Canales and Co. Missed a kid 15 miles away

Ben Gooding · July 9, 2015

Thinking too much. I was just referring to him as a HS player that no one gave a chance until a coach that has won more than 200 collegiate games as a head coach came knocking.

flyonthewall · July 9, 2015

There is no way they missed on this kid. E. K.'s grandson goes to liberty christian and he is very involved over there. Liberty is 11.8 miles from apogee, not 15.

KRAM1 · July 9, 2015

OK...all you recruiting experts out there......how many D1 coaches missed on Harris and Kirby? Why are you not praising UNT for giving these kids a shot when so many other of these great coaching staffs that recruit the DFW area missed so badly on them? Only at UNT are the so-called fans so quick to point out every little issue they personally can dig up, while totally ignoring the successes. UNT runs one of the top walk-on and transfer programs in the country. While one can argue both sides of that issue, and make valid points both ways. One simply cannot argue with the fact that recruiting is tough. And plenty tough in Texas which has more D1 programs than almost any other state. Who has more? Texas or California? Heck, who cares? There are plenty to choose from in Texas where family and friends can make a short drive to watch their favorite player every game. The coaching staff knows what it wants, the positions it thinks it needs to fill, the potential for current roster players to make an impact, the contacts from potential transfers and walk-on's, the JUCO guys they are interested in pursuing, etc. just because a kid is decent in HS or from a local HS does not mean that the player is a fit for what the staff at UNT is looking to recruit that season.

Man, how I love these walk-on kids who love the game so much that they are willing to do all the work for none of the glory just to prove that they belong. These players earn my respect each and every day...on the field, in the classroom and often within the community. Congrats to young Mr. Kirby. He has earned it and earned it the hard way. Lots of D1staffs passed on this kid who are sitting out there today wondering why. Thanks UNT for seeing something in this kid that showed you he was more than worth the opportunity. Opportunity is all these walk-on kids want.

How about some kudos for the staff who not only looks for these passed over gems but gives them the opportunity?

BillySee58 · July 9, 2015

There is no way they missed on this kid. E. K.'s grandson goes to liberty christian and he is very involved over there. Liberty is 11.8 miles from apogee, not 15.

He's not saying missed as in they didn't know who he is. He's saying we missed out on him by not offering when we need a good young QB.

H-towngreen · July 9, 2015

Simply put, recruiting has been less than stellar under Mac. We are not going to be winning many recruiting battles against SMU and especially UH in the next couple of years. Hell, anyone remember back 8-10 yrs when we use to go head to head with TCU and Tech and win some guys. Now we're facing off against TXST and UTSA.

MeanGreenTexan · July 9, 2015

Simply put, recruiting has been less than stellar under Mac. We are not going to be winning many recruiting battles against SMU and especially UH in the next couple of years. Hell, anyone remember back 8-10 yrs when we use to go head to head with TCU and Tech and win some guys. Now we're facing off against TXST and UTSA.

Or heck, just last offseason when we secured a commitment from a top TX WR and hung onto him while he spurned late offers from the likes of Arkansas...

Folks need to take the blinders off. It's not all bad.

_{(But yes, the QB situation is alarming)}

Ben Gooding · July 9, 2015

Simply put, recruiting has been less than stellar under Mac. We are not going to be winning many recruiting battles against SMU and especially UH in the next couple of years. Hell, anyone remember back 8-10 yrs when we use to go head to head with TCU and Tech and win some guys. Now we're facing off against TXST and UTSA.

That's the issue that KRAM is missing on his thesis.

I am appreciative of who we have been able to land, for sure. I will root them on in every way I can. But I will point out guys that we pass up on that are in our very back yard. We are getting our teeth kicked in regards to recruiting. SMU MIGHT not beat us this year, but it will start to happen and the underlying cause of our embarrassing losses to SMU will be our lack of recruiting success. We can all be ultra optimistic and be thankful we even have people willing to come here while we stroke our annual 4-8 record.

