Players are calling MGC members...

[KRAM1]

Fans at those "big times" pull their donation due to displeasure all the time. 

KRAM, you are a true apologist. 

I see the post hit home for you.  Sure some do, but others step up and fill the void.  That's why they are "big time".  Not so with the so-called fan base at UNT.  Several here seem to be painting themselves into a corner that will be very difficult for them to personally remove themselves from once the situation changes.  I apologize for no one here...my position has been, is now and will be to support the players through my MGC donations.  Ask anyone who knows me well and some who don't and you can be assured that they can repeat that mantra all but word for word.  Been here since Odus Mitchell.  Not going anywhere as there were, are now and always will be student-athletes needing my support.....and your support.  If you would stop seeing it...you and others...as "all about you" you might realize that there is a difference in supporting student-athletes rather than individual staffers, coaches, programs, etc.  But, hang in there...if you haven't painted yourself too far into that corner of yours, the band wagon will pick you back up on its next go-round.  Heck, might even have a tee shirt for you. 

[Green P1]

What position does Tiny Tim play for our football team?  

[Army of Dad]

Says the guy just looking to provide "justification" for folks pulling their support for student-athletes at UNT.  One can frame it any way they like to help them personally feel better about themselves, but any way you slice it, withdrawing support for the Mean Green Club definitely and undeniably hurts student-athletes.  The Mean Green Club supports student scholarships...period.  At other universities, who many tout here as "big time" or programs they wish UNT would emulate, student-athlete scholarship costs are completely covered by donor funds freeing other funds for any number of projects, upgrades, recruiting, coaching salaries, etc., etc. to improve the overall program and to have the resources to stay "big time".  Donors at these programs fund scholarships regardless of who sits in the AD's chair.  Why, because they are "big time" enough to understand the significance of supporting the student in "student-athlete".  The above quoted statement reeks of "small time" thinking, and simply provides another of a long list of excuses for those who claim to support UNT but cannot see past the end of their own nose.

As one player asked me when he noticed I was looking at the GoFundMe banner site on my phone...."Why do they want to shame us like that"?  I had no answer for him on that as he shook his head other than to try to assure him they were not aiming this at the players.  He obviously did not believe that and neither do they believe that withdrawing MGC support is not directed right at them.  They know what is said here and, surprisingly, more often than not who the folks are who say it.  And, they take it very personally.  Perhaps folks forget that these are still very young men who, as yet, may not understand the differences in what motivates people to say and do.  Should they read this site?  Nope.  But, that does not change the fact that they do.  Do all of them?  Probably not.  Do they share the things posted here between themselves?  Yep.

It is just too bad that folks cannot (or choose not to) separate their support for the student-athlete....many still the first in their family to attend college...from their dislike for individuals.  It should be about the student-athlete and UNT.  But, since talking about wanting to be "big time" is so much easier than actually stepping up as a fan to do what one can to help move the program toward "big time" status, folks choose to think and do "small time".  It IS about the student-athlete folks...all about them.....all of them, not just the football and basketball players.  Those toiling away, often under appreciated and playing before small or no crowds at all, need our support through the MGC just as much or more.  Why one would pull support for these young athletes who do nothing but represent this University very well is really a sad thing and will accomplish nothing...nada...zilch...zero toward the "stated goal" of doing so.  It really is counter productive.

I realize this will not be a popular post with some folks...we can guess who they are without much danger of being wrong...and they will record their displeasure accordingly.  But, sometimes looking in the mirror and realizing that ones position is nothing but an excuse is pretty challenging.  When it is all about "if you don't do what I want I will take my ball and go home", well, welcome to the world of "small time" thinking.

I would say their ire should be directed towards the people paid to support them. I understand they aren't likely to do so. Some of that is the team mindset (very understandable) and some of that is youth (also understandable).

Donations go up and down at all schools and it can be very closely linked with winning and sometimes the performance of the department causes donations to go up and down. UNT is no different in this respect. There are people who will donate no matter what, but many others will not take that same path.

Giving more money to an organization that neither values it nor spends it wisely isn't likely to accomplish very much positive change. If the act of giving is what the person wants that's great, and I applaud that wholeheartedly. The product put out by UNT isn't very good, and that will continue to suppress giving and attendance.

