Its time to Fire RV, Canales and maybe Mac

NT2002 · September 15, 2015

I remember when Canales was interviewing for the Sam Houston position after the HOD Bowl. At that point, I felt like he had called a great game and did not want to see him leave. Given the situation last season, it is clear that he has limited skill in QB development and coordinating the offense. Last year was clearly upsetting and it looks like this year could be very much the of the same thing (just disguised/re-named as up-tempo). Clearly, the defense will be the saving grace to bring us to another 4 win season.

Canales needs to go mid-season if our only win by that time is Portland. Bring in a true Coordinator who is skilled at play calling and QB development. Or, make 2 distinct hires in a QB Coach and a Coordinator. It was frustrating to see how unprepared the offense looked in a bye week opener. Terrible routes from the WRs, poor play-calling, and special teams. All-in-all, it's time to say good bye to Canales and look for more candidates who can call a game given the personnel on the field (since you have not developed what you have to the extent that you trust them to actually do well).

foutsrouts · September 15, 2015

I remember when Canales was interviewing for the Sam Houston position after the HOD Bowl. At that point, I felt like he had called a great game and did not want to see him leave. Given the situation last season, it is clear that he has limited skill in QB development and coordinating the offense. Last year was clearly upsetting and it looks like this year could be very much the of the same thing (just disguised/re-named as up-tempo). Clearly, the defense will be the saving grace to bring us to another 4 win season.
Canales needs to go mid-season if our only win by that time is Portland. Bring in a true Coordinator who is skilled at play calling and QB development. Or, make 2 distinct hires in a QB Coach and a Coordinator. It was frustrating to see how unprepared the offense looked in a bye week opener. Terrible routes from the WRs, poor play-calling, and special teams. All-in-all, it's time to say good bye to Canales and look for more candidates who can call a game given the personnel on the field (since you have not developed what you have to the extent that you trust them to actually do well).

I wouldn't count on a Portland win unless there's a QB change. If no change at 0-5, I say reassign Mac and do the Chico thing again. I know I'm dreaming, but hopefully Mac would still want to assistant coach somewhere and mitigate our losses. If Mac sticks exclusively with the status quo under center after a Portland loss, I would honestly start to be concerned about the guy.

NT2002 · September 15, 2015

Responding to: "If Mac sticks exclusively with the status quo under center after a Portland loss, I would honestly start to be concerned about the guy."

I don't see how firing Mac would be possible given his contract. If we are 0-5 after Portland after trying AM, and exhausting all back-ups, then someone's head will roll and it should be Canales. If none of the QB's can get it done at that point he needs to be terminated. If we are winless headed into the Portland game and if by halftime we are losing and Mac does stick with the status quo, then I'm sure there will be serious discussions post-season based on that coaching decision if the game turns out to be a loss.

I add the qualifiers because we all know how slow the BOR are at matters such as this. Recent history (Dodge) tells us so.

Edited September 15, 2015 by NT2002

foutsrouts · September 15, 2015

Responding to: "If Mac sticks exclusively with the status quo under center after a Portland loss, I would honestly start to be concerned about the guy."

I don't see how firing Mac would be possible given his contract. If we are 0-5 after Portland after trying AM, and exhausting all back-ups, then someone's head will roll and it should be Canales. If none of the QB's can get it done at that point he needs to be terminated. If we are winless headed into the Portland game and if by halftime we are losing and Mac does stick with the status quo, then I'm sure there will be serious discussions post-season based on that coaching decision if the game turns out to be a loss.
I add the qualifiers because we all know how slow the BOR are at matters such as this. Recent history (Dodge) tells us so.

My thought was that if we DON'T exhaust or even use backups at an 0-5 point after a Portland loss (IOW's stick with AM exclusively), then something really crazy is going on here, and we should find a way to reassign Mac. In a reassignment we don't necessarily get stuck with the term of his contract. It depends on whether or not he is in demand and wants to work as an assistant elsewhere, or whether he wants to stick around Denton in a diminished role for the term of his contract.

I agree it's a gamble, but going down the tubes at 0-12 is not something that this program can afford at this point IMO. Let us hope that it doesn't come to that.

risinggreen · September 15, 2015

I feel like if we maybe could find Ray...things might turn around for us

Bringing back Ray's boss with a year of eligibility wouldn't hurt either.

James · September 15, 2015

What we need is a pissed off billionaire donor to tell Smatresk to pull the trigger. If only...

North Texas Shep · September 15, 2015

What we need is a pissed off billionaire donor to tell Smatresk to pull the trigger. If only...

We are lucky to get a thousandaire donor.

James · September 15, 2015

We are lucky to get a thousandaire donor.

I'll throw in $100. Who's in?

