PlummMeanGreen

Such budget records and numbers are supposed to be a matter of public record, but after LogoGate, who the hell knows anymore. 'Twasn't that long ago that we were told we had equal or better budgets than anyone in the SBC. And not for one minute do I think FIU and FAU will suddenly out of nowhere have budgets larger than most schools in CUSA. On this particular matter comparing our budget to others in the SBC, most of us would still need to see some (what should) be available documented facts on all that. One fact still looms quite large: A 5 year old NCAA D1-AA football team, ie, FAU, beat a UNT bowl team last year and did it.............in our house. Like many (who still haven't come out of their closet concerning DD's inefficiencies and his having a job way over his abilities); anyway, what many thought before the "Big 4" games this Fall, ie, TU, LTU, FAU and FIU while among those 4 came 3 losses and "way too narrow of a win for a team that turned the ball over 8 time"; anyway, all of this pretty well substantiated many of our worst fears that we've really been fartin' in the wind with (overall) recruiting the last 3 years, comparatively to most who we played this Fall. The proof is in our performances against "5 year old Florida schools now in the SBC, and (what has become annual happenings the 8 years DD has been at UNT) non-stop OUT OF CONFERENCE losses, jjpfootball. I am sure DD comes back next Fall due to the fact that we continuously kept tagging on extra years to his contract. Yet most could predict UNT can't (or just won't) choose to buy out his contract, causing us to lose one pretty important year for a school with what we now have going with venue's construction could now do just like UTEP, that is, go out and get a higher profile head football coach. UNT has done this before & we can do it again. Yet for a school that says it would like to raise significant monies to build a new football stadium all this with DD will cause a most un-timely delay. You see, a football program that has spiraled toward last place in the SBC (and thus toward the "Bottom Ten" of NCAA D1-A) will not be perceived as a good investment from fans (or would-be donors) all the way from the most wealthy to those like many of us on GoMeanGreen.com that are limited with our cash gifts. But its not only NT Athletics who will bite the Big One over an extra year with DD as NT's donations will probably dip across the board with every organization on campus (except the College of Music, of course). This is what happens at most NCAA D1-A schools once their athletic support is split right down the midde over if they think their present head football coach should be here or not an additional football season.. Yet still strange as all get-out that the UNT short list of new head football coaching candidates when DD was hired had only one name on it---namely his. Who in the UNT adminstration or BOR's droppped the ball over that? His NT hiring 100% influenced by the KSU connection even came after DD's one year as SMU offensive coordinator for crissakes'. Before his one year at SMU, DD was merely a journeyman assistant football coach at numerous NCAA outposts. (Just check your media guide for proof). Most don't get to be head football coach in NCAA D1-A under such circumstances unless you have a family member (his dad) pulling strings and that done with (then) NT AD Craig Helwig, a Kansas State alumnus. North Texas officials allowed this hiring coup before anyone on campus or Denton could ask: NOW WHEN IS A SELECTION COMMITTEE FROM THE UNT COMMUNITY GOING TO BE FORMED? So now we are all paying for this "the fastest hire in NCAA football history" with (basically) a college assistant football coach who has a head football coaching job and one who has operated under the disguised successes that playing SBC football teams under .500 the last few years has given him. Most of the same people who were livid with DD's radio bashing the last few years have (seemedly) suddenly taken on a, "oh well this is just what we do at North Texas" attitude now. You see, apathy and bad SBC teams have been DD's main allies for 8 years and now he probably has only one of those left since the SBC is passing us by. I still just don't get it with all this. If this weren't so counter-productive and sad for those of us who've been around a few decades--it would somehow make for a good comedy movie (I guess)? Hanging on to DD one more year will be quite expensive, but even moreso public relations-wise with fans and alums once this season is over and they all sit down, get their thought processes together and begin putting the pencil to the paper with all this that some already have done. Yet why have so many already (and suddenly) forgotten all the radio broadcasted NT Employer Bashing, NT Fans & Exes Bashing and the public broadcasted shaming of UNT by DD on the radio airwaves making it look like our school was on its last dime? THIS ONE RADIO BROADCAST TOOK THE CAKE: Remember the nationally broadcasted ESPN radio interview when DD chose to "talk down" with the his broken record jumble of "we have our backs against the wall in Denton" rather than "talk up" the $40 million that was at the very moment of that national broadcast being spent at our Eagle Point Campus? Yet another radio broadcasted golden moment that turned into a lost opportunity by DD--but, he (once again) chose to go with the Negative Ned side instead. . What part of any of this is incorrect to all of you who think we need to give this man more time to make us even more mediocre (and a mediocrity that is now rearing its ugly head in the lowly SBC)? Our recruiting the next few weeks will die a slow, painful, natural death with DD in his upcoming 9'th year since the veil of the SBC's (most always) under .500 competition the last few years has now been lifted--a disguised charade that (basically) had us backing into 4 bowl games because no one else would have been over .500 to do so those 4 years. Another who posts on this board is now direly concerned with our recruiting the next few weeks as well. Why? SBC schools from out of state (including non SBC schools Tulsa and La Tech) are showing up on Metroplex area newpapers DFW area top 100 lists except one: The University of North Texas. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> AGAIN, SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME & OTHERS WHO HAVE POSTED SIMILAR THOUGHTS, WHAT PART OF ANY OF THIS IS INCORRECT? I STAND TO BE CORRECTED ON ANY OF MY POSTS & WILL ADMIT TO BEING WRONG (if someone/anyone can prove that I and others on this subject are "in deed" wrong). GOD BLESS TEXAS!

