MGB: Today's DRC editorial on the state of UNT athletics

[Eagle-96]

No, I understand fully what the argument is, and it doesn't hold water.  And, of course, I fully expect a journal called "Sociology of Sports Journal" to gin up the "importance" of college athletics.  I would expect nothing less from them.  How else would they to justify their existence to their small, academically inbred readership?

So, again, fellow North Texas grads...what was it that drew you to beloved UNT when it so clearly did not have the athletic draw everyone says is so necessary to draw in applicants?  Perhaps you were a follower of A-II football at the time, and had an overwhelming yen to see a school win five to seven A-II game a year?  What a choice!

Also, if merely disagreeing with you is "trolling" - then, guilty as charged.  Otherwise, man up, and accept that there is more than one point of view on the academic/athletic issue.
 

I had a few choices to pick from. UNT had a football program that was in the process of moving to D1A. That was a deciding factor for me. I graduated with my BBA and have had a long career in the Finance industry. I was academically inclined yet used a D1 athletic program be a tipping point for me. Said athletic program has provided me with many fond memories that I would not have been able to enjoy had I chosen the other schools of choice.

[greenit]

I turned down MIT in favor of UNT. MIT's football team sucked at the time. 

[Cerebus]

Wow, great editorial. I can't tell by the link - is this by the DRC editorial staff, i.e. a DRC comment or was it by someone writing to the paper? I think it's for former but want to be sure. 

Vito wrote that it is the DRC Editorial Staff.

[Wag Tag]

You don't understand the point of the DRC's comment. It wasn't about putting athletics over academics, it was about using athletics to successfully market the university.

UNT is not Harvard, Yale or MIT, and mentioning them in this context is goofy. UNT is a big state school that has a strong regional presence in one part of Texas. It has impressive academics and programs in some areas, but is always going to need affordability and location as two of its selling points.

When you consider the schools UNT is realistically competing with for the average student, having a good football program can be vital to making them want to be on our campus. It also helps create relationships that make some of them think of UNT when they're successful alumni in their careers and want to take out their checkbook.

I am an alum that graduated in the mid 70's. I came back to the university once I toured the new stadium. Since that visit I am a member of the MGC, a life member of the Alumni Assoc., have seats on the club level and the stands, have donated yearly in the mid 4 figure range to athletics, and also make regular donations to the VETERAN group and UNT. I have also brought back many new alumni.

Never would of happened if we still had the Fouts Field mentality! Sports drives overall donations! To say it doesn't drive enrollment or donations is really stupid! 

[VideoEagle]

Vito wrote that it is the DRC Editorial Staff.

Thanks, missed that. 

Again, WOW. It certainly presents to case for a new AD while still showing there have been significant advances under RV. 

[Cerebus]

Good Lord people stop arguing with TFLF/HFS he is obviously trying to pull this thread offsides.  

Let instead focus on how absolutely stunning it is for the DRC staff to make the decision that this absolutely had to be written, ramifications be damned.  

[rcade]

Come on, man.  I was accepted to Missouri, Oklahoma, North Texas, and a few others, all of whom had higher profile athletic programs than UNT.  I chose North Texas.  Okay?  It's ridiculously funny that graduates of North Texas are buying into this ridiculous argument. 

No one said athletics is the only reason to pick a school.

But when a student is average academically and has a pool of comparable state schools to consider, the on-campus experience is going to be a factor. That is affected by things like the success of the football and basketball teams, the big presence of a Greek system, lots of housing in and near campus and a nightlife district.

I chose UNT because I had an experience at UT-Arlington that made me disgusted with my journalism department. UNT's location was convenient and I liked its journalism department enough to stay in DFW. I also liked that Denton back in the 1980s was a bit of an island outside of DFW. It felt like being in a college town. UTA was a sad commuter school with zero on-campus life that had just killed its football program and made basketball teams play in a theater. UNT felt like a significant step up.

(I was not a good student properly focused on academics. My sons put younger me to shame in that regard today.)

I'm happy with the education I got at UNT, but looking back, I feel like I missed out on the experience that comes from having a sports program that students and alumni are rabid about forever. Athletics is my only significant tie to UNT today, and it feels like something that would only appeal to a masochist.

Edited October 13, 2015 by rcade

[VideoEagle]

I am an alum that graduated in the mid 70's. I came back to the university once I toured the new stadium. Since that visit I am a member of the MGC, a life member of the Alumni Assoc., have seats on the club level and the stands, have donated yearly in the mid 4 figure range to athletics, and also make regular donations to the VETERAN group and UNT. I have also brought back many new alumni.

Never would of happened if we still had the Fouts Field mentality! Sports drives overall donations! To say it doesn't drive enrollment or donations is really stupid! 

Rice has done multiple studies on this and every time find that the added publicity and donations from being a FBS (or D1A) school out weigh the costs (read financial losses) of the program. 

Good Lord people stop arguing with TFLF/HFS he is obviously trying to pull this thread offsides.  

Let instead focus on how absolutely stunning it is for the DRC staff to make the decision that this absolutely had to be written, ramifications be damned.  

Something that local Dentonites actually pay attention to is saying UNT should make an upgrade to the athletic program and at least hint at starting with the AD. I'm not a regular DRC reader since I don't live in Denton county, but I don't remember ever hearing of them going this far before. If this cleared their editorial board - and it appears it did - this is the position of an influential player in Denton. 

