Meangreen Fight

The Alumni Pavilion is ridiculously insufficient for a typical good turnout for a home game which is about 70% of capacity. And considering we don't have a lot of fans that are ineligible to apply for alumni membership coming to games the 150 person capacity is shickingly small. I estimated the capacity as 300-500 before looking this up. The Alumni Pavilion needs to be more than doubled in size. - Bathrooms with 5 person capacity - Full Kitchen comparable to a restaurant with 250 person capacity - 8 to 12 TVs - 5,000 square feet minimum with over 1,000 patio space I believe we should have a watch party fund raiser for a big away game at the alumni pavilion. "Free" barbecue with valid alumni association membership and $5 donation to the Alumni Pavilion expansion fund. Get Rudy's and/or Metzler's supply the food. Kid's bounce house and play area outside. Also have food trucks outside selling alternatives to barbecue (or whoever is catering the food inside the Pavilion). Free Door prizes and a paid raffle for Club Seats and parking for the remainder of the season (5 home games minimally). https://meangreensports.com/facilities/alumni-pavilion/8 What do you think? Is the Alumni Pavilion sufficient right now? How much money could this raise? Would it significantly increase Alumni Association membership? A full kitchen also could provide an opportunity for hospitality management students getting a Food Studies Certificate a lab and a real world lab on game days and special events.

56.4% completions AND you missed part were he isn't on this 2023 team most likely even if Seth stays. 8/29/2022 Good game but it isn't like that was a full CUSA schedule that week of FBS vs FBS to choose a player of the week from 9/13 - you really putting a lot of value in beating up FCS Texas Southern; a BAD FCS program? 🤦🏽‍♂️ Again even with all that it is irrelevant to argue about a QB that wouldn't be on the roster. Nope not in the slightest. They were excited for the new coach. Attendance was down this opener because the program looked stagnantly mediocre under Seth AND Morris wasn't an inspiring hire nor are his primary coordinators.

"That’s not creepy at all." - Mr Bubble

I didn't expect Seth's best team to lose new to FBS 2014 ODU. I also did not expect Seth to lose to new to FBS 2015 Charlotte 49ers coming off their best season in 2018 and Seth's 4 year in 2019. We make too many assumptions with this program. We don't reload we do well just to maintain. Seth's led offense was trending stagnant especially in the passing and going to lose their most experienced QB. I believe the Vegas line is exactly the same for the FIU game with "better looking" loss against Cal with Seth coaching.

You can't expect FIU to be stagnant. And our roster did not improve, especially on defense. And Seth trying a new QB?... As mediocre as Aune was, he knew the system better than anyone on the roster so a drop off was very likely seeing how all the other QB tranfers he brought in crap the bed when given a shot. I expected FIU game to be a dog fight.

34 Makes sense striving for mediocrity, your projections aren't trending up. And that is with projecting games against UTSA and Memphis as toss ups? Aune is 34 according to what metric? It kind of irrelevant anyway because I don't think anyone was expecting him to come back and play better in Seth's system. Also without context like only ranking apples to apples; ie FBS quarterbacks averaging 25 attempts a game versus FBS oppoments (9 complete games) his ranking is probably not in the top 30% of quarterbacks. I think you are confusing his age with his ranking. They easily could have lost to the FIU game with Seth's staff and no QB playing as well as Rogers did. And UAB practice time omg 🙄 the execuses I don't have expectations of Morris. I would not have hired Morris. But I do know it would be silly to believe there wasn't going to be an upgrade in talent with Seth & company recruiting. Recruits want to go to programs that are trending up, good already up or doing something new to get better (scheme change, new facilities, new charismatic coach. The opening game attendance with all the new stuff going on should be interpreted as a lack of interest of what happening before. Even by the midpoint of your projections they let Seth go sometime during the season or at the end. And actually the only reason I mentioned Cobbs is because the leadership seems to think highly of them and retained him.

