Adopting the Cincinnati System

[UNTflyer]

Let's face it.  We'll never be national powerhouse - at least, not until we get a billionaire donor.  That's OK.  I think many of us would just like to be competitive for more than one season.

But I look at our coaching history and wonder why any good coach would want to come here:

McCarney - Fired

Dodge- Fired

Dickey - Fired

Simon - Fired

Parker- Fired

Nelson - Fired

No coach wants to come here and end up with a pink slip and coaching high school again.  When you interview for a job, how thrilled would you be to hear the last six guys got canned?  I always ask this question - what happened to the person who used to have this job?  I want to hear they were promoted or left for a great opportunity.

 

Look at Cincinnati's previous decade:

Mark Dantonio - Left for Michigan State

Brian Kelly - Left for Notre Dame

Butch Jones - Left for Tennessee

Tommy Tuberville - We'll see

While limited in resources, the Bearcats provide enough to draw a coach good enough to win.  Winning means the HC will probably get an offer or two to leave for a better job.  Let them go!  You can sell that pedigree in your next round of interviews. Of course, having the knowledge to find that diamond in the rough is key.  Money will only fix so much.
 

When we get a successful coach, DON'T extend their contract for more than a year.  If it comes down to it, let them go to their next big job, and we can have our pick of the next hungry young coach from a line of candidates knocking down our doors.

[SilverEagle]

I've advocated this system for years. The problem is that obviously Cinci  has someone (or people) that can assess the up and coming candidates.

Not here. Every hiring situation here at North Texas is another episode of the three stooges. Larry, Curly, or Moe, and sometimes all of them as a committee, take turns making the hiring decisions. 

Small wonder alums don't want to give money to the athletic department. Who wants to give good money to that kind of incompetence?

[oldguystudent]

Do we see no irony in this thread?  I know for at least the past three coaches, the fan base has taken to the streets with pitchforks and tar, calling for the coach in place to be feathered, publicly humiliated, and sent packing, consequences be damned.  Now we lament that pattern.  

What were we supposed to do?  I wasn't around for Dickey, so I'll offer no opinion, but Dodge needed to go.  Mac needed to go.  What should we have done, ridden each of them out to multiple 0-12 seasons so the next guy would see us as a stepping stone to the P5?

[UNTexas]

Do we see no irony in this thread?  I know for at least the past three coaches, the fan base has taken to the streets with pitchforks and tar, calling for the coach in place to be feathered, publicly humiliated, and sent packing, consequences be damned.  Now we lament that pattern.  

What were we supposed to do?  I wasn't around for Dickey, so I'll offer no opinion, but Dodge needed to go.  Mac needed to go.  What should we have done, ridden each of them out to multiple 0-12 seasons so the next guy would see us as a stepping stone to the P5?

I for one didn't think Dickey should go. His departure was strange to me. 

Simon on the other hand, he was a basket case mentally. The team and athletic department lost all respect for him.  Plus, he just turned mean along with his eradic behaviour. 

Dodge had to go.

Obviously, Mac had to go because this is the lowest point I've seen this team.

If only we could find a football version of John Hedlund to coach or football team...

[VideoEagle]

I understand the concept, but Cincy does give coaches longer than 1 year extensions. After a bowl win in 2012, the coach got a 3 year extension on what I think was 2 remaining years. Folks, it is not the contract extensions that's bad, it not being willing to buy it out. Coaches who go to bowl games who have less the 5 years on their contracts get extensions in FBS football. It's the cost of doing business. Yes, you might find a coach willing to take less, but not a quality coach. 

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7498285/butch-jones-cincinnati-bearcats-gets-contract-extension

Edited October 13, 2015 by VideoEagle

[UNTflyer]

No, I do not see irony here.  You fire bad coaches.  You don't give 5-year extensions for one good season.  Most importantly, our President needs to take notice that bad coaching hires can have a negative impact for years because potential candidates see us as a dead-end road.

[aztecskin]

Dan McCarney was a solid hire and could very well have been a guy that coached 8 years here and retired. Except these last two years were a epic miscalculations that resulted in the worst, most embarrassing loss in school history -- quite a feat considering Papa Dodge's first couple of seasons. Much of the goodwill, prestige, and benefit of the doubt were burned up in the raging flame that was the last couple of weeks. 

So yeah, I'd really like to know how those Cinci folks pick winners so consistently. I'd like some of what they are having /HarrySallyVoice 

[EagleMBA]

But I look at our coaching history and wonder why any good coach would want to come here:

McCarney - Fired

Dodge- Fired

Dickey - Fired

Simon - Fired

Parker- Fired

Nelson - Fired

No coach wants to come here and end up with a pink slip and coaching high school again.  When you interview for a job, how thrilled would you be to hear the last six guys got canned?  I always ask this question - what happened to the person who used to have this job?  I want to hear they were promoted or left for a great opportunity.

Someone once said (or maybe it is a sports cliche) that coaches know they are going to be fired from the day they are hired. IMO, the key is the elapsed time between those firings.

[casual fan]

Look at Boise.  

