Remind me of why it's impossible again

MeanGreenTexan · July 10, 2015

So, again, by your definition, we will probably draw 1,200 "fans" per game to Apogee this year, eh?

And if they don't have thousands upon thousands of dollars to waste in an attempt to effect change, they just need to shit the hell up, right?

Only if they ate too many pregame chorizo tacos.

UNTFan23 · July 10, 2015

So, again, by your definition, we will probably draw 1,200 "fans" per game to Apogee this year, eh?

And if they don't have thousands upon thousands of dollars to waste in an attempt to effect change, they just need to shut the hell up, right?

And according to you getting a whole new AD staff will suddenly make everything better. The problems run way, way deeper than a couple of people working in a single department (and BOR is not part of the problem either).

TIgreen01 · July 10, 2015

And if they don't have thousands upon thousands of dollars to waste in an attempt to effect change, they just need to shut the hell up, right?

Are you effecting change within our athletic department by posting in every single thread some kind of negative remark about our BOR/AD/Pres/etc or outright stating you want the AD/Pres/BOR/etc fired or replaced? I don't disagree that it's time for change within the system, just in the method you and other posters are using to try to make it happen.

UNT90 · July 10, 2015

And according to you getting a whole new AD staff will suddenly make everything better. The problems run way, way deeper than a couple of people working in a single department (and BOR is not part of the problem either).

if people can't succeed at their job, they shouldn't be doing said job.

And thanks for issuing the standard RV company line. "Problems way deeper"; "if only you knew" The same line he has been issuing for the past 14 years, all the while without fixing the problem.

Just so you know, there is a word for that kind of crap. It's called EXCUSE.

And RV is the king of them.

untjim1995 · July 10, 2015

I completely agree with you about the problems running way deeper than a few people in a single department (I'll assume you mean the AD). But I disagree on the BOR part--I know that they lead the university in the way that is pleasing to most UNT alumni, students, faculty, admininistration, and the local citizenry, which is what I think you are getting at as the real problem, a culture of anti-athletics at UNT and in Denton. But I still believe the BOR's job is to lead the university in a direction that appeals to folks with the ability to stay connected to the unviersity and to fund it with donations. Athletics, by far, is the most reasonable way to get the public involved in this venture. If you don't believe this, look at every other single unviersity in the region that has a FBS team and see how they elevate football and basketball in terms of promotion--then think about us. Sure, corporate and government research is a boon to schools, but that isn't getting funded by mom and pop, its getting funded by huge conglomerates and federal and state taxpayers. And, yes music, arts, and education are societal goals that need to be maintained and enhanced. But they don't bring in enough donors to feel any kind of deep connection to the university on a meaningful level.
In the end, ‌TI Green is right, though. The changes that need to happen here come from money...which I don't have very much of. And maybe that is what the real truth is here, that without money to persuade the school to make changes in their views on athletics, that I should just either accept it or leave. But as I get older and I need more time with my children and my family, finding the time and money to take them over to Apogee to watch us continue our losing ways is getting to be a tougher proposition. I loved every bit of 2013, but, in the end, it was just one season, surrounded by 9 years of just awful football. I guess that is why its been so hard to accept the reality that it was just an anomaly around here, that having all of 4 winning seasons in 20 years of being at this level is really what we are as a program. I just wanted more for our program, especially after 2013. But it didn't happen last year, won't happen this year, and its a guess as to when we see another winning season again. I don't have the money to make that change, nor do my posts on calling out the BOR about it. So, in essence, I apologize for the negative vibe...I just really hoped that we would keep moving in the right direction, not only moving backwards again, but now hearing the coach talk about how hard it is to bring talent here and get any support. Its like a time warp right back to 2005 and 2006 all over again, but this time, the coach is guaranteed to be here for years to come becuase of his hefty contract.

KRAM1 · July 10, 2015

I'm beginning to like this Tlgreen01 guy more and more. Why can't I +1 him more than once per comment? :-)

UNT90 · July 10, 2015

Are you effecting change within our athletic department by posting in every single thread some kind of negative remark about our BOR/AD/Pres/etc or outright stating you want the AD/Pres/BOR/etc fired or replaced? I don't disagree that it's time for change within the system, just in the method you and other posters are using to try to make it happen.

Well, then let me recap for the 100th time why I do it.

This forum is read by large donors (some of whom even engage in the exchange), members of the AD, and I would bet some members of the BOR and quite possibly the president of the university. This is my, and all other regular fans', way to communicate.

And its public.

I don't have the big bucks to effect change. This is the only avenue I have. Will it do any good? Probably not. But if it ever, just once, causes people like Fly, who do have said bucks, to pause and Maybe rethink some things, then it's all worth it.