🤦🏽‍♂️ “essentially” that means Not 0.500. If we get to just over 0.500 vs programs newer to FBS than we are then you might have a legitimate question about our expectations. Then you factor in being 1-4 against UAB AFTER they shutdown their program for 2 years that 82-85 looks even worse. There is no way a program that has been paying their head coaches near the top salary in their conference most of the time and in new facilities shouldn’t have expectations to be 10 games over 0.500 in a span of over 160 games. Then you have people on this board 💩 all over Dickey’s 3+ season dominance of the Sun Belt yet questioning the firing of Littrel & staff? If your expectation is to be just below mediocre, what is the fun in following Mean Green Football. Hell I don’t expect bottom of the top 25 ranking every year but I think 9 win seasons and bowl game wins shouldn’t be once a decade occurrences. If most people supporting or leading program genuinely believe that Seth’s production should be the standard here, I would rather they dropped to FCS and make my game day experience cheaper.

Staff or staff and Seth Littrell? Who besides Bennett and Cobbs were worth keeping and why? Of course Phil is not going to trash the guys he worked with. How long being mediocre to bad is enough for you? The defense wasn’t good 3 years in a roll. And especially with what we’ve seen this year so far an efficient starting QB wasn’t on the 2022 roster. The important thing I took from the interview is what he said about TCU vs SMU. It seems beyond building football facilities the leadership had no real plan like TCU Phil talked about. If we did then maybe one of the coaches before McCarney or Seth have everything in place from a staffing standpoint as Morris does now. But even with all that there is no excuse for Seth being at 0.500 or below to younger FBS programs and a restarted UAB program after a 2 year shutdown. 0-1 against Charolette 1-1 against ODU 4-4 against UTSA 2-2 against FAU 1-4 against UAB I don’t know what hopes you thought were realistic had for a Seth & company led Mean Green team in 2023 or beyond. So far I think they might squeak by a FIU team but only if the defense tackles and he gets a QB like Rogers or better. Remember Rogers committed to UNT January 9th long after Seth was fired. I can't believe Cr1028's got 6 positive reactions to 4 other than positive reactions. Some of us fans really have low expectations or place faith very easily in anyone who speaks positively of the Mean Green Football program. 🤷🏽‍♂️

Not really to me. I realize how bad this program has been consistently and the underwhelming moves they made to make the dramatic change that needs to happen here. It isn't about just more money for a coaching staff. I think the only good thing Morris had done was placing a lot of value on the support staff (assistant coaches, scouts and etc.).

Good game, I doubt we could beat either of them this year. Maybe Navy if we can tackle in the run game and just out score them by scoring faster than they can typically.

If you want to win a community over than has a lot of other options to spend the sport’s entertainment time and money on I agree ANY CITY is a “lost cause” when you consistently produce a subpar product. Moreover it look from the outside you are striving for mediocrity not greatness. Now greatness is extremely hard to achieve but striving for it will usually make you good. Everyone who is a sports fan can sense when an organization is really trying to win. Fans in the entire DFW community will come from all city limits when they see we are trying. As I am reading this I see Terry Bowden being interviewed on the Paul Finebaum show as the coach of ULM of all places. We need a coach that can get on national media platforms with their resume. Why Coach McCarney was the ONLY coach on that level we have hired tells Denton and everyone else we are just hoping to win.

TCU and SMU aren’t “bigger schools”. Their leadership cares more and have consistently invested more for over 50 years. Texas Tech has a student body the same size as ours. The only universities in the state bigger than ours Houston, Texas A&M, and UT Austin. We are the flagship university of a system. I believe that if we want to distance ourselves from being UT Arlington North (UTA has 40k students like us) we have to be serious about football and stop making conservative head coaching hires. We also can’t afford to give a mediocre coach too much job security. If FAU can bring in a guy like Lane Kiffin, and Liberty hire Hugh Freeze we should be hiring coaches with resumes similar to theirs. Kliff Kingburry, Gary Patterson, Sonny Dykes, and Tom Herman are all coaches with resumes would have signaled to fans we are serious. We always have excuses for not pursuing these guys.

I would argue that lacking and lack of improvement in "basic execution" is a culture thing. Our defense looked worse from game one to game two even those FIU scored fewer points. The offensive production should been motivation enough to believe that holding them to a couple of field goal attempts in the 4th quarter would have put them in the position to win. FIU wasn't some offensive juggernaut, they were held to 14 by FCS Maine. But against UNT they score touchdowns whenever they needed to. Defense had every reason to play better but played worse.