UNTLifer · July 9, 2015

Surprised?

But MeanGreenTexan did not miss that point.

UNT90 · July 10, 2015

Somebody has been smoking something that is now legal in Colorado if they think that kid sticks with UNT over OSU or A&M .... Both of which are easy drives from the metroplex. Heck, I have made the drive to Stillwater many many times. Easy...all highway now that Hwy 51 has been improved.
Yes, I agree you must try. And, UNT has been trying just that a lot recently...much more than in prior years. Heck, even offered Irvin's kid who had that Miami offer he accepted. Everyone can find kids that "could have/should have" in their personal opinions. Easy for the armchair recruiters to do. if you are a local area coach and want to help maybe you could reach out to Coach Mac and ask for a sit down and discuss recruiting. Is a tad puzzling why UNT coaches are not haunting the hallways and gyms and practice fields of local area high schools.

right? I mean Lance Dunbar is the all time rushing leader at OSU, right?

Right?

H-towngreen · July 10, 2015

Or heck, just last offseason when we secured a commitment from a top TX WR and hung onto him while he spurned late offers from the likes of Arkansas...
Folks need to take the blinders off. It's not all bad.

_{(But yes, the QB situation is alarming)}

Not saying we haven't had a couple of good players in the past few classes, but all together, these classes have been below average.

Edited July 10, 2015 by H-towngreen

Got5onIt · July 10, 2015

All I'm going to say is you won't know unless you try. Offering may have worked. However, I highly doubt this kid would've stayed with his commitment considering the type of offense and record this program has when compared to a program like OSU. It's just the reality here. Juco players usually have less eligibility remaining and want to play now. These are the types of players NT has a legitimate shot at "stealing" from bigger, more prestigious programs.

Edited July 10, 2015 by Got5onIt

BillySee58 · July 10, 2015

OK...all you recruiting experts out there......how many D1 coaches missed on Harris and Kirby? Why are you not praising UNT for giving these kids a shot when so many other of these great coaching staffs that recruit the DFW area missed so badly on them? Only at UNT are the so-called fans so quick to point out every little issue they personally can dig up, while totally ignoring the successes. UNT runs one of the top walk-on and transfer programs in the country. While one can argue both sides of that issue, and make valid points both ways. One simply cannot argue with the fact that recruiting is tough. And plenty tough in Texas which has more D1 programs than almost any other state. Who has more? Texas or California? Heck, who cares? There are plenty to choose from in Texas where family and friends can make a short drive to watch their favorite player every game. The coaching staff knows what it wants, the positions it thinks it needs to fill, the potential for current roster players to make an impact, the contacts from potential transfers and walk-on's, the JUCO guys they are interested in pursuing, etc. just because a kid is decent in HS or from a local HS does not mean that the player is a fit for what the staff at UNT is looking to recruit that season.
Man, how I love these walk-on kids who love the game so much that they are willing to do all the work for none of the glory just to prove that they belong. These players earn my respect each and every day...on the field, in the classroom and often within the community. Congrats to young Mr. Kirby. He has earned it and earned it the hard way. Lots of D1staffs passed on this kid who are sitting out there today wondering why. Thanks UNT for seeing something in this kid that showed you he was more than worth the opportunity. Opportunity is all these walk-on kids want.
How about some kudos for the staff who not only looks for these passed over gems but gives them the opportunity?

Recruiting is about classes as a whole, not individuals. That 2012 class we signed Harris featured 22 high school signees.

Heading into this classes' 4th year on campus only 9 of those players remain, and only 1 of those players is a sure bet to start this season (Harris). Haboul or Wallace will likely start at a DT spot, but not both, so probably 2 starters when we play SMU will be from this class that should be the foundation of this team as seniors and redshirt juniors. 1-2 starters out of 22 signings.