Stan R · July 10, 2015

darn nah, brah

TIgreen01 · July 13, 2015

Fantastic. As with the other 100 times you've posted this, I've read and understood your purpose. In your quest to maybe turn the ear of one poster, the collateral damage on the rest of us is something you might consider. That's all.

Cerebus · July 13, 2015

And according to you getting a whole new AD staff will suddenly make everything better.

Yes. That is exactly what I am saying. Other things I expect to happen if we get "a new AD staff":

1) The university will find that missing 80 million dollars in the cushions of the presidents couch. "LOL, nothing to worry about, everything is totes fine" says a statement from the governor.

2) UNT Baseball will spring forth from the cracked skull of the new AD, and will instantly become so dominant that it will not only win the CWS in year one, it will also win the NCAA Lacrosse Championship, the Cliburn International Junior Piano Competition and Festival, the Nestle Recipe Competition, the next 3 seasons of Dancing with the Stars, and 12 Bollywood Oscars, including Best Bollywood Film and Best Bollywood Dance Ensemble (what can I say, they are great dancers.)

3) Unicorns will be found wandering the Discovery Park land. Since scientists will find out that not only is unicorn meat delicious, but the horns cure male pattern baldness, this will end our university endowment problems forever.

---

OK, lets get back to reality. Nice try at putting words in my mouth, but that is not what I said. What I am saying is that we DO need more money to elevate our program. We aren't going to get it from increased fees or direct university money. That means we need to get it from season ticket sales and MGC donations.

The responsibility to raise season tickets and MGC memberships rests solely on the AD. However the growth in those two, compared to the growth in new alumni, is aweful. I have no idea how a new AD would perform, it's hard to imagine that for $300,000 we couldn't find someone who could increase MGC membership by more than 864 in the same 12 years the University added 72,000 alumni.

GreenMachine · July 13, 2015

Fantastic. As with the other 100 times you've posted this, I've read and understood your purpose. In your quest to maybe turn the ear of one poster, the collateral damage on the rest of us is something you might consider. That's all.

When people stick their head in the sand and refuse to admit there is a problem with our AD and address the problem, they are doing more damage than someone airing their believes.

UNTFan23 · July 13, 2015

if people can't succeed at their job, they shouldn't be doing said job.

And thanks for issuing the standard RV company line. "Problems way deeper"; "if only you knew" The same line he has been issuing for the past 14 years, all the while without fixing the problem.

Just so you know, there is a word for that kind of crap. It's called EXCUSE.

And RV is the king of them.

You may see it as the "RV company line" but I see it as decades of inertia (apathy) that is the biggest hurdle to overcome. New BOR members, President, AD Staff, etc., will only get the school/program so far. I'd say we are better off than where we were when I started school in 1997 and still have a long way to go. A new AD staff (including a new FB staff?) might build initial excitement with the current fan base, but will it be enough to generate any excitement with the largely apathetic alumni base? That is the multi-million dollar question that no one can answer.

UNT90 · July 13, 2015

Fantastic. As with the other 100 times you've posted this, I've read and understood your purpose. In your quest to maybe turn the ear of one poster, the collateral damage on the rest of us is something you might consider. That's all.

don't like it? Don't read it.

Pretty simple.

You may see it as the "RV company line" but I see it as decades of inertia (apathy) that is the biggest hurdle to overcome. New BOR members, President, AD Staff, etc., will only get the school/program so far. I'd say we are better off than where we were when I started school in 1997 and still have a long way to go. A new AD staff (including a new FB staff?) might build initial excitement with the current fan base, but will it be enough to generate any excitement with the largely apathetic alumni base? That is the multi-million dollar question that no one can answer.

RV has had 14 years to change the apathy and culture of which you speak. Not only has he failed with these tasks, but has also failed to build a consistent winner in any of the big 3 sports.

And he will lie to you if it makes his job easier.

Time to give someone else a chance.

untjim1995 · July 14, 2015

don't like it? Don't read it.

Pretty simple.
RV has had 14 years to change the apathy and culture of which you speak. Not only has he failed with these tasks, but has also failed to build a consistent winner in any of the big 3 sports.

And he will lie to you if it makes his job easier.

Time to give someone else a chance.

Why would the BOR give someone else a chance at this point? They love RV--he is the ultimate budget master and nods his head without complaint at their directives. Plus, he gave us tailgating!!

He's gonna be here until he wants to retire, UNT90. The Super Pit will probably have a room named after him or a staute of him will be outside of Apogee, since he opened up tailgating here.

It is what it is...you just have to accept it or go away.

UNT90 · July 14, 2015

It is what it is...you just have to accept it or go away.

I couldn't disagree more with this statement.

You CAN accept it, hell, some even promote it, but you damn sure don't have to accept it.

