The Late Late Postgame Observations

Caw Caw · October 9, 2016

1. We've moved from beating teams we should to beating teams we "shouldn't" very quickly. The one beautiful team about the staff, and I'm tempering my expectations, is that the team gets better every week. We can't control who we play this year it's been slated but we seem to make noticeable strides in a variety of areas.

2. Mason Fine is good. He's got a lot of room to grow, but I noticed one or two errant throws a game. For someone facing the kind of pressure and beatings he's received he is one composed SOB. He makes good decisions and when he has any time at all seems to deliver a good ball. And as far as sliding, he's getting hit 10 times a game, let him deliver a couple (or try).

3. Jordan Murray is one big... Can't teach 6"9 360 lbs can ya?

4. Maybe it's getting older, but the student section has decided creativity in their verbal assaults is second to the vulgarity. I love harassing the the sideline players, but man, it's getting crass on that side, and repetitive. Seriously, put some effort in. Biggest gripe is that the jeering doesn't stop for visiting injured players.

5. Reading fan boards of Marshall postgame people don't take us seriously. And our team doesn't get any better their team is just a worse dumpster fire. By all means, keep underestimating the development and progress here. More opponents to surprise and more tears to bath in.

6. I'm glad Keena had the cajones to stick up for himself on their sideline. Can't believe that was something he just decided to do on his own. No guts no glory I suppose. No one likes being punked by a specialist, student side loved it. There was a noticeable energy difference for the rest of the game.

7. Officiating was bad. No call from the second roughing the kicker. The BS hit to the head. The sideline fiasco to name a few. There calls were bad so no one had any faith in the built in "justice system". Of course we are going to boo officials anyway but all that was way out of hand. I've been too a lot of UNT games and that may have been the worst i've ever seen live.

El Paso Eagle · October 9, 2016

Officiating was really bad last night. Could not understand how they were so far off.

Any injuries from the game?

Eppie96 · October 9, 2016

Great win last night. Very happy about our progress each week. Trying to temper by enthusiasm and tap the brakes a bit. We still haven't beat anyone this season who has a winning record. I am hoping that will change in two week when we visit Army.

Fine had 2-3 balls last night that should have been intercepted.

TIgreen01 · October 9, 2016

Agree that booing officials is not usually the way to represent, but man those guys sucked last night. The no call on the second running into the kicker was ridiculous-and the head umpire was looking directly at it. He made a decision to not award the penalty.

This is the second week in a row that the officials haven't been good, so probably a little bit of the booing was residual left over from last week.

Cerebus · October 9, 2016

3 hours ago, Eppie96 said:

Trying to temper by enthusiasm and tap the brakes a bit. We still haven't beat anyone this season who has a winning record.

Winning record? We haven't beat anyone who has beat another FBS team. Rice and Marshall are 0-9 against FBS teams.

Caw Caw · October 9, 2016

2 hours ago, TIgreen01 said:

Agree that booing officials is not usually the way to represent, but man those guys sucked last night. The no call on the second running into the kicker was ridiculous-and the head umpire was looking directly at it. He made a decision to not award the penalty.

This is the second week in a row that the officials haven't been good, so probably a little bit of the booing was residual left over from last week.

Oh, i have no problems with the booing of officials. It's standard practice, especially when it's as bad as it has been. It's more the booing of injured opposing players and hearing words like p**** constantly with like children in my section.

oldguystudent · October 9, 2016

We understandably got the referee shaft our last year in the SunBelt. Karl Benson was once again a jilted would be lover of UNT, and he let us have it.

In CUSA, I have to try to temper my homer bias and decide if the officiating is really as bad as I think it is. Last night had me convinced that somebody must've driven out to the CUSA headquarters and pissed on the carpet in the lobby. They were egregiously awful last night.

Ben Gooding · October 9, 2016

10 hours ago, Caw Caw said:

1. We've moved from beating teams we should to beating teams we "shouldn't" very quickly. The one beautiful team about the staff, and I'm tempering my expectations, is that the team gets better every week. We can't control who we play this year it's been slated but we seem to make noticeable strides in a variety of areas.

2. Mason Fine is good. He's got a lot of room to grow, but I noticed one or two errant throws a game. For someone facing the kind of pressure and beatings he's received he is one composed SOB. He makes good decisions and when he has any time at all seems to deliver a good ball. And as far as sliding, he's getting hit 10 times a game, let him deliver a couple (or try).