It's great to have former walkons and lightly recruited guys like Kirby and Harris contribute, and even start. But when those are the players you are relying on and having to lean on to win games then you put your team at a potential disadvantage. Since we've joined CUSA, Brelan Chancellor*, who had no other offers made the all-CUSA team. Other than him, we have had 7 other players make first or second team all-CUSA. 6 of those 7 had at least 4 FBS offers, while the other was Mason Y'Barbo who had 3 FBS offers and multiple FCS offers. Those have been the guys we have been able to lean on for wins in this conference. The relatively highly recruited guys. Still need them in addition to guys like Harris and Kirby.

*SN: Small skill players like Chancellor, Harris, etc, and QBs seem to be the exceptions to the offer list thing. Makes sense. Teams don't recruit them because they're small, but they're not asked to use their size. They're asked to make plays and make people miss.

GMG24 · July 10, 2015

There is no way they missed on this kid. E. K.'s grandson goes to liberty christian and he is very involved over there. Liberty is 11.8 miles from apogee, not 15.

sorry for the quotes below.. IPAD won't let me remove them. What I am saying is, this kid reached out to UNT before he had all these offers, from the big time schools, and was interested and heard NOTHING BACK. I am sure there are some things and time they'd have to wait before speaking with him as to not be in violation, but come on man. You really want to sit here and argue with two of the top QB recruiters around (Gundy and Sumlin as to this kids chances of making an impact).

Yes, only at North Texas can a kid going to the ELITE 11 and THE OPENING contact our staff, basically telling them I want to play for you (that's a guess on my part) and not hear a dang thing!!!

Not a we will keep in contact, thanks for sending film in, we will look at it and get back with you, NOTHING. That is pathetic, even if they don't like him, let him know that while you appreciate the effort your going in another direction. THAT is how you build relationships with HS coaches and kids

Sorry to be dumb, but who is E.K. Thank you, I knew someone would be that guy and mapquest it out to prove some point to deflect attention.

Edited July 10, 2015 by GMG24

UNTnewbie · July 10, 2015

Since this kid was SO interested in playing at UNT, how many UNT Camps did he attend?

GMG24 · July 10, 2015

Since this kid was SO interested in playing at UNT, how many UNT Camps did he attend?

No idea, how many would you attend if you reached out somewhere and heard nothing? Then got offers from OSU and ATM, in between there were Tulane, ODU, and Indiana St. I would be willing to bet he'll end up with 10 + offers.

greenit · July 10, 2015

Is it ever ok that we don't have interest in a kid? Parents of potential players are the worst source to rely on for info. They ALWAYS have an agenda.

GOMG2013 · July 10, 2015

Since this kid was SO interested in playing at UNT, how many UNT Camps did he attend?

the 3 star QB I'm talking about in the Houston area attended the UNT camp. And this was after he had several offers.

UNTnewbie · July 10, 2015

No idea, how many would you attend if you reached out somewhere and heard nothing? Then got offers from OSU and ATM, in between there were Tulane, ODU, and Indiana St. I would be willing to bet he'll end up with 10 + offers.

My answer would be, and was in all of my kids cases, at least one.

H-towngreen · July 10, 2015

the 3 star QB I'm talking about in the Houston area attended the UNT camp. And this was after he had several offers.

The twins from Bush?

Sig381 · July 10, 2015

I really don't know what y'all expect form the coaches. i think a lot of y'all do not remember that we are a below average mid-major school. we have some good runs in the 2000's and one good season lately. so far since Mac has been here we have steadily have been getting better recruits. it will take time to build a program here. you just have wait and support the team no matter what happens.

Got5onIt · July 11, 2015

I really don't know what y'all expect form the coaches. i think a lot of y'all do not remember that we are a below average mid-major school. we have some good runs in the 2000's and one good season lately. so far since Mac has been here we have steadily have been getting better recruits. it will take time to build a program here. you just have wait and support the team no matter what happens.