Both sides have dug in pretty deep and aren't likely to be easily dislodged. I don't think this department can make any more real progress doing the same thing. I don't think RV is going to learn any new tricks at this point.

I would really prefer both sides tone down the rhetoric. Personal attacks for a differing viewpoint will not help either side, and more importantly, UNT athletics. I'm not looking to provide justification to either side, just calling it like I see it. 

[KRAM1]

I would say their ire should be directed towards the people paid to support them. I understand they aren't likely to do so. Some of that is the team mindset (very understandable) and some of that is youth (also understandable).

Donations go up and down at all schools and it can be very closely linked with winning and sometimes the performance of the department causes donations to go up and down. UNT is no different in this respect. There are people who will donate no matter what, but many others will not take that same path.

Giving more money to an organization that neither values it nor spends it wisely isn't likely to accomplish very much positive change. If the act of giving is what the person wants that's great, and I applaud that wholeheartedly. The product put out by UNT isn't very good, and that will continue to suppress giving and attendance.

Both sides have dug in pretty deep and aren't likely to be easily dislodged. I don't think this department can make any more real progress doing the same thing. I don't think RV is going to learn any new tricks at this point.

I would really prefer both sides tone down the rhetoric. Personal attacks for a differing viewpoint will not help either side, and more importantly, UNT athletics. I'm not looking to provide justification to either side, just calling it like I see it. 

Me to...just calling it like I see it.

Can we stop talking about UNT athletes as if they were children in a Pop Warner league?

The banner is about 14 years of failure under RV. If the athletes can accept that McCarney was fired for his win-loss performance, they should be able to understand why fans want to hold RV accountable for his dismal performance. These are people who understand being judged on your performance. It happens to them every time they take the field. If they don't perform, they can lose their spot on the team.

What you should have told that athlete was that fans are tired of seeing athletes like him come to UNT and experience no success, so we want a new AD who can change that.

I think I told the player exactly what I "should have told" him.  You can tell them whatever you wish the next time you talk with them.  You try to convince them that it isn't about them...maybe they will believe you.  I tried....no luck.  Justify it any way you wish if it makes you feel better.  Who was AD during the New Orleans Bowl run and the recent Heart of Dallas Bowl year?  Who was AD during all those Johnny Jones years folks here like to praise so highly?  Look, knock what you want, but we have had successes along the way as well in football and basketball...not just the so-called "minor sports".  You here under the tenure of Helwig or any other of the AD's prior to RV?  

[rcade]

Who was AD during the New Orleans Bowl run and the recent Heart of Dallas Bowl year?  ... Look, knock what you want, but we have had successes along the way as well in football and basketball...not just the so-called "minor sports".

The New Orleans Bowl victory was 13 years ago, only one year into RV's tenure as AD. He didn't hire that coach. RV inherited that success more than he created it.

We had success under Johnny Jones in basketball, but for five years we haven't had a winning record in our conference and never won our conference tournament. RV's record there is not an argument to keep him in his job.

As for the Heart of Dallas Bowl victory, it wasn't enough to save McCarney's job. How can it be used to save RV's?

For the past 10 years, our football team has won 31.8% of its games -- not counting this season:

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/calc-wp.pl?start=2004&end=2014&rpct=30&min=5&ss=on&se=on&by=Wins

That puts us 111 out of 118 schools.

Why do you want more of the same?

[Ben Gooding]

The New Orleans Bowl victory was 13 years ago, only one year into RV's tenure as AD. He didn't hire that coach. RV inherited that success more than he created it.

We had success under Johnny Jones in basketball, but for five years we haven't had a winning record in our conference and never won our conference tournament. RV's record there is not an argument to keep him in his job.

As for the Heart of Dallas Bowl victory, it wasn't enough to save McCarney's job. How can it be used to save RV's?

For the past 10 years, our football team has won 31.8% of its games -- not counting this season:

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/calc-wp.pl?start=2004&end=2014&rpct=30&min=5&ss=on&se=on&by=Wins

That puts us 111 out of 118 schools.