We will be in the SBC in the foresee-able future much longer than we will want to be, folks. There is nothing else shaking out there now and if there was, who would want a football program that has lost to 5 year old FAU 2 X's in a row as it is? Again, the first time we lost to Schnellenberger's FAU we were even a.........(cough, cough)..............bowl team. You remember, the one that played CUSA's 4'th place USM Golden Eagles in the NO's Bowl?!?!? This thing has bottomed out, folks, has been spiraling that direction for the last 3 year and we have some very smart people on campus who can't see it. Sadly, it could get even worse next Fall for the Mean Green in light of recent trends; and FWIW, what else do we really have to go by than trends and past bad habits? Even more the reason we have to do more than just dominate the SBC "every" year, but we need leadership that will do that PLUS beat OOC schools like, well, you know all the ones we should have beaten in the past (including 2 of those this year)? GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Interesting post with some good points IMO...I do wish more fans/alums seemed a bit more concerned and bothered with where all this is going to take this football program if we don't cut all this off at the pass soon. That past confuses me almost as UNT keeping an 8 year football coach as far as under .500 as he is and now toward the bottom of NCAA D1-A, which most college football fans in America would subtely suggest to our powers that be: You happy with Bottom 10 now? Remove the facade & veil of SBC success, NT Administrators..........Your Texas taxpayers and MG Club donor$ are watching your $tewardship of Their Monies.

But medpilot21, you are accepting of "butt in the arse" losses to..........Tulsa University, Louisiana Tech, and generic black for 2 schools not yet fully D1-A, ie, Florida Atlantic U and Florida International Airport U (although not a loss, with 8 fumbles we barely beat a team that has only been open for business 5 years, just like FAU)?!?! What was that old rock song: Blinded By the Light?!?!? All this with DD is just way too strange a scenario for this college football fan, it really is. GOD BLESS TEXAS!

To borrow an icon quote from FFR:

Is it possible some of you who might be fortunate enough to have Bobby Ray's email address might email MG61's post (and others similar on GMG.com) to him with a cc to Chancellor Lee Jackson? Surely, both don't have their their heads buried in the sand at the same time with this most crucial problem we haved at UNT at a most crucial time that is only going to get worse (and expen$ive); especially at the Sun Belt Conference (or NCAA D1-A "Bottom 10" level). For the life of me, in 30 plus years of my being a Mean Green football fan, I just don't understand the overall apathy, non-concern and just general acceptance of the direction of this spiraling southward football program under a man who has hit his talent plateau at UNT and even at the SBC level. Whats the deal here, the more you give to UNT the more accepting you are of DD mediocrity? This from a hardy handful of our best fans is almost as amazing to me as our NT leader's (apparent) hypnotism by DD; and this from a group on campus who must really think the SBC is right up there with the Big 12 or something. Simply amazing this is to many of us (but mostly sad from the standpoint of what the longterm results will be). We just don't seem to do well at all in the athletic hiring business at UNT from what I've seen in those 30 plus years, either. Proof of that? How many the last 30 years get better jobs after they leave UNT? GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Because football is King in Texas. . Those of us who remember good ol' SWC basketball in the 1960's (when NTSU could easily beat most SWC teams back in that day) can look back to those days, laugh and remember how SWC basketball in that decade and before were just a filler between Fall and Spring football; except for when ex Krum citizen, NT grad, NT Athletic Hall of Famer Doc Hayes had some good teams at SMU in the late 1950's for a short run. Then some guys who I got to see even on their freshmen basketball team over at Houston's Delmar Field House, ie, Elvin Hayes, Theodus Lee, Ken Spain, Don Chaney and others led by Coach Guy Lewis of the University of Houston showed the state of Texas that integration was really not a sin at all and how good integrated basketball could really be. UH later had their Phi Slamma Jamma teams of the early 1980's and then the goold ol' SWC redneck boys (duh?) finally said to themselves: "Hey, we can be just like Cougar High (as they called UH--not me) are doing and then the SWC boys (unlike NTSU/UNT who once again did not step up to the plate to advance athletically--which seems to be an on-going habit of ours especially in the area of hiring) started spending money on basketball, ie, dramatically increased their basketball budgets then thats when Arkansas started emulating UH and then the rest of the SWC boys finally followed suit (and built their own versions of the "Super Pit" as well) as icing on their cakes. But still..............football is King in Texas; it pays the bills at schools like UNT and is another reason we have to make sure that our football program has a bright and progressive future. In fact, with today's NCAA D1-A, it is imperative that a school (esp. in the Sun Belt) gives itself every opportunity to be successful. You also mention DD and facilities, well, if he were still here once we open a new football stadium (2009?) we would still have a coach (in light of most recent trends) who is still trying to reach .500 in W/L's. In NCAA D1-A, a coach who has been given 8 years and is still no where close to .500 would be questioned by 99.9% of NCAA D1-A admininstrations and for sure by 100% of their fans and alums. Yet if (amazingly) DD were still here in 2009, he would be going on his 12'th year as a head coach in Mean Green Country and (again) with the trends we now see--still be under .500. Will many give $100, $200, $500 or more to the MG Club , buys 4 or more season tickets for SBC mediocrity, ie, NCAA D1-A "Bottom 10" mediocrity in 2006? The answer to that question is something those at NT who are force-feeding all this on way too many fans and NT alums (who deserve better) will just have to wait to find out for themselves. Surprises many that those who have invested thousands into this seem most content with Dickey Ball, Dickey Fan Bashing, Dickey Employer Bashing and (in general) DD Mediocrity. Looks like recruits are now also getting wind of the obvious that DD's overall W/L records blatantly stands out to tell all. Yet, I wonder how long till our multi-thousand dollar contributors stop writing their checks to support a spiralling football program? Again, in 40 plus years of following NCAA Division One football, I've never seen the kind of head football coach's scenario we are smack dab in the middle of receiving at NORTH TEXAS. NORTH TEXAS: Bring us your poor, your needy and not so talented and we will give them a life time job (question no one about doing such and who knows, they may even make the NT Athletic Hall of Fame based on number of years they were on the NT payroll--not so much based on talent or ability). GOD BLESS TEXAS!