3. Jordan Murray is one big... Can't teach 6"9 360 lbs can ya?

4. Maybe it's getting older, but the student section has decided creativity in their verbal assaults is second to the vulgarity. I love harassing the the sideline players, but man, it's getting crass on that side, and repetitive. Seriously, put some effort in. Biggest gripe is that the jeering doesn't stop for visiting injured players.

5. Reading fan boards of Marshall postgame people don't take us seriously. And our team doesn't get any better their team is just a worse dumpster fire. By all means, keep underestimating the development and progress here. More opponents to surprise and more tears to bath in.

6. I'm glad Keena had the cajones to stick up for himself on their sideline. Can't believe that was something he just decided to do on his own. No guts no glory I suppose. No one likes being punked by a specialist, student side loved it. There was a noticeable energy difference for the rest of the game.

7. Officiating was bad. No call from the second roughing the kicker. The BS hit to the head. The sideline fiasco to name a few. There calls were bad so no one had any faith in the built in "justice system". Of course we are going to boo officials anyway but all that was way out of hand. I've been too a lot of UNT games and that may have been the worst i've ever seen live.

2. He hangs onto the ball waaaaay too long. His "oh shit" clock is consistently about .05 seconds too long. He HAS to learn to throw the ball away. And he absolutely HAS to quit taking unneeded poundings. But he played a respectable game.

4. The students are there for a reason. If UNT grows into a reputation of having a raunchy and inappropriate student section then so be it. I won't lose sleep over it. Get under their skin by any means necessary and answer questions later if need be.

6. Whether he was coached this or not I don't care. He has the mentality of getting the job done. Hopefully this resonates through the team.

7. Shit show. Horrible for both teams.

Matt from A700 · October 9, 2016

I don't know what is going on in that referee's mind that makes him not call roughing the kicker. That is blatant. And it was 4th and 2 so roughing or running into would have gotten the first down. The BS roughing the passer and then Keena getting the personal foul call were all terrible. I don't know how UNT manages to get terrible refs week in and week out. But I love the decision by Keena. You could notice the difference in the crowd and atmosphere after that first down.

9 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Officiating was really bad last night. Could not understand how they were so far off.

Any injuries from the game?

Wilson left the game late in the fourth quarter but Littrell said he's confident he'll be healthy for Army with the bye week in between.

Got5onIt · October 9, 2016

6 hours ago, Cerebus said:

Winning record? We haven't beat anyone who has beat another FBS team. Rice and Marshall are 0-9 against FBS teams.

*gulp*

Green Mean · October 9, 2016

7 hours ago, Cerebus said:

Winning record? We haven't beat anyone who has beat another FBS team. Rice and Marshall are 0-9 against FBS teams.

DoctorJJ · October 9, 2016

11 hours ago, Eppie96 said:

Great win last night. Very happy about our progress each week. Trying to temper by enthusiasm and tap the brakes a bit. We still haven't beat anyone this season who has a winning record. I am hoping that will change in two week when we visit Army.

Fine had 2-3 balls last night that should have been intercepted.

5 hours ago, Ben Gooding said:

2. He hangs onto the ball waaaaay too long. His "oh shit" clock is consistently about .05 seconds too long. He HAS to learn to throw the ball away. And he absolutely HAS to quit taking unneeded poundings. But he played a respectable game.

4. The students are there for a reason. If UNT grows into a reputation of having a raunchy and inappropriate student section then so be it. I won't lose sleep over it. Get under their skin by any means necessary and answer questions later if need be.

6. Whether he was coached this or not I don't care. He has the mentality of getting the job done. Hopefully this resonates through the team.

7. Shit show. Horrible for both teams.

Almost every game there are 2-3 balls that "should have been intercepted". He has had one INT in 166 attempts. Half way through the season he has 1 INT and they've been slinging it all over the field. If he could somehow continue this pace, and end up with 2 INT for the season, I suppose you'd still gripe.

He "played a respectable game"? Respectable? He completed 64% of his passes, with 1 TD passing and 1 TD running, zero INT's. He was still pressured a LOT. He led this team to a 17 point victory when they were double digits dogs according to Vegas. You can't just "throw the ball away" when the pocket collapses on you. That's intentional grounding.

greenminer · October 10, 2016

1 hour ago, Green Mean said:

We're in a weird place: one part of my brain is in bliss, the other says - rightfully so - to tap the expectation brakes.

Ben Gooding · October 10, 2016

18 minutes ago, DoctorJJ said:

Almost every game there are 2-3 balls that "should have been intercepted". He has had one INT in 166 attempts. Half way through the season he has 1 INT and they've been slinging it all over the field. If he could somehow continue this pace, and end up with 2 INT for the season, I suppose you'd still gripe.