@MGNation92 did a great job spelling out our primary issue and I think some just glossed over it. At the end of the day I don't believe the leadership here really believes that winning big time here would generate the revenue a school of our size in a highly populated area should. From now until we have a 10 win season, in a run of a least 3 consecutive winning seasons with bowl win and conference championship our head coach hire has to be a culture changer. Morris may end up being a fine coach, decent recruit and etc but he isn't a culture changer. A known commodity coach that is a culture changing coach is going to cost. They are also are going to be looking at the program very critically before the accept the challenge. They will be interviewing the AD and top people in the athletic department as much as they are interviewing him. They are going to have options and aren't going to be money whipped into coming here when they know they won really be supported. @MGNation92 touched upon this but didn't pose this exact question. Does the Adminstration believe in the program growing into a sold out 45k seat stadium? More importantly does anyone here believe that they do give all the decisions made in the last 25 years other than building sufficient facilities and hiring Coach McCarney? McCarney was the only coach that seem to address the culture problem here somewhat. His problem was he underestimated how difficult it was going to be to recruit to his offensive system here and underestimated the value of an in Texas/Oklahoma recruiting network. I really believe that if the leadership show they were really aggressive and serious about winning they would be able to tap into all that wasted potential MGNation92, Coach McCarney, and many others on this board often mention. A Heart of Dallas Bowl isn't going to cut it and let's be clear, it wouldn't cut it anywhere if program hasn't been the final AP Top 25 poll of the season EVER. (Hayden Fry's 10-1 Mean Green was 16 in Coaches Poll) So we need to stop looking at students, the Denton community or factors outside the program that are beyond an AD and coach's control. You also can't fault the working class fans who really can't afford to be throwing away money and get slapped in the face for almost 20 years consecutively when they hope for a measly bowl win or conference championship in mediocre conferences. If the Adminstration does believe enough to even attempt publicly make big swings; Deion Sanders, Gary Patterson, Sonny Dykes, Lane Kiffin, Hugh Freeze, Turner Gill, Kliff Kingsbury or etc do they believe in the Mean Green?

It is no deeper than administration and big donors being on board with striving for mediocrity. Like others have harped on before no serious program gives any coach 2 extensions while never winning bowl game, having a 10 win regular season, or conference title. (Most programs you have to do 2 of those 3 minimum to get 2 extensions) It is that striving to be medicore is good enough mentality that gets people scolded for dreaming about trying to make Coach Sanders an offer while at he is still at the FCS level winning. This leadership's decision making has beaten us down that even dreaming about trying hard or making a big gamble that makes sense it is like we are in the Shawshank Redemption of fanbases.

If you can I want people to go to this video and imagine they are speaking of a head coach and coaching staff until about minute 11:25. Where do we go from here? I think if this is year 2, starting off like this you have to fire him. The QB waffling is disturbingly idiotic. So many shortcomings of this team can be directly attributed to the coaching. I don’t even fault them for the poor tackling. Everything but the pure effort on the field is coaching. And now with the transfer portal first year coaches shouldn’t get as much leeway when it comes to not having to talent on par with the middle of their conference. We can’t fire him after year one. But his job and the AD’s job should be open come mid/late September 2024 next year if they come out remotely looking like they have these first 2 games.

So what you are saying again is the administration set the new coach up for this by retaining an essentially lame duck due to past performance Seth Littrell in 2022? Without the conference upgrade and big realignment looming, I would have understood holding on to Littrell. Because the job wasn't going to get harder with better conference competition. If you were staying in CUSA with same competition, you could sit back and say "hey all we have to do is beat UTSA to get over the hump". But thinking Seth was going to put together a team to beat SMU (we didn't know they were leaving so soon back then), UTSA, Memphis, Tulsa, and Tulane (or at least 3 of these 5) in one season in the near future to win the AAC was insane, if they actually believed that.