Why do you want more of the same?

How KRAM justifies ^ is absolutely beyond belief. KRAM, c'mon man. 

[rcade]

Me to...just calling it like I see it.

I think I told the player exactly what I "should have told" him.  You can tell them whatever you wish the next time you talk with them.  You try to convince them that it isn't about them...maybe they will believe you.  I tried....no luck.  Justify it any way you wish if it makes you feel better.

I don't feel bad because a player you talked to is upset. I'll bet he was more personally invested in McCarney keeping his job than RV, but RV wasn't worried about the players having sadfeels when he fired their coach.

The players have bigger things to worry about than the AD's job. They have a few more games left to salvage their season.

[Army of Dad]

How KRAM justifies ^ is absolutely beyond belief. KRAM, c'mon man. 

In my experience he's pretty consistent. He will support and defend anyone while they are at UNT on the basis that he supports UNT at all times.

Other people may disagree with that, but that's the way Kram rolls.

[EagleMBA]

The New Orleans Bowl victory was 13 years ago, only one year into RV's tenure as AD. He didn't hire that coach. RV inherited that success more than he created it.

We had success under Johnny Jones in basketball, but for five years we haven't had a winning record in our conference and never won our conference tournament. RV's record there is not an argument to keep him in his job.

As for the Heart of Dallas Bowl victory, it wasn't enough to save McCarney's job. How can it be used to save RV's?

For the past 10 years, our football team has won 31.8% of its games -- not counting this season:

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/calc-wp.pl?start=2004&end=2014&rpct=30&min=5&ss=on&se=on&by=Wins

That puts us 111 out of 118 schools.

Why do you want more of the same?

Those Southern Miss boys learned one way to do it.

 

[golfingomez]

am i the only who doesn't like these calls? 

Todd Eaglin left me a message and it always just seems so uncomfortable.

[MeanGreenTexan]

am i the only who doesn't like these calls? 

Todd Eaglin left me a message and it always just seems so uncomfortable.

Get them off the script and the nerves go away and it's just a fun chat.  Especially if you know anything about their team.

[Stix]

I have noticed that the frequency of all UNT contacts has increased (perhaps doubled) in the last two weeks, if you include email. Advancement, Alumni Assn., MGC and Merch. sales. Anyone else?

Yes, absolutely.

- I received a mailing offering a UNT pennant if I made a donation of $100 or more (did they hire someone who used to work for NPR?)

- There was a fundraising dinner in Houston for the College of Business (I think specifically for scholarships), which my friend attended.  He was invited to watch the UTSA game from a Suite, and they also extended the offer to me, through him.

- My call was from a member of the softball team.  She thanked me for my contribution and told me that I would be receiving a renewal notice soon; I thanked her for calling, and told her to go win some more.  I know there were no Mean Green Club renewal mailings before the end of the year last year.

Either there's new leadership in the Development (or is it Advancement?) office, or Dr. Smatresk is directly making this happen.

[untjim1995]

The New Orleans Bowl victory was 13 years ago, only one year into RV's tenure as AD. He didn't hire that coach. RV inherited that success more than he created it.

We had success under Johnny Jones in basketball, but for five years we haven't had a winning record in our conference and never won our conference tournament. RV's record there is not an argument to keep him in his job.

As for the Heart of Dallas Bowl victory, it wasn't enough to save McCarney's job. How can it be used to save RV's?

For the past 10 years, our football team has won 31.8% of its games -- not counting this season:

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/calc-wp.pl?start=2004&end=2014&rpct=30&min=5&ss=on&se=on&by=Wins

That puts us 111 out of 118 schools.

Why do you want more of the same?

Good Lord, this is more than embarrassing...of the 8 teams listed below us, we lost to three of them (FIU, Army, and Tulane) in that timeframe. If you weren't a Mean Green fan and you saw this list, the first question you would get is, "Who has been your coach and AD during that timeframe?", most likely followed by "Why are you playing at the FBS level?"

111 out of 118. Thanks BOR and UNT17...

[MGNation92]

To be fair, this is only current MGC members. I've never been once contacted by anybody to ask if I want to donate. 