He "played a respectable game"? Respectable? He completed 64% of his passes, with 1 TD passing and 1 TD running, zero INT's. He was still pressured a LOT. He led this team to a 17 point victory when they were double digits dogs according to Vegas. You can't just "throw the ball away" when the pocket collapses on you. That's intentional grounding.

Yes, a respectable game. 206 yards passing is pedestrian. We're not going to beat up on the good teams with 206 passing. It was respectable because he didn't throw a pick, though he did fumble. Fine isn't a burner. He's shifty, at best. When he's improvising outside the pocket (aka running for his life) he needs to "throw the ball away." When he's getting pressured left or right go opposite while keeping eyes down field...nothing there then "throw the ball away." He's limiting his future reps with his risky decision making. There is no excuse other than immaturity at this level for lots of his sacks. Graham Harrell would tell you all the same stuff. Don't believe me, go watch the Rice episide of BTG. You'll hear it from the horses mouth. We can't afford losing 25+ yards a game on sacks. The good teams will put us to bed early.

DoctorJJ · October 10, 2016

6 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

Yes, a respectable game. 206 yards passing is pedestrian. We're not going to beat up on the good teams with 206 passing. It was respectable because he didn't throw a pick, though he did fumble. Fine isn't a burner. He's shifty, at best. When he's improvising outside the pocket (aka running for his life) he needs to "throw the ball away." When he's getting pressured left or right go opposite while keeping eyes down field...nothing there then "throw the ball away." He's limiting his future reps with his risky decision making. There is no excuse other than immaturity at this level for lots of his sacks. Graham Harrell would tell you all the same stuff. Don't believe me, go watch the Rice episide of BTG. You'll hear it from the horses mouth. We can't afford losing 25+ yards a game on sacks. The good teams will put us to bed early.

You don't need to pass for 300 yards when Wilson is running for 188.

Exactly how many times has he taken a sack, when outside the tackle box when he could have throw it away but instead just took a sack. Tell us, please. Exactly how many.

I didn't hear Harrell saying any of that to him last night when I was standing down there. Weird.

greenminer · October 10, 2016

12 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

Yes, a respectable game. 206 yards passing is pedestrian. We're not going to beat up on the good teams with 206 passing. It was respectable because he didn't throw a pick, though he did fumble.

Just my opinion, but if you had a game with 450 yards and asked me if I prefer it be 250+ yards rushing OR 250+ yards passing, I would take the former.

Fine is what we got. We're going to win or lose with him. Not win or lose because of him.

I would also point out that his passing statistics, in terms of YPA and Completion %, have been on a steady climb outside of the FL game. I have to believe that the bad sacks will ~~go away~~ decrease with a better OL and more playmaking around him. They will likely never go away completely because of the nature of his game.

Edited October 10, 2016 by greenminer

Ben Gooding · October 10, 2016

10 minutes ago, DoctorJJ said:

You don't need to pass for 300 yards when Wilson is running for 188.

Exactly how many times has he taken a sack, when outside the tackle box when he could have throw it away but instead just took a sack. Tell us, please. Exactly how many.

I didn't hear Harrell saying any of that to him last night when I was standing down there. Weird.

I'm not asking for dick head responses. I am just telling you what he must work on for this team to improve. His game was respectable. Nothing more. Fine himself would (or at least should) tell you the same. Pocket awareness has to get better for us to go bowling. My eyes are in that prize.

UNTLifer · October 10, 2016

2 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

I'm not asking for dick head responses. I am just telling you what he must work on for this team to improve. His game was respectable. Nothing more. Fine himself would (or at least should) tell you the same. Pocket awareness has to get better for us to go bowling. My eyes are in that prize.

Too busy giving them out?

DoctorJJ · October 10, 2016

10 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

I'm not asking for dick head responses. I am just telling you what he must work on for this team to improve. His game was respectable. Nothing more. Fine himself would (or at least should) tell you the same. Pocket awareness has to get better for us to go bowling. My eyes are in that prize.

If he went 29/30 for 400 yards and 6 TD's, he would say he needed to improve. He will never be satisfied. In fact, he said that himself in the DRC article. I still contend it was better than respectable. He played a good game. Not great. Not John Elway. But not, simply, respectable. It was better than that. I didn't figure you'd actually have a response for how many times he's taken unnecessary sacks.

