will be on WatchESPN at 2:00.  Pitt is slightly over a TD favorite (-7.5)
2. Northwestern @ Minn: On BTN at 2:30.  Minn is the favorite (-4).
3. Vanderbilt vs Ole Miss: On SEC Network at 7:00 PM.  Ole Miss is a (-10) fave.
4. Morgan State @ Army: On CBSSN at 11:00.  No line as they are playing an FCS.  This will most likely be Army's second FCS win of the year.  

Interesting:

• UTEP @ Rice will be on at 11AM on ESPN3.  
• UTEP has a APR only about 10 points worse than us.
• If UTEP can pull the slight upset (Rice -1.5), then they have a very good chance getting into a bowl with an APR exception if they beat us for their 5th win.
• We might head into El Paso against a very motivated Miner team, and if we lose to USM then only the winner will have a shot at an APR bowl.
• In other worse, pull for Rice.

 

Duke lost ... Northwestern lost ... Vandy playing Ole Miss tight, Up 4 in second quarter ... Army won big ... UTEP lost.  

Duke:  4-7 plays at Miami next Saturday

Northwestern: 5-6 plays Illinois next week

Vandy 4-6 currently playing Ole Miss, plays Tennessee next week

Edited November 20, 2016 by NorthTexan95

[TreeFiddy]

On 11/15/2016 at 9:22 PM, shaft said:

I like how Rick keeps making weaker and weaker arguments...more time to research recruits.  Next thing you know he'll be trying to sell us on "stealth recruiting."

Bowl game > staying home

 

 

And it's not even close.  

Nobody in their right mind turns down a bowl game unless you are one of the blue bloods in college football and they are snubbing their nose at a bowl because it is 'beneath' them.  At this point in time there are no bowl games that are beneath us.  Beat UTEP.

[Mean Green Matt]

So I did this very quickly, so it could be wrong, but assuming Army IS eligible, there are 64 bowl eligible teams right now with 14 more teams capable of getting eligible for a total of 78. If Army is eligible, that would put us #4 on the APR list for a spot behind Duke, Northwestern and Vanderbilt. Duke and Vandy still need a 5th win. With 80 spots available it isn't looking too bad. If we beat UTEP I think we are guaranteed a spot. 

[Cerebus]

First things first.  If NT wins next week we go bowling.  

CUSA has six bowl slots.  LaTech, WKU, MTSU and ODU are bowl eligible now.  UTSA, USM and North Texas each have five wins and become bowl eligible the old fashioned way next week.  If all three were to win we would still get a bowl because there will be less than 80 teams with six wins.  One of the trio would need to play in a non CUSA bowl.

I think at this point NT (@UTEP) and UTSA (vs Char) have to be favored to win, but USM players LaTech.   

However, if we lose to UTEP this is the APR outlook:

1. Duke: 4-7, last game against Miami. 
2. Northwestern: 5-6, last game against Illinois.
3. Vanderbilt: 5-6*, last game against Tenn.
4. Army: 6-5*, last game against Navy.
5. North Texas: 5-6, Last game against UTEP.

APR ELIGIBLE TEAMS ARE BOLDED.

• I should wait until tomorrow when all the scores are final, but as of right now (10:30PM) there are 64 eligible teams for 80 slots.  
• *Army IS APR bowl eligible, their Lafayette win did not count towards 5 but the FCS win today did,  and as Vito reported they will take an APR exception.
• *Vandy is up by 21 going into the 4th, going to go ahead and count this as a major upset now.  
• The schools that are above us with 5 wins right now, will stake up a bowl slot if they get to 6 wins.  With 5 wins they take an APR slot instead of us, with 6 wins they take a slot as a regular bowl team and there is on less APR slot.
•  If we want to be assured that we go to a bowl game, we need to beat UTEP.
• If we lose to UTEP we will need Duke to loss against Miami, and that the five win teams behind us in APR (SMU, NCST, BC, TCU, UT, Indiana, MD, UTSA, Akron, Colo St, ASU, Ole Miss, USA) do not win.  
• All 13 teams can not win, UT and TCU play each other.  
• If all the other teams win out (USA has two left, just has to win one of two) then the number of bowl eligible teams (not counting us if we win @UTEP) is 76.
• There looks like there will be at least 4 open bowl slots.
• Root for Miami.  

 

12 minutes ago, Mean Green Matt said:

So I did this very quickly, so it could be wrong, but assuming Army IS eligible, there are 64 bowl eligible teams right now with 14 more teams capable of getting eligible for a total of 78. If Army is eligible, that would put us #4 on the APR list for a spot behind Duke, Northwestern and Vanderbilt. Duke and Vandy still need a 5th win. With 80 spots available it isn't looking too bad. If we beat UTEP I think we are guaranteed a spot. 

• There are 64 6 win teams, but don't count Army as one of them.  
• Army us a five win team in effect, Lafayette doesn't have enough scholarships to count towards the FCS win, consider them a 5 win APR eligible team right now, not a 6 win regular bowl eligible team.  
• We are #5 in the APR right now.  

[Cerebus]

___

Late game update.

• CoSt is winning big at half, looks like they will get their 6th win.
• UCLA is hanging with USC.  If they can pull it out and win their last game at Cal they will get to six.

 

I'll update the bowl outlook tomorrow when all scores are final.