Edited July 14, 2015 by UNT90

Side Show Joe · July 14, 2015

OK, lets get back to reality. Nice try at putting words in my mouth, but that is not what I said. What I am saying is that we DO need more money to elevate our program. We aren't going to get it from increased fees or direct university money. That means we need to get it from season ticket sales and MGC donations.
The responsibility to raise season tickets and MGC memberships rests solely on the AD. However the growth in those two, compared to the growth in new alumni, is aweful. I have no idea how a new AD would perform, it's hard to imagine that for $300,000 we couldn't find someone who could increase MGC membership by more than 864 in the same 12 years the University added 72,000 alumni.

You make an excellent point, that gets to the heart of our problem. I believe the university as a whole needs to do a better job of promoting our university throughout the region (local TV & radio commercials, billboards, more news stories. newspaper stories). Highlight the achievements of North Texas and its' students and graduates. I think over the last decade the UNT system has failed to build a brand that resonates positively with many people in our region.

UNT90 · July 14, 2015

OK, lets get back to reality. Nice try at putting words in my mouth, but that is not what I said. What I am saying is that we DO need more money to elevate our program. We aren't going to get it from increased fees or direct university money. That means we need to get it from season ticket sales and MGC donations.
The responsibility to raise season tickets and MGC memberships rests solely on the AD. However the growth in those two, compared to the growth in new alumni, is aweful. I have no idea how a new AD would perform, it's hard to imagine that for $300,000 we couldn't find someone who could increase MGC membership by more than 864 in the same 12 years the University added 72,000 alumni.

this is reason #1 that RV should be let go.

On a list that easily numbers over 25.

untjim1995 · July 14, 2015

I couldn't disagree more with this statement.

You CAN accept it, hell, some even promote it, but you damn sure don't have to accept it.

So you're going away then? Like the other 98% of UNT alumni? Its either or, pal...of all people, you should know that.

UNT90 · July 14, 2015

flyonthewall · July 15, 2015

So you get a dozen or so "big money guys" involved. You sell them a plan. You lay it out. It starts with building an athletics facility, then a practice facility. a dedicated soccer field, a women's softball facility on campus. You name the softball after one of those donors. You build a football stadium, partially on the backs of those donors. Then you have a golden egg laid in front of you in the name of Kuehne. He steps up for seven figures for the football stadium, after it is partially built. Then leads a committee that provides a dedicate practice facility for basketball, and much need upgrades to the super pit. I could go on and on. But it is not all crap with R.V.

You guys want wins, every body wants wins. But the facts are, these facilities are going to help in producing wins. Professional coaches help in producing wins. Am I happy with the results from the quarterback position that THIS coaching staff has recruited? NO.

Some of you think that some of us drink green Koolaide, only seeing the positives. Well guess what, you would be right. I am very proud of the last ten years and the advancements that have been made in North Texas athletics. I am proud of every cent I have donated and the visible tangible results that it has produced. Providing student athletes scholarships, world class facilities to compete in, practice in, etc.

Every day I drive up to that football stadium it takes my breath away. I have said it before, nothing makes me prouder than seeing my fellow alums out there on game day. Looking over the top of the student section on the other side of that field, and seeing future alums out there doing what I did not have the opportunity to do when I was in school. This thing is bigger than me, it is bigger than Rick Villarreal, Dan McCarney, the current board of regents.

This is a long term thing that we are trying to set up to enjoy for the 30 or 40 more years that I have to enjoy, that we all have to enjoy on this earth. One guy with all of his rants is not going to deter anyone off of the plan. To be excellent in coaching, competing, facilities, to give every coach the tools he or she needs to be successful, so that he or she can compete for the best recruits.

Rant on. We are still going to keep building.

UNT90 · July 15, 2015

Not a lot of competing going on, and unless it starts pretty quickly, we will be attempting to compete in the new FCS division.

As for coaching, the basketball hire is a disaster of epic proportions that has yet to be fixed, Dodge was a disaster, and the jury is still out of Mac, but they are starting to lean toward uncompetitive.

YOU personally have done great things for YOUR university. I just wished you demanded more from an AD that hasn't raised the profile of this program in the 14 years he has been in charge, has deconstructed a once proud basketball program and refused to fix a HORRIBLE hire, and has yet to hire a football coach that can put together back to back winning seasons.

UNTFan23 · July 15, 2015

YOU personally have done great things for YOUR university. I just wished you demanded more from an AD that hasn't raised the profile of this program in the 14 years he has been in charge, has deconstructed a once proud basketball program and refused to fix a HORRIBLE hire, and has yet to hire a football coach that can put together back to back winning seasons.

The profile of the university hasn't been raised ... like ... at all? You mean those all those bowl games (2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, & 2014) weren't real? Neither were those NCAA tournament games (2007, 2010)? I guess getting into CUSA wasn't a big deal? Perhaps building a much needed, brand new football stadium didn't mean anything to anyone?

Try not to trip over yourself while you continue to put down your own university.

Edited July 15, 2015 by UNTFan23