[rcade]

Rice has done multiple studies on this and every time find that the added publicity and donations from being a FBS (or D1A) school out weigh the costs (read financial losses) of the program. 

What does a school like Rice know about conducting scientific studies? ;-).

[MeanGreenHoops]

Wow, I am really surprised and happy to see the DRC do this. This is new territory, maybe something will actually happen. Kudos DRC!

[KingDL1]

Great editorial!

Let Dr Smatresk know we need RV gone. 

[Matt from A700]

Good God, Brett is doing some semblance of actual hard hitting journalism. Didn't know he had it in him. NTDaily causing him to step his game up?

+1 because Community rules and I wish our team had the same chemistry as Troy and Abed.

[greenit]

Good Lord people stop arguing with TFLF/HFS he is obviously trying to pull this thread offsides.  

Let instead focus on how absolutely stunning it is for the DRC staff to make the decision that this absolutely had to be written, ramifications be damned.  

See?  Denton doesn't support UNT.

[cwb]

[greenminer]

Mindblowing article considering the source.

Implies that someone at the DRC is paying attention, and knows (or thinks) it is not Vito's place to write what needs to be written.

[greenit]

Line crossed.

 

 

About time.

[VideoEagle]

Mindblowing article considering the source.

Implies that someone at the DRC is paying attention, and knows (or thinks) it is not Vito's place to write what needs to be written.

If very likely was written either by Vito or with input from him. Editorials from a newspaper itself usually don't carry individual bylines but are often by or with input from reporters who know a lot about a story. This give Vito (some) cover as it's from "the DRC" and not directly him. 

[KingDL1]

http://meangreenblog.dentonrc.com/2015/10/todays-drc-editorial-on-the-state-of-unt-athletics.html/

[Cerebus]

http://meangreenblog.dentonrc.com/2015/10/todays-drc-editorial-on-the-state-of-unt-athletics.html/

From the article:

Our editorial board handles editorials, which are essentially the opinion of the management of the paper as a whole. That’s well above my pay grade. I didn’t write it.

[KingDL1]

We should drop to FCS. The fact that nothing other than a disrespectful firing of Mac has happened shows that nothing ever will.

No, so I fixed that for you. 

[UNTflyer]

I don't really like this kind of mindset:  "No offense to UNT’s academic departments, but the front door to any large university is its athletic program."  It's one of the two laughably untrue, but overused, sentiments spouted in the SportsNews genre.

"...but the front door to any large university is its athletic program."

I do believe the University of Chicago once had a stellar football team.  So did Harvard and Yale.  The "front porch" or "front door" of a university (two phrases used today by the DRC and the univ President) is athletics.  It means that is usually the primary nexus of students, faculty, and staff to gather.  It is the most visible part of a university.  While you can provide anecdotal evidence of students choosing a college for a variety of reasons other than athletics, the fact remains that the most likely reason a high school kid applies to Texas or Florida or Ohio State is because a family member went there and/or they are a fan of the athletics program.  Athletics is marketing, like it or not.

[UNTflyer]

What exactly is the point? Nothing has changed, we're still a laughing stock years later. Instead of being held captive over a donation and naming our practice field over a fired coach, we are a laughing stock because we lost 66-7 to FCS, set an FBS record for worst interdivision loss, and because we didn't even give Mac a press conference, instead firing him on the field. 

Nothing will ever change. Just pull off the band-aid and accept reality. The 4th largest school in Texas should not be in CUSA. If we aren't going to at least compete with Cougar High, just quit already. 

He wasn't fired on the field.

And you don't hand the microphone to a guy you just fired.

[KingDL1]

What exactly is the point? Nothing has changed, we're still a laughing stock years later. Instead of being laughed at over being held captive over a donation and naming our practice field over a fired coach, we are a laughing stock because we lost 66-7 to FCS, set an FBS record for worst interdivision loss, and because we didn't even give Mac a press conference, instead firing him on the field. 

Nothing will ever change. Just pull off the band-aid and accept reality. The 4th largest school in Texas should not be in CUSA. If we aren't going to at least compete with Cougar High, just quit already. 

Plenty has changed, people like you care. There are more of us then ever. RV has 16 months left on his contract I can guarantee it is not getting renewed, Rick Villarreal was responsible for that lopsided loss. He should have been fired with Mac or before. I don't think he will make it through this October, and I would like to see RV gone this week.

The University is getting bigger and bigger with more students caring about athletics then ever before.  It is powerful stuff it will get rolling sooner or later.  Now not fast enough for you and me maybe, but it will get going in spite of Rick Villarreal and his BS and horrible moves.

[Eagle-96]

We should drop to FCS. The fact that nothing other than a disrespectful firing of Mac has happened shows that nothing ever will.

[THOR]

1 & 2. I would disagree, the BOR has shown absolute loyalty to Rick. The fact that he still is here shows it will continue.

3. Have you read our Facebook? or /r/unt? Our students loathe this university. It's mostly freshmen at the games. The older students get worn down and defeated by reality.

I want to be positive. I really do. I spent 5 years on this campus thinking things were changing and it's right back to 2010 again.

what is "/r/unt"?

and yes, the older students do get worn down...so lets change that with the hiring of a fresh, energetic coach that speaks the truth, doesn't bitch about everything, and gives us something exciting to watch...