illuvious32, you speaketh the truth, buddy.

Gimmee' a freakin' break...Comparing Fulmer to Dickey is like comparing a Highland Park mansion to a double-wide. DD will (probably) get an additional swan song year because he has the NT BOR chairman (who has committed the greatest sin of an employer by getting too close to an employee) in his back pocket and he knows NT Exes apathy will give him that extra year to continue to show to all that he is still an imposter as a NCAA D1-A head football coach. DD has to depend on one NT Board of Regent, NT Exes lack of power to do anything and lousy SBC football teams to hang around Denton for 8 years when most NCAA D1-A coach's would have been terminated after such a poor showing at ULM 5 years ago. But enter the 7'th Calvary, ie, a poor SBC conference of teams who stay under .500 and in the Bottom 10 to buy DD even more time even though he is not any closer to .500 in W/L's now than he was post ULM loss 5 years ago. HELLO?!?!?!? This is not the North Texas mode of athletic operation that I started (proudly) supporting as a student back in 1973--sorry it has become acceptable to many now. The North Texas community allowed the KSU connection to pull a bloodless head football coach's hiring coup on us back when DD was hired in the first place (after his 1 year as SMU's OC), that head football coach now kicks NT Exes and Mean Green fan's asses anytime he gets a chance to (and on radio to boot) and the KSU connction boys are laughing their heads off at a whole bunch of North Texans who are powerless to do anything about this (for now) as we have to continue to accept mediocrity for another year or 2 as our football program's trend will continue to point south. One man on campus is allowing all of this to happen according to some of you on this board. One man should not have that much power at a Texas public university who has tax-payers watching. Our recruiting next February will be called "the best in our history" but the last 4 have been called that, too (in some cases) but with those recruiting hauls we still couldn't stay on the football field with Tulsa or La Tech this year (who we at one time thought we were actually ahead of in most of the last 4 years)? Oh I forgot, we lost to SBC "not yet D1-A" FAU for the 2'nd year in a row, too. Truly, what am I missing in all this that has so many of our best fans in a catatonic trance of acceptance of this? SO YOU WANT DD (and an extra crucial year of a detour of this football program)? WELL....HE'S ALL YOURS! (so enjoy all of our alma mater & fan bashing for another year) ***My investment into all this and a DD-led program ceases as soon as I fulfill my pledge. It's not much, but its something and I know others who give much more who will do the same and that is no smack board empty promise, either. GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Charles, I know you follow NT recruiting as close as anyone on this board and beyond so I am now concerned that you are beginning to be most concerned about this year's recruiting. In light of how Tulsa and La Tech handed our heads to us on a silver platter, I think we may have all been a bit unrealistic with just how our recruiting has been the last 4 years; of course, many of us tend to wear those green-tinted glasses each recruiting season a bit longer than we sometimes should which serves as yet another UNT veil of what the truth and reality of the situation really is. We all know we have some good talent on our football team, but where our NT recruiters have let those Mean Green football players down is that they just didn't sign enough similar talent as to give them a chance to beat any OOC schools on our schedule (and now those last few recruiting classes have reared their ugly head in light of losses to TU, LTU and most of the SBC this Fall). I will continue to be a broken record with my feelings about the direction of this football progarm until there is a change at NT because the veil has (finally) been lifted off my own eyes as to what we've have right now in light of those (here we go again) 4 most "tell tell" signs of our status quo with games versus FAU (2'nd loss in a row), FIU (a squeaker of a win although they had 8 turnovers for crissakes) AND the icing on the cake for this NT Ex which was the cause of my light finally turning on with all this with DD, the home Tulsa loss (our worst in all of our history) and to La Tech who has nothing in the area of football facilities that compare to ours and best to my knowledge, they have no blueprints to even show that they will have such facilities any time soon, either. I guess the non-chalant "oh well" attitude many of our alums seemedly have adopted with all this considering DD and the fact that UNT football has now spiraled toward being #117 in a 117 member NCAA D1-A concerns me as much as DD's leadership of our football program itself. All this also shows me that someone on our campus has done one helluva' good snow job on some pretty damn good football fans. Yet, I realize I was just as blinded about all this myself until recently when we played those 4 strategic games I listed above which I feel are very strong indicators of our football program's direction. I don't think that gets turned around in 1 or 2 years, either, especially since the rest of the SBC has (obviously) passed