Edited November 5, 2015 by MGNation92

[KRAM1]

Yes, absolutely.

- I received a mailing offering a UNT pennant if I made a donation of $100 or more (did they hire someone who used to work for NPR?)

- There was a fundraising dinner in Houston for the College of Business (I think specifically for scholarships), which my friend attended.  He was invited to watch the UTSA game from a Suite, and they also extended the offer to me, through him.

- My call was from a member of the softball team.  She thanked me for my contribution and told me that I would be receiving a renewal notice soon; I thanked her for calling, and told her to go win some more.  I know there were no Mean Green Club renewal mailings before the end of the year last year.

Either there's new leadership in the Development (or is it Advancement?) office, or Dr. Smatresk is directly making this happen.

Dr. David Wolf, PhD from UNT by the way, is our new VP for Development.  He has been here about 6 months maybe coming from UCLA.  There is a new attitude along with new leadership within our Advancement division.  Like Dr. Smatresk, Dr. Wolf is the real deal, and will help create a new and dynamic Advancement Division for UNT.  In fact, it has already started.   

And, while everyone may have recently noticed, none of this happened over night.  Lots of planning, lots of coordination.  What you may not have noticed are all the new donor contacts being made by our Advancement Division personnel.  Donations of size are no longer going to be a rare thing or exception at UNT.  Administrators, Deans, Department Heads, Faculty and staff are all now aware that development is part of their job description.  Results are being seen already.

So, yes, there is a new leadership team with new and different priorities in place at UNT.  

Too bad some small minded people have recently decided to withhold support for UNT and its students and student-athletes just at the time new leadership is working so hard to re-invent how things are done at UNT.  Sure, it will take some time and there will be some set backs and mistakes made along the way.  Future change is hard, and even harder at government entities due to certain personnel, legal and other policies.  Government entities are not as nimble as private businesses in initiating culture change...unfortunately.  Some at UNT will embrace this change and prosper in the new environment, others will not and will need to move along and pursue other opportunities.  There will be folks spewing bs because their apple cart has been overturned.  All of which is to be expected in such situations.  But, those unwilling or unable to change will be left out and left behind.  All those who support UNT and see the bigger picture and are looking for UNT to become an even better and more well known institute of higher education should be pleased with the changes, but will need a bit of patience as the changes unfold over a period of time.

[MGNation92]

Dr. David Wolf, PhD from UNT by the way, is our new VP for Development.  He has been here about 6 months maybe coming from UCLA.  There is a new attitude along with new leadership within our Advancement division.  Like Dr. Smatresk, Dr. Wolf is the real deal, and will help create a new and dynamic Advancement Division for UNT.  In fact, it has already started.   

And, while everyone may have recently noticed, none of this happened over night.  Lots of planning, lots of coordination.  What you may not have noticed are all the new donor contacts being made by our Advancement Division personnel.  Donations of size are no longer going to be a rare thing or exception at UNT.  Administrators, Deans, Department Heads, Faculty and staff are all now aware that development is part of their job description.  Results are being seen already.

So, yes, there is a new leadership team with new and different priorities in place at UNT.  

Too bad some small minded people have recently decided to withhold support for UNT and its students and student-athletes just at the time new leadership is working so hard to re-invent how things are done at UNT.  Sure, it will take some time and there will be some set backs and mistakes made along the way.  Future change is hard, and even harder at government entities due to certain personnel, legal and other policies.  Government entities are not as nimble as private businesses in initiating culture change...unfortunately.  Some at UNT will embrace this change and prosper in the new environment, others will not and will need to move along and pursue other opportunities.  There will be folks spewing bs because their apple cart has been overturned.  All of which is to be expected in such situations.  But, those unwilling or unable to change will be left out and left behind.  All those who support UNT and see the bigger picture and are looking for UNT to become an even better and more well known institute of higher education should be pleased with the changes, but will need a bit of patience as the changes unfold over a period of time.

I graduated in August. Have yet to receive an effort towards reaching out to me., and I suspect it's the same for the majority of recent Alumni. I would donate if someone reached out to me, if they were interested in me. But I don't make 7 figures a year so I don't matter right?

