You're the new head coach, what offense and defense do you install?

NTXCoog · October 21, 2015

Tech didn't have several 1,000 rushers, but they had a few that were in the 800's. (Tarean Henderson comes to mind. he had a few seasons over 800 rushing). the WHOLE entire point i am making is that the Oline Baylor is 10 times better than what Tech had. do you even watch football? the offense starts and finishes with the Oline.no, i'm not saying UH had a better Oline in 2007, but they face competition that was much lower than Tech at that time.
to add, Briles has done a much better job on the recruiting front than Leach ever did.
the reason Baylor is number 2 in rushing this year is 1, due to the fact that they really haven't played the meat of there schedule and 2. like i said in the last post, the Oline does wonders for there team. the meat of there schedule is coming up though. i do think they are good enough to run the table in the big 12 seeing that TCU is really the only legitimate threat.
keep in mind those years that Leach was at Tech, he was facing National championship teams such as UT, OU and Nebraska. and throw in some decent ATM teams and Mizzu teams and Kstate (who i would consider more than decent at that time since they won a few big 12 titles). it makes perfect sense why they threw the ball more because they had no other choice. they couldn't compete with those guys. you cannot compare Baylor's no. 2 rushing stats to Tech's from those years.
its a completely different ball game.

leach was a guy that was all about production. he went with what he had at that time. which really wasn't much.

Do I even watch football? I'd bet I've watched more Art Briles games than you since I watched every game he coached at UH for 5 years.

You say he has a top OL now? Do you think he had a top OL in 2008 his first year at Baylor? In that year Baylor was #21 in the nation rushing. Tech was 94th. Baylor was 4-8. Tech was 11-2. I'd guess Tech had a MUCH better line than Baylor that year. But Baylor still averaged 66% more rushing yards per game than Tech. And that was Tech's highest rushing year with it's highest ranking under Leach.

There's an apples to apples to comparison with Briles having a worse line and team with a similar schedule. Briles runs the ball MUCH more than Leach ever has.

Briles coached teams and their rushing offense rank:
2003 - 12th
2004 - 76th (Tech 112th)
2005 - 39th
2006 - 28th
2007 - 10th
2008 - 21st
2009 - 108th (but still ahead of Tech at 115th)
2010 - 24th
2011 - 10th
2012 - 14th
2013 - 13th
2014 - 29th

I don't care whether it's UH or Baylor, with a few exceptions, good or bad teams, he has a very good rushing offense. Leach has NEVER had a very good or great rushing offense even with his best teams. Even Briles' worst rushing years are better than Leach's best rushing offense.

southsideguy · October 21, 2015

offenses that scores a lot of points and big guys block for the little guys.

Defense -one that prevents other's from scoring.

Offense and Defense working together to win games

And be able to recruit like a stripper at Louisville.

meangreen08 · October 21, 2015

Do I even watch football? I'd bet I've watched more Art Briles games than you since I watched every game he coached at UH for 5 years.
You say he has a top OL now? Do you think he had a top OL in 2008 his first year at Baylor? In that year Baylor was #21 in the nation rushing. Tech was 94th. Baylor was 4-8. Tech was 11-2. I'd guess Tech had a MUCH better line than Baylor that year. But Baylor still averaged 66% more rushing yards per game than Tech. And that was Tech's highest rushing year with it's highest ranking under Leach.
There's an apples to apples to comparison with Briles having a worse line and team with a similar schedule. Briles runs the ball MUCH more than Leach ever has.
Briles coached teams and their rushing offense rank:
2003 - 12th
2004 - 76th (Tech 112th)
2005 - 39th
2006 - 28th
2007 - 10th
2008 - 21st
2009 - 108th (but still ahead of Tech at 115th)
2010 - 24th
2011 - 10th
2012 - 14th
2013 - 13th
2014 - 29th
I don't care whether it's UH or Baylor, with a few exceptions, good or bad teams, he has a very good rushing offense. Leach has NEVER had a very good or great rushing offense even with his best teams. Even Briles' worst rushing years are better than Leach's best rushing offense.