I am so happy @Green Crazy dug this up. And I very intrigued to read detailed statement of why people like @meaniegreenie are still dead set against the mere possibility of making him an offer. An offer that would/should have come after he won consistently at the FCS and brought loads more quality recruits to that level than Jackson State received in the past. If the majority of people are so dead set against bringing someone so unique for the DFW area to the program, it makes me understand mediocre hires for most of the time we have been back a the FBS level. The coaches that have gotten fired from UNT all haven't gotten another head coaching job since being fired. Omitting Mac due to his age when he was let go, none of the coach fired here had resumes that allowed them to get another shot at a FBS head coaching position. Moreover, only Dickey has gotten a P5 coordinator position which in the hierarchy of jobs is one the few that would be looked at as a higher position than head coach here. This program needs a culture changing coach not just a good recruiter and X & O strategist. I thought Mac was that, but he was lacking in the recruiting and player development departments. So once he changed the attitude and the talent from the old regime left, the cupboard was bare. Coach Sanders would not have come here without proper support for player development coming with him. He also would have been great recruiter. So I don't know what wasn't to like or what value 2022 Seth Littrell offered in comparison except saving money. But as the saying goes; you usually get what you pay for.

Begrudgingly I have to agree and I hate it. But it would eliminate all the excuses for our program. Eventually you need to climb out of that hole and be respectable. Nothing is guaranteed and I think programs like Vandy and Northwestern will have their dead weight status hurt them soon.

None of the Big 12 schools in Texas want SMU in the Big 12. It isn't beneficial to them in any way. I would also assume the Oklahoma State isn't big on adding another school in DFW to the Big 12. The last time any of them (besides TCU & Baylor) scheduled them non-conference was 2016. It has been a decade or since any of the remaining Big 12 schools in Texas/Oklahoma scheduled them. Baylor was the last one to play them in 2016. TCU probably would play them just as infrequently today as Baylor does if TCU had gotten into the original Big 12 lineup. And I don't think it's a coincidence the small private schools are the ones that played SMU most recently. If PAC 12 was really thinking long term and willing to go short on revenue short term for long term market share they would add multiple schools in our state. I would add SMU, North Texas, UTSA, and SDSU. Memphis and Tulane are just too far east and they are smaller markets. That line up of schools gives the PAC 12 real exposure in Texas and recruits that want to play back in their home state at least once a year P5 options beyond the SEC or Big 12. We already have history of playing at night anyway and that fits right in with the PAC 12's timezone.

These two comments point to the bandwagon sports culture in DFW. I had to stop buy additional season tickets because I couldn't get friends to come consistently FOR FREE. We don't win enough nor are even stacking wins against big brands consistently (even 2 let alone 3). Even if you count a win against SMU as big we 1-7 against them in the last 8 years. If were just 4-4 in an 8 year span against SMU our program would be in a more respectful place in the minds of CFB fans in the metroplex. The only local team that can consistently expect 90% capacity at its games is the Dallas Cowboys. And they are they are in the most valuable sports franchise in the world according to Forbes list in 2022. So them selling out consistently is because they are a state/national/world brand as much as they are a local brand. And Jerry Jones (like him or not) had to build/rebuild them into that as even they weren't consistently selling out games right before he purchase them. And winning was a HUGE part of that. In CFB you build a programs value chiefly by winning and there isn't away around that. And the bigger you win the bigger the impact on the program long term. 'Stack a few big wins on top of each other then you have something. That was biggest bone I had to pick with Seth's multiple extensions. He did not stack big wins together and therefore his impact on growing the program was minimal. Going 0.500 or better against SMU in 4 years of contract should be the minimal requirement for an extension that includes a significant raise. Seth did not do that and you could very well argue that without an undersized Mason Fine playing well beyond anyone's expectation his performance wouldn't have warranted one extension let alone multiple. How many new fans showed up for the La Tech game for the Mean Joe status unveiling just to be disappointed? Nice facilities only go so far. For instance Vandy is never going to take recruits away from LSU, Alabama, Tennesse and Georgia with a nicer practice facility (even if they got a billionaire to pay of building it and maintaining it). Recruits still want to will and maximize their potential to get to the NFL. A losing program without coaches known to help player progress to the NFL isn't getting the best bang for its NIL buck no matter how nice the facilities are.

This year has been crazy and I think they will opt to take this scheduled bye week. But if they wanted to schedule something on the fly, who is available?

One more TD for the good guys on this drive and we got this!

Man it feels good just to have a lead in the second half against at FBS level opponent.

You were right. People just tend to kill the messenger bringing bad news.