There's an average graduation rate of 47%(Approximate) of students at UNT, this means 17,390 students graduate on a yearly basis, the 2015 graduate rate are $25, many of which could give more(I know I could). That comes out to $435K in donations from recent grads alone. But we aren't big money donors so who gives a crap right?

My only complaint is that the AD hasn't reached out to young alumni early and often, and therefore don't generate nearly as much interest. I wonder what our home games would look like if the AD had reached out to everyone that had graduated soon after their graduation dates? 2011 grads would be paying $125 each, and at 17k students that's a cool $2.1 million in donations. Enough to buyout a crappy head coach when we fire him midseason. But nah, it's not 6 figures plus per person. So who cares?

[rcade]

Too bad some small minded people have recently decided to withhold support for UNT and its students and student-athletes just at the time new leadership is working so hard to re-invent how things are done at UNT.

Small minded? It's funny how little needs to happen before you believe good times are ahead. A few school officials offer some organizational platitudes about positive change -- the same kind of platitudes any new official would say in their position -- and you're a true believer on here attacking dissenters.

Let me guess: You're a team player with a can-do attitude. There's no limit to what we can achieve as long as we pull together. We're good enough, we're smart enough, and doggone it, people like us!

There is no new leadership in UNT athletics re-inventing how things are done. There's RV, producing excuses instead of wins. Until that changes, some of us are withholding financial support on the principle that you don't throw good money after bad.

[Mike Jackson]

Fine. All of your points are well taken. However, most fans that were displeased with the results on the field tried to voice their displeasure with the pen and keyboard only to find out that 1. Letters were forwarded to the target of their displeasure without their knowledge. If this was done at the direction of RV then it is at best sad and desperate and at worst underhanded. 2. RV proceeded to publicly disparage those who dared challenge him. When the pen and keyboard are taken away then the next logical tool for the fans, and for any consumer of a product or service, is to speak with their pocketbook(donations, ticket purchases, etc...). It is not taking our ball and going home. It is saying enough is enough. We don't like the product you have produced so it is time for you to go. What would you have us do? Pull back on our donations to other areas of the school? Let's all punish the business school for the failings of the athletic department. How do you think the Texas AD was forced out? $$$$$$$$$$$

I could not have said it better myself.  RV makes 375K to lead the program into being a laughing stock with decent FBS facilities.  It is not just about me, it about every alumni that ever wanted their university get be respected the way that should and be recognizable as a tier 1 university.  That does NOT require you dominate CUSA but it sure hell mean you can be a bottom feeder that powerhouse program schedule interchangeably with FCS school for a push over game.  Pulling money is the only recourse we have at this point.  And arguing over the type of next head coach we should have means very little as long the boss of that new coach will be RV.  

 

[UNT 90 Grad]

I received a call from a young lady from the women's basketball team.  I don't remember her name, but she is sitting out this year because she's a transfer.  I thanked her for the hard work they put in as student athletes.  We chatted some about the new head coach.  I agree with the comment earlier that it's great when you get them off script.  Good times. I received a call from Derek Thompson in a previous year.  Caught me off guard. 

[North Texas Shep]

I got a call from a nice young woman on the cross country team. Regardless, the state of the program, it was nice to get a call. 

[MeanGreenTexan]

I graduated in August. Have yet to receive an effort towards reaching out to me., and I suspect it's the same for the majority of recent Alumni. I would donate if someone reached out to me, if they were interested in me. But I don't make 7 figures a year so I don't matter right?

There's an average graduation rate of 47%(Approximate) of students at UNT, this means 17,390 students graduate on a yearly basis, the 2015 graduate rate are $25, many of which could give more(I know I could). That comes out to $435K in donations from recent grads alone. But we aren't big money donors so who gives a crap right?

My only complaint is that the AD hasn't reached out to young alumni early and often, and therefore don't generate nearly as much interest. I wonder what our home games would look like if the AD had reached out to everyone that had graduated soon after their graduation dates? 2011 grads would be paying $125 each, and at 17k students that's a cool $2.1 million in donations. Enough to buyout a crappy head coach when we fire him midseason. But nah, it's not 6 figures plus per person. So who cares?