They will hire coaches from non FBS schools.

Allen was HC at Portland St.

Nutt was HC at Murray ST.

Hawkins was HC at Williamette. 

Petersen was QB coach at Portland St and receivers coach at Oregon. He was hired as as OC at Boise and  "groomed" for a few years.

Harsin was HC at Arkansas St for 1 year.  He had been Boise's OC when they had 2 undefeated seasons and was 61 - 5 as their OC.

Boise became Boise by hiring good HC coaches from smaller schools. (with the exception fo Petersen)

Look, how hard is it to recruit at Florida, OU, Alabama, etc.  

It may be misleading to think a coach from one of those schools is a great recruiter when the school is so easy to recruit to.

A coach who has been successful as a HC at a school with limited resources, recruits well, spots talent that others overlooked, & has had success as HC. 

A non HC from a big school that is so easy to recruit to may be in way over his head here.  

Just my opinion.

[Cerebus]

I for one didn't think Dickey should go. His departure was strange to me. 

It was personal.  

[untbowler]

It was personal.  

yes it was, RV had it in for DD from the start and when the team was 0-5 before the miracle against the MUTS and the 4 yr run, time had run out.

RV being petty also helped to sabotage Dodge at the start by not allowing any of DD's staff to be retained

Edited October 13, 2015 by untbowler

[FirefightnRick]

Excellent posts by flyer and casual fan.  The problem is the guy doing the hiring here is stuck on the idea that we gotta have a flash hire people will notice rather than actually doing research and a quality interview process.  That's what has to end.

 

We need a hungry up and comer who wants to move up.

 

Rick

[UNTcrazy727]

Excellent posts by flyer and casual fan.  The problem is the guy doing the hiring here is stuck on the idea that we gotta have a flash hire people will notice rather than actually doing research and a quality interview process.  That's what has to end.

 

We need a hungry up and comer who wants to move up.

 

Rick

Dan McCarney and Tony Benford were not a flash hires.

[KingDL1]

Dickey needed to go, he did a great job but was not getting anywhere maybe he should have been made AD. 

[Mean Green 93-98]

yes it was, RV had it in for DD from the start and when the team was 0-5 before the miracle against the MUTS

Most of us were ready for DD to go at that time.  But I wouldn't call it "personal" for most of us.

[FirefightnRick]

Dan McCarney and Tony Benford were not a flash hires.

Ask yourself what was rolled out there as soon as both were announced?

"Marquette...Basketball"

"Florida SEC Football National Championship"

And even with with Shanice Stephens..."Clemson ACC Basketball"

Thats what I mean by FLASH hires.  They coached at name schools that everyone recognizes....so they must be good.

 

Rick

[3XL]

Look at Boise.  

They will hire coaches from non FBS schools.

Allen was HC at Portland St.

Nutt was HC at Murray ST.

Hawkins was HC at Williamette. 

Petersen was QB coach at Portland St and receivers coach at Oregon. He was hired as as OC at Boise and  "groomed" for a few years.

Harsin was HC at Arkansas St for 1 year.  He had been Boise's OC when they had 2 undefeated seasons and was 61 - 5 as their OC.

Boise became Boise by hiring good HC coaches from smaller schools. (with the exception fo Petersen)

Look, how hard is it to recruit at Florida, OU, Alabama, etc.  

It may be misleading to think a coach from one of those schools is a great recruiter when the school is so easy to recruit to.

A coach who has been successful as a HC at a school with limited resources, recruits well, spots talent that others overlooked, & has had success as HC. 

A non HC from a big school that is so easy to recruit to may be in way over his head here.  

Just my opinion.

this +1

[keith]

We kicked their ass in 2002.

[HarringtonFishSmeller]

Let's face it.  We'll never be national powerhouse - at least, not until we get a billionaire donor.  That's OK.  I think many of us would just like to be competitive for more than one season.

But I look at our coaching history and wonder why any good coach would want to come here:

McCarney - Fired

Dodge- Fired

Dickey - Fired

Simon - Fired

Parker- Fired

Nelson - Fired

No coach wants to come here and end up with a pink slip and coaching high school again.  When you interview for a job, how thrilled would you be to hear the last six guys got canned?  I always ask this question - what happened to the person who used to have this job?  I want to hear they were promoted or left for a great opportunity.

 

Look at Cincinnati's previous decade:

Mark Dantonio - Left for Michigan State

Brian Kelly - Left for Notre Dame

Butch Jones - Left for Tennessee

Tommy Tuberville - We'll see

While limited in resources, the Bearcats provide enough to draw a coach good enough to win.  Winning means the HC will probably get an offer or two to leave for a better job.  Let them go!  You can sell that pedigree in your next round of interviews. Of course, having the knowledge to find that diamond in the rough is key.  Money will only fix so much.
 

When we get a successful coach, DON'T extend their contract for more than a year.  If it comes down to it, let them go to their next big job, and we can have our pick of the next hungry young coach from a line of candidates knocking down our doors.

This system works out well...if, you know the person you hire is going to win.