UNT lands UAB safety transfer Jakii Moore

[UNT90]

would have an offer list that we couldn't compete against.

Agree with everything but this. Go back and look at Atkinson's offer list.

It's not that we can't compete, because we have. It's that this coaching staff isn't competing, and that is a big problem.

Edit: upon further review, it seems I remembered Akinson having more offers than he actually did. Nothing to see here, move along. Lol.

Edited December 23, 2014 by UNT90

[H-towngreen]

Agree with everything but this. Go back and look at Atkinson's offer list.

It's not that we can't compete, because we have. It's that this coaching staff isn't competing, and that is a big problem.

Edit: upon further review, it seems I remembered Akinson having more offers than he actually did. Nothing to see here, move along. Lol.

I seem to remember Arky offering him last minute and it coming down to the wire where he would go

[Mean Green 93-98]

Agree with everything but this. Go back and look at Atkinson's offer list.

It's not that we can't compete, because we have. It's that this coaching staff isn't competing, and that is a big problem.

Edit: upon further review, it seems I remembered Akinson having more offers than he actually did. Nothing to see here, move along. Lol.

West Virginia offered Shavod.

And let's not forget that Kelvin Jackson was also a JUCO DT who came in and made an immediate impact (a starter from the time he arrived on campus).

Edited December 23, 2014 by Mean Green 93-98

[GOMG2013]

I agree we need immediate help, but any JUCO DT who would be an upgrade over guys like Dutton Watson, Sir Calvin Wallace, Austin Orr, and Syd Moore would have an offer list that we couldn't compete against. Same with bringing in a true freshman capable of being better than those guys right away.

Agree. Our DTs did a decent job in my opinion, and if they can improve on last season, they can be very solid. Just a little more improvement from Sir Calvin we can have an Abbe type player from two more seasons. Any JUCO that will be penciled in as a starter will be recruited by more than a few schools. I am still disappointed we could not land a JUCO DT or solid transfers from UAB.

It seems as if this fanbase is looking for the next Booger Kennedy. Its not that easy. Fans are Looking for a guy, just because he weighs 300+, and assuming success. And because we dont have guys that are 300+, some are assuming failure.

I have read comments about our DLine getting blown off the ball and blockers getting to our lbs. But when I go back and look at the games, I dont see that at all. Its just assumptions in most cases. We are talking about cusa. Theres not much smash mouth going on. It would be nice to have one of those quick, 300 pound freaks that can play NFL football, but they are rare. Lets not act like there is one or two on every team.

When I go back and look at the games, I see LBs out of place, reacting slow, and dropping back in coverage. I dont see a lot of them taking on blocks because our DTs were getting whipped.

I see DEs not making plays that were made last year. Teams were not gashing us up the middle.

Our unblocked LBs and DEs were getting out ran, taking bad angles, and getting juked. there was a huge drop off in our safety play. Both of them. The DT position may have had the least amount of drop off from last season to this season on defense.

[greenit]

Based on their action, or lack thereof, in JUCO DT recruiting, I have to assume they feel reasonably comfortable with the potential rotation of Wallace/Tauaalo at 1-tech and Orr/Watson/Moore at 3-tech. We have a couple of others that can rotate in there as well.

I am not any different than others on here that would feel better with a couple of 6-2/325lb DTs on the roster. At least we would have the option of having them compete for time. Most of the CUSA teams we face do not have power running games, so the slightly smaller/presumably faster DTs do not hurt us as much as when we face P5 or power running teams.

It seems pretty clear so far that the coaching staff prefers a 1-tech in the 290-300lb range.

[FirefightnRick]

.

.

.

Updated list of DT's that are either of good size..(280-300 LB plus) and are JUCO recruits, or of decent size with ratings out of HS and are committed to schools we are not expected to compete with for recruits.

Ark State....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/206962/waylon-roberson

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/204098/jake-swalley

UTSA....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/207135/jonathan-tuiolosega

ULL....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/200550/dequin-andrews

South Alabama.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/202045/roy-albritton

FIU.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/195678/richerd-desir-jones

Georgia State......http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/203801/julien-laurent

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/207105/dequeszman-kelley

Coloroado St...a kid from Martin HS...http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/194305/oshea-jackson

Memphis.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/203470/mike-edwards

Tulane...http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/199875/louis-wings

Old Dominion....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/177404/miles-fox

Southern Miss.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/202966/jauan-collins

Rick

[Mean Green 93-98]

. . . the potential rotation of Wallace/Tauaalo at 1-tech and Orr/Watson/Moore at 3-tech.

I think I've seen Orr at both DT slots, but hasn't he mostly been playing NT?

[BillySee58]

Like an offer list from the likes of ......

Ark State....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/206962/waylon-roberson

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/204098/jake-swalley

UTSA....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/207135/jonathan-tuiolosega

ULL....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/200550/dequin-andrews

South Alabama.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/202045/roy-albritton

FIU.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/195678/richerd-desir-jones

Georgia State......http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/203801/julien-laurent

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/207105/dequeszman-kelley

Coloroado St...a kid from Martin HS...http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/194305/oshea-jackson

Memphis.....http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/203470/mike-edwards

Tulane...http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/199875/louis-wings

Rick

I feel like in your mind I'm defending Mccarney fervently and you're exposing how these school with equal or less resources are pulling these DTs but we can't. That's not the case.