us by. You know, in my 30 plus years of observance of NT athletics, I know many of us feel we don't have a very good track record at NT for hiring athletic personnel and proof of that is how over that span of time so few NT athletic hires get jobs better than the one they had at the University of North Texas; so in that regard, I would hope NT officials might understand why many of us are questioning why there would be a continuance of Coach Dickey on the NT payroll knowing if he were to spend the next 1, 2 or 3 years in Denton he would still most likely not get even close to a .500 W/L career record. Folks in 3 years, that would be giving an NCAA D1-A coach "11" years to still be under .500. As I said, our track record of hiring (and too many times keeping too long on the payroll) at NT is a poor record at best. Hardly the kind that other schools would ever use as their own model and I don't know of any who have ever had a coach on their payroll 8, 9, 10 or 11 years staying under .500 in that period of time. Take out our SBC competition (or...........if we would have been members of the WAC or CUSA in the last 8 years and what would we have had then as a cumulative W/L record ? So if NT wants to extend all this an additional year in light of what the results of this one football season has brought to full light what we've really been doing the last 4 years in the recruiting wars, then I suppose they will do just that; but after next year they themselves will have to face the cold stark reality that UNT has further entrenched itself as an SBC school that is even no longer competitive in the SBC, which means we will (once again) be spiralling toward that #117 slot in the 117 member NCAA D1-A. That will be a major disappointment for those who have stuck with this football program year in and year out for a very long time. Even longer than some NT grads who are presently on the NT Board of Regents if truth be known (and I hope the truth will always be known at UNT). IN CLOSING... Another thing campus decision-makers may want to consider is this: UNT will play all of its toughest SBC foes in 2006 on the road except one and that will be, uh, against Coach Howard Schnellenberger's Florida Atlantic University team that makes a return visit to Fouts Field and I'm most assured (insert sarcasm) that we will get our first (ever) win over them in 2006, right? GOD BLESS TEXAS!

OK, to get back on track, I posted the above epistle because 4 games in the 2005 football schedule (TU, LTU, FIU and FAU) completely changed my mind with the direction I feel the NT football program is headed under the leadership of one Darrell Dickey. I guess people can and do change their minds from time to time. To me, it would be a positive (not a negative) to replace DD as head football coach in light of the conference neighborhood we are in. Last time I felt as strong about their needing to be a head football coaching changes were (strangely enough) the year Corky Nelson was released and even the year Dennis Parker was terminated. I have one longtime fellow alum (and friend) who would even verify that in both cases. That fellow alum knows that some strongly worded corespondence from myself and others who post on GMG.com to the NT Board of Regents helped to enable those 2 coach's last years at UNT. And was seeing 2 NT employees getting fired someting I was proud to have played a very, very small part of? Hell no it wasn't a proud moment (how could it be), but all this with the University of North Texas has always been much larger than any one football coach or any one Big Donor. I think we have seen more than anyone needs to see with on the field and off the field situations with our present football regime that should really not surprise anyone if there were a change of direction with NT football, but that's a decision that will come from others--for certain not any of us.. In my opinion (which I believe this board is still all about); anyway, I feel NT needs this change now in light of what we have been told by NT officials inasmuch as they want to take this football program to higher levels than where we are now. Talk with Rick V and he will tell you his dreams for NT, but Rick V and Company are doing more than just dreaming, too. How's that? I think the proof of the pudding in that is what is presently happening at our Eagle Point Campus on those 200 acres. I don't think once finished, that the SBC is what they even have in mind for our future league home with such facilities that a virtual tour video suggests we will have; allthough I think most of us will agree that the SBC will be home for awhile until many other factors improve at our main campus. SBC domination coupled with OOC wins is essential for UNT. IMO, we are not getting there with this present NT football coaching staff. Yet if NT officials want to continue to convince our fan base and cause us all to believe they are serious about going to the next level, I suppose they have some very important decisions to make in due time with the kind of personnel that can get us there. Now what their idea of what that proper due time to make changes is going to be is the $60,000 question. GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Neighborhood? My neighborhood consists of quarter horses, goats and sheep! All right now, don't go there!