North Texas Shep · September 15, 2015

I'll throw in $100. Who's in?

I already thrown in more than that and all of us who do, signing a petition would not do a damn thing... At least I do not think so.

UNT90 · September 15, 2015

Responding to: "If Mac sticks exclusively with the status quo under center after a Portland loss, I would honestly start to be concerned about the guy."

I don't see how firing Mac would be possible given his contract. If we are 0-5 after Portland after trying AM, and exhausting all back-ups, then someone's head will roll and it should be Canales. If none of the QB's can get it done at that point he needs to be terminated. If we are winless headed into the Portland game and if by halftime we are losing and Mac does stick with the status quo, then I'm sure there will be serious discussions post-season based on that coaching decision if the game turns out to be a loss.
I add the qualifiers because we all know how slow the BOR are at matters such as this. Recent history (Dodge) tells us so.

please stop saying "we don't have the money." That is complete crap. We don't lack money, we lack will. The will to be anything other than what we have always been, the laughingstock of Texas college football.

Until this changes at high level of the UNT administration, nothing will change with athletics.

Edited September 15, 2015 by UNT90

Dr. Seuss · September 15, 2015

please stop saying "we don't have the money." That is complete crap. We don't lack money, we lack will. The will to be anything other than what we have always been, the laughingstock of Texas college football.
Until this changes at high level of the UNT administration, nothing will change with athletics.

100% agree.

mattmartin817 · September 15, 2015

Sort of related, word in Austin is that Steve Patterson is going to be fired later today. His contract was through 2019, going to be a huge buyout.

MeanGreenTexan · September 15, 2015

please stop saying "we don't have the money." That is complete crap. We don't lack money, we lack will. The will to be anything other than what we have always been, the laughingstock of Texas college football.
Until this changes at high level of the UNT administration, nothing will change with athletics.

WHOA!!
You must know something that everyone else here doesn't know! Which would be the norm...

But I can't help but think that you're 100% incorrect, and basing this claim on some false assumption. Which would also be the norm...

Stop ALL renovations that are in the works for the Pit, Lovelace, etc. Pour that money into firings and hirings.

This is just plain ignorant. @Cerebus has already shot this down logically, but to dogpile: Any funding from the University budget WILL NOT BE USED to buy out any of the Athletics personnel, be it coaches, AD staff, or the AD himself. IF anyone is to be bought out, the money will have to come from a private source.

So I'll ask again for the umpteenth time:
Which one of you rich dudes are going to front this buyout money? If you're not going to, then your complaining and "FIRE <XYZ>" rally cries are useless.

Dr. Smatresk could want to see the entire Athletic Department wiped clean, but his hands are tied unless he can take a rich dude (any of you guys? UNT90? Ben?) to lunch and convince him to front several million dollars to buy any of these guys out.

Cerebus · September 15, 2015

So I'll ask again for the umpteenth time:
Which one of you rich dudes are going to front this buyout money? If you're not going to, then your complaining and "FIRE <XYZ>" rally cries are useless.

That isn't true. If the fan base puts a ton of pressure on Smatresk, he will go out and do the hand shaking and touch talking to raise those funds.

MeanGreenTexan · September 15, 2015

That isn't true. If the fan base puts a ton of pressure on Smatresk, he will go out and do the hand shaking and touch talking to raise those funds.

Right. which I touched on at the very end there.

But why wouldn't he start with some of the dudes on here? They're the ones who want these guys gone ASAP!!!!!!1! Surely if it means enough, they'll just take out a loan or something.

Army of Dad · September 15, 2015

*golf whisper*

(1)MeanGreenTexan is attempting to use the pay up or shut up ploy. Not sure it's going to work.

(2)Yes, isn't it really just the same strategy his opponents are using-complaining?

(1)It looks like that, let's see how it goes for him...

MeanGreenTexan · September 15, 2015

*golf whisper*
(1)MeanGreenTexan is attempting to use the pay up or shut up ploy. Not sure it's going to work.
(2)Yes, isn't it really just the same strategy his opponents are using-complaining?
(1)It looks like that, let's see how it goes for him...

I'm only saying that in a in a sarcastic way.

Here's what I'm saying... well, what I've already said:

Any funding from the University budget WILL NOT BE USED to buy out any of the Athletics personnel, be it coaches, AD staff, or the AD himself. IF anyone is to be bought out, the money will have to come from a private source.
So I'll ask again for the umpteenth time:
Which one of you rich dudes are going to front this buyout money? If you're not going to, then your complaining and "FIRE <XYZ>" rally cries are useless.
Dr. Smatresk could want to see the entire Athletic Department wiped clean, but his hands are tied unless he can take a rich dude (any of you guys? UNT90? Ben?) to lunch and convince him to front several million dollars to buy any of these guys out.