Edited October 10, 2016 by DoctorJJ

Ben Gooding · October 10, 2016

7 minutes ago, DoctorJJ said:

If he went 29/30 for 400 yards and 6 TD's, he would say he needed to improve. He will never be satisfied. In fact, he said that himself in the DRC article. I still contend it was better than respectable. He played a good game. Not great. Not John Elway. But not, simply, respectable. It was better than that. I didn't figure you'd actually have a response for how many times he's taken unnecessary sacks.

I don't get paid to watch film and walk Fine through film seasion. But they are there. Anyone will tell you that outside of I guess yourself.

11 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

Too busy giving them out?

If you say so.

DoctorJJ · October 10, 2016

1 minute ago, Ben Gooding said:

I don't get paid to watch film and walk Fine through film seasion. But they are there. Anyone will tell you that outside of I guess yourself.

If you say so.

No, not anyone. Judging by the responses on this thread and other comments elsewhere, I'd say the majority fall more in line with my view. Fine played pretty dang good. Could be better, sure, but better than "pedestrian" or "respectable". Especially considering the issues on the O-line and the dropsies by the WR (both of which seem to be improving!!!)

DemolitionDan · October 10, 2016

16 hours ago, Caw Caw said:

7. Officiating was bad. No call from the second roughing the kicker. The BS hit to the head. The sideline fiasco to name a few. There calls were bad so no one had any faith in the built in "justice system". Of course we are going to boo officials anyway but all that was way out of hand. I've been too a lot of UNT games and that may have been the worst i've ever seen live.

I was one of the "out of hand" booers so I have to say something on this...... SERIOUSLY DAWG. It's a football game. If your team scores you cheer like crazy, if your team scores on a huge play you cheer like crazy, even louder, if the other team is on offense, you yell at the top of your lungs, if the refs consistently make awful calls that negatively adversely affect your team you boo them off the field. It blows my mind how people get upset over fandom.

that being said, I do think profanity is unnecessary and should be avoided and respect should be given to injured opponents, but other than that, give em hell.

Edited October 10, 2016 by DemolitionDan

Ben Gooding · October 10, 2016

1 hour ago, DoctorJJ said:

No, not anyone. Judging by the responses on this thread and other comments elsewhere, I'd say the majority fall more in line with my view. Fine played pretty dang good. Could be better, sure, but better than "pedestrian" or "respectable". Especially considering the issues on the O-line and the dropsies by the WR (both of which seem to be improving!!!)

This isn't a bad thing.

1 hour ago, DemolitionDan said:

I was one of the "out of hand" booers so I have to say something on this...... SERIOUSLY DAWG. It's a football game. If your team scores you cheer like crazy, if your team scores on a huge play you cheer like crazy, even louder, if the other team is on offense, you yell at the top of your lungs, if the refs consistently make awful calls that negatively adversely affect your team you boo them off the field. It blows my mind how people get upset over fandom.

that being said, I do think profanity is unnecessary and should be avoided and respect should be given to injured opponents, but other than that, give em hell.

Agreed 100%. I never apologize for my antics for I am a fanatic. Though admittedly I have moved seats when parents bring kids around me and I will probably continue to do so.

TIgreen01 · October 10, 2016

Fine is mine, and everyone's new favorite player. He needs to throw the ball away and stop taking so many big hits or he won't be around long enough to take us to all of the conference championships that we are destined to win with him at the helm.

You are both right. He played a better than pedestrian game, but we're not beating great teams until he learns to get rid of the ball on blown plays. We need that kid alive to see the next down. He's a dang gamer, though...I expect this to be a lesson he learns the hard way.

Caw Caw · October 10, 2016

3 hours ago, DemolitionDan said:

I was one of the "out of hand" booers so I have to say something on this...... SERIOUSLY DAWG. It's a football game. If your team scores you cheer like crazy, if your team scores on a huge play you cheer like crazy, even louder, if the other team is on offense, you yell at the top of your lungs, if the refs consistently make awful calls that negatively adversely affect your team you boo them off the field. It blows my mind how people get upset over fandom.

that being said, I do think profanity is unnecessary and should be avoided and respect should be given to injured opponents, but other than that, give em hell.

I guess I should have clarified in saying I think they they the game get out of hand as far as player interaction. The booing was more than well-deserved. My real issue is with the stuff on the bottom sentence. Again, I am a loud trash talker, probably the loudest in my section. Profanity is a crutch upon which bad trash talk leans. Not that it can't be included, but I just like some style points and creativity. It can be an art if executed correctly.