Funny post... Hey, MS, one man's happy ending is another's tragic ending? GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Harry/Cerebus, I simply am responding to this one: meanrob, good to see that you still proclaim yourself the self appointed high judge of posts concerning NT. You are the one poster on GMG.com I always make a habit not to read or really care what you have to say with what seems to always have a dark cloud hanging over it or for damn sure one that is nearby. You hang around NT Athletics another 20 years then get back with me with your opinion; but I probably still wouldn't pay much attention to them then in the style you would choose to craft them. I actually was an NT student when we were ranked in the Top 20 poll once or twice, so it really has been done before in Denton and I guess maybe history will one day repeat itself. BTW, all of that that you criticized "meanrob style" was a theoretical scenario so I guess you might say that there really is no source or person at all. So FWIW, I guess you kind of missed it altogether with that one. Sorry to disappoint... And how unfortunate you continue to think so lowly of the potential of your collegiate alma mater's football future. Not really very becoming of an ex Ulys Knight Spirit Award winner some might even say. Suggestion: You don't read my posts and I'll continue to not read yours. (I just moments ago received an email from one who said I might want to respond to your latest gem since it involved a post of mine; hence, the reason I read it at all. And I'm glad a board was created where you would ultimately feel more comfortable. You know, I extended an apology to you about 5 years ago on a matter that came up on this board, sorry it didn't seem to take as far as you were concerned, but that ball is in your corner now--not mine. Peace... GOD BLESS TEXAS!

And who the hell is this sports-writer Chuck Cox? What publication did this article come? How many years has he been following (closely) all that has been going on in Mean Green Country that he can make so bold a statement with one giant swath of his keyboard about what (or who) is best for NORTH TEXAS? Does this (out of nowhere) genious know what conference we've been in the last 5 years and how many (under .500) teams we've had to beat (with an uncanny number of times the ball bounced in our direction during those 4 years to beat many of those under .500 SBC teams) in order for NT to get to New Orleans? Hey, Mr. Cox, we are not in the Big 12 down here in Mean Green Country. Are you somehow confused on that part of all this? Didn't your country cousin DD tell you about any of that part of the equation? Is this the KSU Konnection @ Work Again? Did Cox also go to Kansas State U like Craig Helwig, Jim Dickey and others who have pushed to a job in a level of college football that is probaby one division too high for DD (at least at the position of head football coach)? And how are all these people gravitating down to Texas from the Land of Dorothy and Toto, too? Anyone see today's article in the DMN on SMU's Phil Bennet and how an ESPN network sports person said KSU should go after Coach Bennett as their guy? Wonder if sportwriter Chuck Cox might have seen that article and wonder why an NT coach who has taken his team to 4 bowl games is toward the bottom of KSU's "seroius list" of contenders to take Bill Snyder's job? I am trying to count all the bowls SMU has gone under Bennett? Chuck Cox, do you know something longtime fans of NORTH TEXAS have completely over-looked? Mr. Cox, do you by chance have an NT football media guide? If so, before you make your next big expert hot sports opinion on what (or who) is best for North Texas' football future, please read that media guide if you can squeeze in the time. You say "despite the grumblings of a small group of Mean Green fans?" Have you been counting? How many of us are there? Small group? I tell you what, if you can find 1,000 NT students who like the directoin of NT football in the worst conference in the USA, I'll stop posting on this subject; but for those NT students who know anything about football, I don't think you'd find half of 1,000 who would give DD a thumbs up with his leadership in a conference that has lulled many of our NT Exes to sleeep. NORTH TEXAS: Where Status Quo Seems To Also Be A Member of the SBC And Is Also Beating (Down) Many of Our Elect With All This Concerning the Direction of NT Football (or lack, thereof). PS: Is there something some of us are missing with all this that has many thinking we will have a 180 degree turnaround next year even as we play our toughest 2006 SBC foes all on the road? All those SBC teams who also seem to be improving their football programs? OR..........has DD single-handedly secured our $50 milllion Big Donor and yall are just not telling?!?!?!? What is it that some of us are apparently missing with all this? Please do enlighten... GOD BLESS TEXAS...