While I understand the sentiment, if you are really interested in giving to the University (be it athletics or academics), reach out to them!   Don't wait for someone to call you... you'll be waiting a long time.

[GRN-WHT]

But, those unwilling or unable to change will be left out and left behind.

You described the problems with our athletic department and athletic director perfectly. Couldn't have said it better myself. Welcome to the dark side.

[MGNation92]

While I understand the sentiment, if you are really interested in giving to the University (be it athletics or academics), reach out to them!   Don't wait for someone to call you... you'll be waiting a long time.

I do already donate for academics, but I'm not donating towards athletics until I can see a positive change. For example, some accountability and the occasional hiring of a good coach would help.

[Got5onIt]

am i the only who doesn't like these calls? 

Todd Eaglin left me a message and it always just seems so uncomfortable.

I'm with you. I got my message Wednesday night during my son's football game. Definitely an awkward message. Just send me a thank you letter with a sticker. I can always use more NT stickers. My toolbox needs a few more. 

[KRAM1]

I graduated in August. Have yet to receive an effort towards reaching out to me., and I suspect it's the same for the majority of recent Alumni. I would donate if someone reached out to me, if they were interested in me. But I don't make 7 figures a year so I don't matter right?

There's an average graduation rate of 47%(Approximate) of students at UNT, this means 17,390 students graduate on a yearly basis, the 2015 graduate rate are $25, many of which could give more(I know I could). That comes out to $435K in donations from recent grads alone. But we aren't big money donors so who gives a crap right?

My only complaint is that the AD hasn't reached out to young alumni early and often, and therefore don't generate nearly as much interest. I wonder what our home games would look like if the AD had reached out to everyone that had graduated soon after their graduation dates? 2011 grads would be paying $125 each, and at 17k students that's a cool $2.1 million in donations. Enough to buyout a crappy head coach when we fire him midseason. But nah, it's not 6 figures plus per person. So who cares?

I hear this all the time as a reason for not donating or getting involved.  Seems to be odd to me as one can always, if they are really interested, pick up the phone, go on-line to meangreensports, the Alumni Assoc or Advancement website and start donating.  

I realize lots of folks want to be asked, but, if really interested in paying it forward, why not take the initiative? I know, I know lots here will say "not my job"...OK, fine, but a little initiative is not bad either.  You do realize that the Mean Green Club has a $25 membership level now, right?  That is hardly seven figures.  This, "I am not rich so I don't count" is so much BS and reeks of entitlement and excuse.  Every non-profit will tell you that any amount matters and all donations of any size are needed and are important.  But, you really did already know that, didn't you?  Be honest.  If you do truly want a personal invite, and you just might, PM me with your contact info and I'll give you a call or send you an email ask.  That way you can definitely get on a few folks radar screen for regular asks.

As a counter to your point above...what if a bunch of 2011 grads took a little initiative to show up at games and join the MGC at $25 each?  That way they would be buying a game ticket at some level and making sure all their contact info was up to date with the University in an effort to get info.  What a concept...personal initiative!  I know I know...not your job.

Could there be a bigger effort to gather current contact info by the University?  Good gosh, yes.  I can tell you that a recent IT project to fix a lot of IT and contact type issues has been on-going for a couple of years now.  Things are much better, and getting better, but much remains to be done.  Our grads could help UNT help them by providing updated contact info through the Alumni Association, Mean Green Club or their college.  Question...do you have the same email address you had the day you graduated?  The same phone number?  The same address? Many recent grads do not based on the hundreds of email addresses bounced back to the University, the mounds of returned mail, etc.  No, it isn't exactly a two way street here, but all our grads could help a great deal by updating their contact info...being a member of the Alumni Association and Mean Green Club would definitely solve that issue and no one has to be a six or seven figure donor to join either. This old "it's not my job" and "I am not a big enough donor" excuse stuff really doesn't hold much water.  But, if folks just want to sit back and complain that they are never contacted and use that for their excuse for not donating, well, I really question whether they have any honest intent to donate in the first place.  Again...the opinions expressed here are mine.  Folks are free to hold their own opinions and donate/join or not as they please.