. i'm not arguing about whether or not Briles has more rushing yards than leach. Briles obviously runs more. but its because of his amazing Oline he can. its the same play formation, same plays. Briles runs several different draw plays, so did leach. the difference is Briles has had better athletes and way more success at it because of that. briles has just had more success period. in his first year, he really didn't have much of an option at QB. so naturally, he ran more.Now he can run plays in spread and keep defenses honest. as far a Leach, like i already stated, he really didn't have much of an option considering most of the competition he was facing. he did run, just didn't have near the success. which is why he would have to rely on the passing game. Briles having the athletes he does allows him to do more. it doesn't change the fact that they run the formations/plays.

Edited October 21, 2015 by meangreen08

NTXCoog · October 21, 2015

. i'm not arguing about whether or not Briles has more rushing yards than leach. Briles obviously runs more. but its because of his amazing Oline he can. its the same play formation, same plays. Briles runs several different draw plays, so did leach. the difference is Briles has had better athletes and way more success at it because of that. briles has just had more success period. in his first year, he really didn't have much of an option at QB. so naturally, he ran more.Now he can run plays in spread and keep defenses honest. as far a Leach, like i already stated, he really didn't have much of an option considering most of the competition he was facing. he did run, just didn't have near the success. which is why he would have to rely on the passing game. Briles having the athletes he does allows him to do more. it doesn't change the fact that they run the formations/plays.

Numbers don't convince you? I'll go with a better argument. A sample news article, this one from the Eugene Register Guard.

"Briles' last season in the prep ranks was 1999 in Stephenville High School. Kevin Kolb learned the offense that year as a freshman quarterback at Stephenville, and this year he enters his third year running it for Briles as the starter for Houston."
...
"Unlike Oregon, which balances its spread passing game with an option rushing attack out of similar formations, the Cougars occasionally rely on the veer. Invented by legendary Houston coach Bill Yeoman in the '60s and a precursor to the wishbone, the veer gives the Cougars a triple-option rushing game to complement their base spread offense." Keep in mind that Briles played for Yeoman in the '70s.

So to counter your arguments:
1) If Briles runs the same offense as Leach, he was running it at Stephenville prior to coming to Tech since Kolb learned the same offense in high school as used at UH, prior to Briles going to Tech
2) Show me any proof that Leach has ever in his career used any Veer components in his offense.

meangreen08 · October 22, 2015

Numbers don't convince you? I'll go with a better argument. A sample news article, this one from the Eugene Register Guard.

"Briles' last season in the prep ranks was 1999 in Stephenville High School. Kevin Kolb learned the offense that year as a freshman quarterback at Stephenville, and this year he enters his third year running it for Briles as the starter for Houston."
...
"Unlike Oregon, which balances its spread passing game with an option rushing attack out of similar formations, the Cougars occasionally rely on the veer. Invented by legendary Houston coach Bill Yeoman in the '60s and a precursor to the wishbone, the veer gives the Cougars a triple-option rushing game to complement their base spread offense." Keep in mind that Briles played for Yeoman in the '70s.
So to counter your arguments:
1) If Briles runs the same offense as Leach, he was running it at Stephenville prior to coming to Tech since Kolb learned the same offense in high school as used at UH, prior to Briles going to Tech
2) Show me any proof that Leach has ever in his career used any Veer components in his offense.

I agree with the numbers. It's obvious briles has had more success runing. I've already stated that. In this article below from last year, it discusses how he abandoned the option for the spread after being uncesseful at SHS. His runing style is not traditional veer, because it doesn't have to be with an Oline like he has currently. Briles uses the same formations leach did while at tech.

thats the point I was making. Leach didn't have the luxury of running the ball like briles does.

"Briles implemented part of the scheme into his offense in 1989. A year later, it was all spread, all the time."

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/sports/college/iowa-state/football/2014/09/24/art-briles-baylor-iowa-state-cyclones/16144921/

How about this, your right, I'm wrong. At this point I could care less. Have a great night.