Deep, you've been around this a long time, too, and you recognize things happening that those who have been around the NT college football scene observe and recognize that (in deed) changes do need to be made. There is much more to this than meets the public eye or what is even posted about on GMG.com. about this football season and the other prior recruiting years leading up to this 2005 football season. I don't know if present NT officials will have the kahunas to do what others did with the next few coach's I've listed below when the stakes were not nearly as high as they are now with UNT Athletics, football specifically since it pays most of the bills (or is supposed to at non BCS locales). After all, this is a football program that needs to be running on all cylinders by the time we move across Interstate 35-E to a new 35-40,000 seat football stadium. The cylinders seem to be all gummed up at this moment in time. This football season under DD so reminds me of Corky Nelson's last year (1990) as NT's head football coach; Dennis Parker's last year (1993) as head football coach at NT and Matt Simon's last year (1997) too. BTW, none of those 3 ex NT coach's ever publicly said anything negative on their radio shows about their employer, our facilities or its fans, alums and supporters. I know, because I listened to most every one of the aforementioned coach's shows (and attended many of Simon's in person at the Denton Radisson and those broadcast by KTCK "The Ticket" in the first year or so (if memory serves me on that). Corky Nelson: In 1990, Nelson's last NT football team went 6 & 5; we saw the largest crowd in Fouts Field history and we beat SMU in front of that crowd. Did all those things became keepers for Corky's future at NT? Not hardly, because NT officials saw the program was on a roller coaster ride and not going much further with Nelson in charge. They knew the right time to pull the trigger with that NT football regime. NOTE: NT once had another coach in its past who was fired from SMU after he led his team to a 7 & 4 season in his last year on the Hilltop. So its not always about what happens in the same year some coach's get the axe as it is moreso what has happened over a period of time AND...........if the program they are leading is showing any semblance of postive trends in the athletic environment (conference) it is a member. Dennis Parker: The main thing with Parker was that NT officials decided to go for the gusto and try to get attendance numbers in the 1994 season in order to get back to NCAA D1-A. Dennis Parker's leadership (or lack of connection with our fans & alumnus base) would never allow us to get the attendance with the ex Texas HS FB coach as head football coach from what I heard from an NT official back in that day. So they terminated a very fine Christian gentleman, one Dennis Parker, but his religion or being a "good guy" had nothing to do with his firing. He would not be marketable in a year NT was going to do somthing quite granidose, like try to get back the the upper division of NCAA Most of us wholeheartedly agreed with our NT officials decision in removing Parker because we didn't think we'd have a snow balls chance in hell to meet NCAA D1-A criteria with him as head football coach at NT. Who would buy tickets (en mass) to watch what they had already seen under Parker? Matt Simon: Coach Simon became NT's first coach since we got back to NCAA D1-A classification. He was absolutely perfect in the beginnning. He had great rapport with the fans. He was very complementary of our fans and alums which (only) helped him, his football team and UNT officials get their average of almost 20,000 per home game in 1994 that would meet NCAA D1-A. UNT was back in the football bu$ine$$ again. THEN.........things went south almost beginnning with a fumbled punt return vs Texas A & M at Texas Stadium before NT's largest home crowd in its entire football history, approx. 50,000. Coach Simon was said to have become bitter with UNT AD Craig Helwig because our AD would not give him a complete 100% "wussy" football schedule as to help him get some wins so he could make his next move up the NCAA food chain. Unfortunately, Helwig gave him just the opposite schedule-wise. Some thought Simon had what was the equivalence of some kind of breakdown toward his career end as NT football coach. On his last national recruiting signing day get-together, he would hardly talk to NT fans and alums who were in the NT Athletic Dept. to hear of his recruiting haul because he had become so bitter with Helwig and most everything in general. GOD BLESS TEXAS...

I'll pass that on, shaft, but the other aspects he said of ULM are right on as I think most were topics on this very message board when ULM was on the brink of dropping football, sports or just dropping back down to the 1-AA SLC (which now has teams ranked above ULM &, uh................UNT. In other words, Dollar General beat J.C. Penny's last night at Fouts Field. What I think he was telling me was that UNT is a school that had much more going for it (re$ource-wise) than its Homecoming opponent of last night. Who could disagree with that? But I still defer to the epistle on page 2 of this thread that suggests that ULM is just a BB in the bucket compared to what NT's football situation has been evolving down to the last few years. GOD BLESS TEXAS...