Like I said, any DT who could come here and start over what we have would have an offer list that we couldn't compete with. Better than the offer lists of the players you listed. You listing a bunch of G5-committed DTs (most with 3 or less FBS offers) doesn't disprove my point at all. Sure some of those guys could maybe be rotational guys for us next year, and the high-school guys you listed could maybe be starters for us down the line if they played for us, but none of those guys would come in here and be instant impact guys.

Now if you wanted to list a player committed to a regional G5 school who would challenge for a starting spot for us next year as a true freshman, here's one.

http://247sports.com/Recruitment/Zach-Abercrumbia-29606/RecruitInterests

Rice has a better recruiting staff than us, by a mile. They also have a little more to pitch than us, with their education, but they're also just better recruiters than we have

Again, we're not a good recruiting staff. Across the board, and not just at DT. But coming in and offering some DTs with no other offers is not some easy fix to our problems. We have to be able to win more recruiting battles. And good DTs are going to have more schools after them than, say, a good offensive guard. But either way, we need to win recruiting battles with more consistency across the board.

[BillySee58]

I think I've seen Orr at both DT slots, but hasn't he mostly been playing NT?

Orr played more 3-tech this year but was Abbe's backup at nose in 2013. Orr was able to stay more healthy this year, as a result, and I think he'll start next year at 3-tech and rotate with Syd Moore, unless Moore comes out and really has his stuff together this offseason and spring.

Watson was starting at the 1-tech/nose at the beginning of the year, but he was injured, maybe as a result. It's one thing to have these converted d-ends stay healthy while playing 3-tech, but we've struggled keeping them healthy while trying to play them at 1-tech/nose. I think Watson will be at nose this year, rotating with Wallace, but it's something to keep an eye on.

Edited December 23, 2014 by BillySee58

[BillySee58]

Agree with everything but this. Go back and look at Atkinson's offer list.

It's not that we can't compete, because we have. It's that this coaching staff isn't competing, and that is a big problem.

But that's my point. Not that North Texas could never land guys like that, but that this coaching staff as recruiters couldn't. Or at least I don't have confidence that they could.

[FirefightnRick]

I feel like in your mind I'm defending Mccarney fervently and you're exposing how these school with equal or less resources are pulling these DTs but we can't. That's not the case.

Like I said, any DT who could come here and start over what we have would have an offer list that we couldn't compete with. Better than the offer lists of the players you listed. You listing a bunch of G5-committed DTs (most with 3 or less FBS offers) doesn't disprove my point at all. Sure some of those guys could maybe be rotational guys for us next year, and the high-school guys you listed could maybe be starters for us down the line if they played for us, but none of those guys would come in here and be instant impact guys.

Now if you wanted to list a player committed to a regional G5 school who would challenge for a starting spot for us next year as a true freshman, here's one.

http://247sports.com/Recruitment/Zach-Abercrumbia-29606/RecruitInterests

Rice has a better recruiting staff than us, by a mile. They also have a little more to pitch than us, with their education, but they're also just better recruiters than we have

Again, we're not a good recruiting staff. Across the board, and not just at DT. But coming in and offering some DTs with no other offers is not some easy fix to our problems. We have to be able to win more recruiting battles. And good DTs are going to have more schools after them than, say, a good offensive guard. But either way, we need to win recruiting battles with more consistency across the board.

We have no way of knowing that. None. It's possible several of those JUCO transfers could start right away for us?

Rick

Edited December 23, 2014 by FirefightnRick

[UNTLifer]

Good lord, if Mac starts reacting based on what the fans think we need, then we are in big trouble. I keep seeing the likes of Atkinson and K. Jackson being brought up. Were they really that good? 300 lbs. isn't a magic number. I would take a cart full of DT's in the 6'4"/285 lbs. range that are athletic, but the P5 conferences gobble them up like a fat kid eating Oreos.

[Ben Gooding]

I am content with the DL personnel we currently have. That may just be bc I am expecting big things from Taaulo and improvement elsewhere. But we have depth and decent size. I truly think Wallace and Tauulo can anchor the middle for us and one or both have the potential to be all conference caliber players. There is depth behind them both and next to them on the DL. I think the DL will be a surprising bright spot on D in 2015.

[GOMG2013]

Lets look at some numbers...

2013 DT

Boutwell 20tks 1sack 1.5 tfl

Abbe 19tks 3sack 4 tfl

Lincoln 16tks 2sack 2.5tfl

Orr 5tks 1sack 1tfl

2014 DT

Orr 21tks 2sacks 3tfl 2ff

SCWallace 20tks 1sack 3tfl 2fr

Moore 11 tks 1.5sacks 3.5tfl

Linc 11tks 2.5sacks 2.5tfl

Not much fall off from 2013 as far as stats. If anything, 2014 looks a little better. Its just stats, so I wont say 2014 DTs were better, but not a big fall off like everyone assumes.