NTXCoog · October 22, 2015

I agree with the numbers. It's obvious briles has had more success runing. I've already stated that. In this article below from last year, it discusses how he abandoned the option for the spread after being uncesseful at SHS. His runing style is not traditional veer, because it doesn't have to be with an Oline like he has currently. Briles uses the same formations leach did while at tech.
thats the point I was making. Leach didn't have the luxury of running the ball like briles does.
"Briles implemented part of the scheme into his offense in 1989. A year later, it was all spread, all the time."
http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/sports/college/iowa-state/football/2014/09/24/art-briles-baylor-iowa-state-cyclones/16144921/

How about this, your right, I'm wrong. At this point I could care less. Have a great night.

If you want to say Briles runs a spread offense, I will agree with you 100%. The original disagreement was that he runs Leach's offense. While Leach's Air Raid is a spread offense, not all spread offenses are Air Raid. Briles was running a non-Air Raid spread in high school before he got to Tech as you noted. And he's run a non-Air Raid spread since leaving Tech.

If you want to say Briles' has some Air Raid elements, I'll agree to that too.

But I can't agree that Briles runs the same offense as Leach. There are similar elements, but they are not the same. It's like saying the Wishbone and the Veer are the same. They are both triple option running offenses and have similar concepts and elements, but they are different.

GM1998 · October 22, 2015

Base D - 4-2-5 with heavy blitz packages near or around 35% of the time. Hard press with a lot of 1 deep with a shaded safety towards the LOS and/or wide side of the field. If we're going to get beat deep, we're going to do it hitting the QB in the mouth.
Offense would be based on what I have at my expense. Based on current recruiting trends and recruiting history, I would try to implement some form of option offense. If I couldn't in fact recruit what I wanted/needed I would go full triple option.

Conference wins are the name of game. A system similar to this would make us competitive and get us over the 6 game win hump and hopefully towards a CUSA championship. Got to go with a system that you can recruit to and be successful. Lots of athletic kids in Texas who are told they can't play QB at the P5 schools. Perhaps we could be that destination of such kids in a triple option system. It works for service academies...

I too am a fan of a 4-2-5 or a 4-3, depending on the situation. Personally I would like a defense based on fundamentals like tackling and position responsibilities. Odd concept at UNT.

Think of it like a woman. Dress for the body you have, not the one you want!!!!

If you don't you look silly...

Ben Gooding · October 22, 2015

Conference wins are the name of game. A system similar to this would make us competitive and get us over the 6 game win hump and hopefully towards a CUSA championship. Got to go with a system that you can recruit to and be successful. Lots of athletic kids in Texas who are told they can't play QB at the P5 schools. Perhaps we could be that destination of such kids in a triple option system. It works for service academies...
I too am a fan of a 4-2-5 or a 4-3, depending on the situation. Personally I would like a defense based on fundamentals like tackling and position responsibilities. Odd concept at UNT.
Think of it like a woman. Dress for the body you have, not the one you want!!!!
If you don't you look silly...

Yeah, the triple option makes more and more sense. It would make us highly competitive NEXT year and it's an offense that has very high sustainability as well. It makes recruiting EVERY offensive postion 1/2 as hard. But like I've said, we will never be a G5 power with this system, but we will always be competitive. It's a swap I'm willing risk.

FirefightnRick · October 22, 2015

Conference wins are the name of game. A system similar to this would make us competitive and get us over the 6 game win hump and hopefully towards a CUSA championship. Got to go with a system that you can recruit to and be successful. Lots of athletic kids in Texas who are told they can't play QB at the P5 schools. Perhaps we could be that destination of such kids in a triple option system. It works for service academies...
I too am a fan of a 4-2-5 or a 4-3, depending on the situation. Personally I would like a defense based on fundamentals like tackling and position responsibilities. Odd concept at UNT.
Think of it like a woman. Dress for the body you have, not the one you want!!!!
If you don't you look silly...

Excellent post.

Rick