100% totally agree with you, UNTSportsGuy.... ...but I think many would be surprised how a how profile name coach at NT could spring board our program up 2 or more levels rather quickly just based on his name ID. Heck, look how UTEP was ranked anywhere from 90-100 in 2004 pre-season and how in just one year (2005) with their high profile Coach Price; anyway, how the Miners were in many 2005 summer college football magazines Top 25 check lists? Think Coach Price being in El Paso had a whole lot to do with that? To a large degree, we saw Hayden Fry do something similar in a totally different era and at a much smaller NT campus (enrollment-wise) and a Denton County that had only 99,000 population (compared to 560,000 citiznes now). What the high profile Hayden Fry did at UNT (after all) landed him a Big 10 job that he also turned around its football program after the Hawkeyes had had decades of a losing legacy. GOD BLESS TEXAS...

If I told you, UNTSportsGuy, that one very high profile TV sports commentator thinks the NT football job is a Top 25 program just waiting to happen and that he is aware of a very high profile coach out there who is interested in the NT head football coach's job, how would that make you (or anyone else reading this for that matter) feel about the present situation we have happening now)? So do we give all this another year or 2 or 3 or 4 with DD knowing that the results still won't get DD to .500 in light of the trends we are now seeing? Yet if we knew that that someone out there who was willing to come to UNT and was one who could take us 2 or 3 steps higher than we've ever been PLUS one who waiting in the wings to come to Denton, do we shoot down that golden opportunity while it is an opportunity? Or do we give another coach a year or 2 to try to get to .500 when that coach lost ground with that this Fall even in the Sun Belt Conference? FWIW, we have given one other NT coach about 17 years to do such, that is try to get to evem remotely close to .500. Is that just what we are all about at NORTH TEXAS? Do yall know of any other NCAA D1-A school that would use NT as their model in such things? I for damn sure don't know of any businesses that would. GOD BLESS TEXAS...

Maybe so, but I don' know many who will continue to invest into that kind of operation, UNTSportsGuy. GOD BLESS TEXAS...

FFR, I agree with you on RV's pro-active efforts under difficult circumstances. I just wish he had more control or autonomy and if that would be the case, I think he would have been and would (today) be even more effective. IF YOU ARE HAPPY WITH SBC MEDIOCRITY, NO OOC WINS, PAST ANNUAL BOWL LOSSES TO CUSA'S 4'TH PLACE TEAM AND IN GENERAL..........STATUS QUO, THEN DON'T READ THE REST OF THIS... BUT... One concern that a long time UNT fan and fellow alum of ours expressed to me just yesterday was how we at NT are (sadly) beginning to find satisfaction with only meeting the required 15K per game minimum average; and that even in the 2004 season after 3 bowl games in a row (with last years barely above 15K per game average) and now this year. He the pointed out to me that it was the acceptance of this mediocrity that seems to be breeding (with warp speed) among way too many at NT. He had an answer on how to solve much of this as far as football was concerned, but I told him that our (seemed) "blind leading the blind" acceptance of mediocrity might possibly even shoot that down (for now), that is, unless NT officials will just sit down, start looking at the real facts as they are happening in the athletic environment we're in, ie, the SBC (and then start projecting what may be some not so good upcoming figure$). The NT powers that be might also want to now start comparing our recruiting efforts to those we previously thought we were even with, ie, TU and La Tech; and now even some in the Sun Belt? Have any of campus decision makers even thought of going outside our campus to an unbiased college football expert to get their opinion on what they see to be happening at NT with the conference we are in? They will surely never find that among many on this board as there seems to be a weekly 180 degree vascillation of opinion on the direction of our football program and that based too many times with the mood of the moment (or if DD spoke to or was nice to a GMG.com poster at some recent time or another). Then he pointed out to me another "tell-tell" sign with our acceptance of this "just gettting by with the bare minimum" mentality at NT is how some alums are even excited with how we played, uh, the "University of Louisiana-Monroe" a close game at our own Homecoming. He pointed out to me just how low the ULM Indians were ranked in Jeff Sagarin's rating system (with some in NCAA 1-AA now ranked above both ULM and NT and some in both our former conference--the mighty 1-AA Southland Conference). Then he added just how low our entire conference is ranked compared to others not classified at the NCAA D1-A level. BTW, the lowly ranked ULM Indians play for the SBC football championship at ULaLa next Saturday. How much bad ink and laughs will this Lafayette Bowl game bring everyone connected in the SBC; you know, when they see a composite W/L record of all the teams who are in it? Amazing how one coach has been able to excel as long as the rest of the SBC stayed (with lack of a better word)...p-a-t-h-e-t-i-c <>*<> I defer to 2005 SBC team's W/L records as recent further proof of that. GOOD GRIEF! Then our fellow NT alum pointed out these facts about the team who beat us last night when he said: "You know, we are talking about a football program that pays its head football coach (Weatherby) about $60,000 or so a year, a program with about a $4 million athletic budget and a program that was within a gnat's whisker of dropping football 3 or 4 years ago. OUR FELLOW NT EX WAS JUST LIKE A BIRD DOG AS HE JUST KEPT ON A-POINTIN': Well, he then................pointed out to me that ULM was even now showing up in recent Dallas Morning News Area Top 100 list and the University of North Texas was not. He even offerred up a new theory pointing out to me that maybe the reason DD and gang don't reveal who we are recruiting annually is that they don't won't our NT alums & fans to know how schools like Tulsa University and Lousiana Tech (who we assumed we were even the last 4 years until they dramatically showed us other-wise); anyway, he pointed out just how those 2 schools (and others) have been kicking our butts on the recruiting trail each of the last 4 years (and even in our own DFW backyard. As much as I wanted to disagree with what our fellow NT alum was saying--I couldn't. NOTE: I told him we still had some darn good football players in Mean Green Country, he agreed but he also pointed out to me that they just didn't have enough surrounding them (due to now obvious recruiting shortfalls the last 4 years); that is, they didn't have enough to complement their excellent talents as to help them become successful in what Jeff Sagarin says is a very low ranked NCAA D1-A Sun Belt Conference. Finally, he pointed out to me that way too many NT alums will just go along for the ride, bury their heads in the sand, and just buy into all this mediocrity or status quo business. Still he was most concerned how he felt many of our NT elect seem to think DD will be just hunky dory as long as he gets NT football (only) back to the level of SBC competition. We both even laughed at those now pushing for WAC membership knowing that we would have finished toward the bottom of the WAC this year; you know, right along with their newest members who came from, uh, just which "NCAA 1-A" conference? Anyone else out there think outsiders, sports media types, would-be recruits (and some NT coaches who know they don't really have to do much at NT to be successful and become long time employees) will just start calling.............. all of us who actually support that modus operendi in Mean Green Country, uh..... Stepford Eagles?!?! Question? What did our fellow NT Ex say that was not incorrect? "If you set low goals, you will surely meet them." (Dr. Norman V. Peale) GOD BLESS TEXAS...