I agree with the below average comment of this post. Not so much with the recruits getting better & the time to build a program. I think we're way beyond that point. Mac has advantages the Dickster & Teflon Todd didn't have, yet has only produced 1 winning season. Mac's best offensive players were Teflon Todd's recruits. Mac's best defense is still behind the Dickster's best Booger led unit. In his 5th year, this program is staring right down the barrel of a loaded gun to another below .500 season. Not acceptable at this point in his tenure, IMO.

Edited July 11, 2015 by Got5onIt

greenit · July 11, 2015

The 2012 recruiting season was a killer from a depth standpoint. However, I think the roster currently looks pretty solid with the Juco additions that were used to address some of those holes. With the exception of QB, I don't have a real problem with any other position. If McNulty or Smith step up this year and give us at least an average season, we can win 5-7 games.

Last season, per ESPN FBS stats, the #75 (out of 123) QB in the major categories looked like this:

Passing yards: 2305
Attempts: 330
Completions: 191
Completion Percentage: 58%
Passing TDs: 15
Interceptions: 8
TD/Int Ratio: 1.875
QB Rating: 125.6

In our offense, I don't have any misconception that our QB will be some gunslinger, but they need to be efficient and be able to perform when needed. I feel that it is very fair to judge our QB performance against the #75 hypothetical QB numbers.

Graddean · July 11, 2015

I am not particularly happy with recruiting either; however, when was the last time we had three players nominated for national awards. All three are Mac's recruits. So I don't think we can say no talented recruits. We might say not enough talented. Even that might not be apparent until we see transfers, red shirts, and incoming fresh this fall.

ntmeangreen11 · July 12, 2015

We shouldn't routinely lose to ULL, Tx State, UTSA, Houston, SMU, La Tech, & Tulane. The last four have ate our lunch for a while now, but we should at least be batting .500 against the first three and we have not even come close to that over the years.

GrandGreen · July 13, 2015

OK...all you recruiting experts out there......how many D1 coaches missed on Harris and Kirby? Why are you not praising UNT for giving these kids a shot when so many other of these great coaching staffs that recruit the DFW area missed so badly on them? Only at UNT are the so-called fans so quick to point out every little issue they personally can dig up, while totally ignoring the successes. UNT runs one of the top walk-on and transfer programs in the country. While one can argue both sides of that issue, and make valid points both ways. One simply cannot argue with the fact that recruiting is tough. And plenty tough in Texas which has more D1 programs than almost any other state. Who has more? Texas or California? Heck, who cares? There are plenty to choose from in Texas where family and friends can make a short drive to watch their favorite player every game. The coaching staff knows what it wants, the positions it thinks it needs to fill, the potential for current roster players to make an impact, the contacts from potential transfers and walk-on's, the JUCO guys they are interested in pursuing, etc. just because a kid is decent in HS or from a local HS does not mean that the player is a fit for what the staff at UNT is looking to recruit that season.
Man, how I love these walk-on kids who love the game so much that they are willing to do all the work for none of the glory just to prove that they belong. These players earn my respect each and every day...on the field, in the classroom and often within the community. Congrats to young Mr. Kirby. He has earned it and earned it the hard way. Lots of D1staffs passed on this kid who are sitting out there today wondering why. Thanks UNT for seeing something in this kid that showed you he was more than worth the opportunity. Opportunity is all these walk-on kids want.
How about some kudos for the staff who not only looks for these passed over gems but gives them the opportunity?

Obviously, we all applaud the walk-ons who contribute whether they become stars or not. However, you must ask yourself why do so many more succeed at NT than probably anywhere else? Is it because the coaching staff is much better than others in identifying borderline players who can play? Or is it more a function of the quality of many recruits that come here on scholarship not being much better than the next level who are not offered ships?

My belief is that it is a function of both factors plus McCarney has build a reputation for rewarding walk-ons. Places that recruit real well just are not going to offer many walk-ons ships because they can project getting better players through normal recruiting. McCarney has IMO built a strength out a weakness, but hopefully the program will progress to a point that walk-ons will still be given opportunities but they will have more competition to earn a scholarship.