Our top two DTs are returning. They both had better years than Abbe or Boutwell's 2012 season. We should expect a minimum of 20 tackles from each of them, even in a rotation.

based on stats, Lincoln had an equal or better season in 2013. Not an improvement from last year, but a lot was due to injury.

We did not miss our DTs as much as the other positions. The replays and stats show the biggest fall off were DE, LB, and safety. 2 were addressed with JUCOs.

[UNT90]

West Virginia offered Shavod.

And let's not forget that Kelvin Jackson was also a JUCO DT who came in and made an immediate impact (a starter from the time he arrived on campus).

Ok, good to know I'm not going crazy. Only thing I could find was a write up by Vito early in his recruitment where we and Sam Houston were his only option. I thought he had multiple P5 offers when he signed.

[UNT90]

Good lord, if Mac starts reacting based on what the fans think we need, then we are in big trouble. I keep seeing the likes of Atkinson and K. Jackson being brought up. Were they really that good? 300 lbs. isn't a magic number. I would take a cart full of DT's in the 6'4"/285 lbs. range that are athletic, but the P5 conferences gobble them up like a fat kid eating Oreos.

The point is we CAN get JUCO DTs with P5 offers and HAVE gotten them in the past. It's just that this coaching staff, for whatever reason, ISN'T getting them.

So you are more happy with an undersized guy with no P5 offers than a 300lb DT with one or more P5 offers?

Got it.

You really do take your cool aid straight. No ice, no water, just straight power, right? Do you use cut straws? ;-)

[BillySee58]

We have no way of knowing that. None. It's possible several of those JUCO transfers could start right away for us?

Rick

Can we be for sure? No, of course not. But defensive tackle is the most relentlessly recruited position, by nearly all 128 FBS coaching staffs. If a JUCO player is good enough to have an immediate impact and be an immediate impact player and starter for a CUSA school, then many schools would want him, including schools from even better conferences than CUSA. Dutton Watson, Wallace, Orr, and Syd Moore would all have more than 3 FBS offers if they were JUCO DTs, IMO at least. Like you said, you can't know for sure.

You don't have to trust what I'm saying, and you can hit on these JUCO DTs without many FBS offers every once in a while, but relying on it to happen will catch up to you over time.

[UNT90]

Can we be for sure? No, of course not. But defensive tackle is the most relentlessly recruited position, by nearly all 128 FBS coaching staffs. If a JUCO player is good enough to have an immediate impact and be an immediate impact player and starter for a CUSA school, then many schools would want him, including schools from even better conferences than CUSA. Dutton Watson, Wallace, Orr, and Syd Moore would all have more than 3 FBS offers if they were JUCO DTs, IMO at least. Like you said, you can't know for sure.

You don't have to trust what I'm saying, and you can hit on these JUCO DTs without many FBS offers every once in a while, but relying on it to happen will catch up to you over time.

I'd just like to see it happen once with the current coaching staff. That would make me feel much better about our recruiting.

[Harry]

Good lord, if Mac starts reacting based on what the fans think we need, then we are in big trouble. I keep seeing the likes of Atkinson and K. Jackson being brought up. Were they really that good? 300 lbs. isn't a magic number. I would take a cart full of DT's in the 6'4"/285 lbs. range that are athletic, but the P5 conferences gobble them up like a fat kid eating Oreos.

Good post. JJ Watt is one of the best I have ever seen and he goes 6-4, 280. It's not just about being 300. Long arms, quick feet, strong hands all play into it but the nastiness factor is huge for DL. One thing about Booger Kennedy, he had incredibly strong hands and forearms...Coach Bill Michael who had been a lot of places in college football once remarked Booger had the strongest hands he had ever seen.

[FirefightnRick]

Good post. JJ Watt is one of the best I have ever seen and he goes 6-4, 280. It's not just about being 300. Long arms, quick feet, strong hands all play into it but the nastiness factor is huge for DL. One thing about Booger Kennedy, he had incredibly strong hands and forearms...Coach Bill Michael who had been a lot of places in college football once remarked Booger had the strongest hands he had ever seen.

JJ Watt is a defensive end. Who still happens to be 6'5" 289 lbs and ran a 4.7 at the combine.

Rick

[Ben Gooding]

Tackles for defensive linemen is the most irrelevant stat in football. Their job is to demand double teams and create opportunities for their LB's.

[meangreen15]

My HSO: I think this defense would be better if we could get JJ Watt

Edited December 24, 2014 by meangreen15

[GMG24]

Ben, you take your DL who don't make tackles and I'll take a line full of guys making tackles, we will play, and I guarantee you my team wins.

[Marty]

Ben is correct, the LB's should be your leading tacklers.

300 lbs is not the magic number either, they have to be able to make plays. My son played at a NAIA school in Oklahoma that had several 300 lb. DL's, they were at NAIA for a reason (not D1 caliber).

[BillySee58]

Welcome to @MeanGreenFB JaKii Moore (@Jakii_moore6) from Tulsa, OK (UAB). #GoMeanGreen pic.twitter.com/QNoPgmyix6

— Mean Green Athletics (@MeanGreenSports)

February 4, 2015