ULL.........home field advantage.

I believe it was a H/C game against Stephen F. Austin (over 20,000 real attendance) either the year Corky Nelson got fired or maybe the year before. Of course, 15 years ago, we had about 8,000 less NT students and Denton County was a bit over 250,000 population. Now we are around 32,000 enrollment at NT and (as another alum pointed out to me) there are more who presently live in Denton County (approx. 560,000) than the entire state of Wyoming. One might then assume that a larger NT student enrollment and a Denton County over twice the population as it was when Corky Nelson was around might eventually translate to larger crowds no matter what level the opponent we have or how low (in the 100's) they are ranked in the Sagerin ratings.

With GoMeanGreen.com having received as many bytes as a few million per month in the recent past as I recall hearing from one of you, I think the internet is more than sufficient for most any subject, Rick. I think one told me it is during football season that GoMeanGreen.com has the most views (which only makes sense). We all know how in the past we've heard of those on campus who have said they "never" read this board, but for sure many times many of them always seem to know its content to the extent that one might have to question those "I never read THAT board" comments. The fact remains that since the veil has been lifted with DD's disguised SBC successes of the last 4 years with a stark reality that has surfaced after recent poor performances against 2 SBC Florida schools (neither yet even fully D1-A as of Homecoming Day at NT) PLUS large point differential losses against 2 schools (Tulsa U and La Tech) that many of our NT fans and NT alumnus base have (somewhat) used as barometers of just how well we've similarly recruited the last 4 years (you know, our 4 bowl years?); nevertheless, all this culminating to the harsh cold reality that this football program under Darrell Dickey's leadershp will virtually be un-marketable for the 2006 football season and will undoubtedly and most likely stop the membership momentum that the 2005 Mean Green Club was impressively (and admirably) beginning to have. The question that many in the NT community will have (even) during Homecoming weekend is do we have the kind of leadership at the University of North Texas who (first of all) can..........or will know just when to pull the trigger on all this; and that before we lose such a sizable amount of support with a fan base of which 4 bowl games in a row has hardly caught its imagination or noticeably increased and improved the turstile numbers at Fouts Field. So you all enjoy the next 2 week's football games, and even if we win or lose, we still have 8 years of a below .500 record by DD, recent bowl game losses to CUSA's "4'th"place teams and 4 strategic losses this Fall (2 from Fla. & TU/LTU) as solid proof and evidence that this NT football program under DD is showing no improvement and going nowhere. Our football players deserve better. If being the "best of the worst" is what floats our NT leadership's boat, then they can sail out to sea by themselves on that boat because I know a growing number of many who will no longer be on that boat. So have a nice homecoming football game at Fouts, fellow alums...it will be the first one I will (relunctantly) miss since 1973. This NT EX (Class of 1976) just cannot watch what is happening with NT football anymore under present leadership and trends. GOD BLESS TEXAS (and NT Exes, too)