So, when people are imploring Smatresk to do something (like ignorantly saying he should halt Super Pit upgrades, which are already funded)... his hands are tied, because he cannot use University funds for that use. He's going to have to go out and raise that money. Why not start with shaking down the squeakiest wheels?

Not "pay up or shut up". You can keep yelling and typing all you want... it's just not going to do anything. If you're serious, the only way any of you guys are going to get your wish is to pony up, or help find other rich dudes who will. Otherwise, it's just complaining... and that's fine. Carry on.

untjim1995 · September 16, 2015

The BOR and administration may not be able to use school funds for athletic spending, but they can influence donations to actually go toward the athletic nightmare instead of some other projects going on right now. And seeing how the university for decades wouldn't even let the athletic department have a list of donors that gave to other areas of the university, that's seems like the very least they could do to help rectify the situation if buyouts are needed, which most of us feel like they are, just to start fresh again. And that doesn't have to be Mac after this season if that is deemed to be too high. But RV should be gone before any other hire for a revenue sport needs to be made--that means between now and the end of basketball season.

MeanGreenTexan · September 16, 2015

The BOR and administration may not be able to use school funds for athletic spending, but they can influence donations to actually go toward the athletic nightmare instead of some other projects going on right now. And seeing how the university for decades wouldn't even let the athletic department have a list of donors that gave to other areas of the university, that's seems like the very least they could do to help rectify the situation if buyouts are needed, which most of us feel like they are, just to start fresh again. And that doesn't have to be Mac after this season if that is deemed to be too high. But RV should be gone before any other hire for a revenue sport needs to be made--that means between now and the end of basketball season.

I'd rather not start redirecting gifts to academic colleges over to athletics. Every area of UNT needs their donors. This is an academic institution first.

TIgreen01 · September 16, 2015

I think this is really pretty cut and dry as far as football staff changes that would be made should the season not turn out the way we want.

#1 - Mac has the highest buyout clause of any of our coaches or staff. He will NOT be bought out this year (or after the season).

#2 - In support of #1, it will be pointed out that Mac is a defensive minded coach. Talking points will be that our defense is pretty good, while our offense is absolutely wretched. Canales' contract is up at the end of this season. He's the OC, and, as has now been publicly established for the umpteenth time, he's calling the plays and recruiting the QBs. Canales' contract will not be renewed.

#3 - Mac will thank Canales for his time at season's end, and will begin the "search" for a new OC. He'll have already narrowed this down to a couple of guys by this point, however.

All of this will go on behind the scenes. All we'll hear publicly is that Canales has left for another opportunity and we'll be looking for a replacement.

Mac has an established track record for bringing in good coaches during his time here. If I'm RV or Smatresk, I'm taking the safe route this year and betting that Mac can at least bring in someone that looks good on paper (and is likely also good when it counts) to replace Canales.

Edited September 16, 2015 by TIgreen01

NT2002 · September 16, 2015

I think the 3 reasons given by Tlgreen01 are solid reasons why Mac won't be let go. I feel that Mac is a good coach and can bring in great hires. In regards to the OC position, my question then becomes one of timing. Will they fire Canales mid-season or wait until after the season is over? In my opinion, if we are winless after 5 games then a prompt change needs to be made to send a message to the fans and the university.

Matt from A700 · September 16, 2015

I don't think we can afford to wait until the end of the season. I think if we get embarrassed Saturday, some change has got to be made. I would say Canales first.

untjim1995 · September 16, 2015

TIGreen is dead-on--we aren't firing Mac anytime soon. Not this year, even if we go 0-12. Chico will get the blame. Unless we win less than 2 games the following season, we aren't buying his contract out for $1.3 million after 2016, either. He's going to be here until the 2017 season, bare minimum. The interesting thought is what happens after the 2017 season. If we have a losing season, I can see us letting him go. If we finish with 6 wins, I can see them letting Mac finish his contract and retiring after 2018 just to save the cash, too. The real dilemma is what you do if he wins 7+ in 2017--you are going to have to make a decision if Mac doesn't want to retire. You either let him lame-duck the next season (sending recruiting officially into the sewer, even below the awful recruiting we have already seen) that nobody will want to sign up to play at out of high school or juco or you have to extend him, at least a year or two. I'm telling you all that it won't surprise me a bit to see us have a 2013-type season in 2017 if Mac is coaching for another contract extension, even if its only a few years beyond 2018. You could see Mac sell RV on retiring after the 2020 season, which gets him one last contract extension.

greenit · September 16, 2015

Force Mac to hire a true uptempo offensive coordinator. Preferably with some skins on the wall. Then, if we roll out the same craptastic offense as the last couple of years, we will know fore sure where the problem is.