PlummMeanGreen

I think what the "tiny privates" have missed more than anything are the 10-15,000 traveling fans they could expect in their home stadiums every other year from the SWC schools who are now in the Big 12. Even Baylor back during the Grant Teaff era had a pretty good traveling fan base. Imagine if NT had had the same traveling fans from those schools coming to Denton every other season? In many ways, don't big crowds begat big crowds which would have helped build the Mean Green fan base? And with NT's enormous constituency, (most likely) we probably would have been able to build the kind of fan base that would not have had to depend on those other schools bringing thousands of their fans to Denton as the tiny privates did. I think most would agree that TCU has done the best job at their Amon Carter Stadium turnstiles post-SWC split.

REVISED (with corrected spelling) How convenient that he chose one of our state's 2 flagship school's message boards to show his arse as to what kind of NT Ex he is. And he should not soon forget the fact that he is still an NT Ex whether he likes it or not and one who seems to want to be yet another front-running sorta' college football fan (which are a dime a dozen in the Lone Star State) with "only" the, uh, "2006 defending NCAA national champions" as his newly adopted team It really is a lot easier (I presume) to follow an established winning program, but those who jump on the bandwagons of those kind of programs should also keep reminding themselves that those programs are not where they are now because they (out of the blue) and with their having gone to another school have suddenly jumped out of their own school's foxhole and jumped into another school's (foxhole). It's one thing for an alum to not be over-joyed with his alma mater's direction, but its another thing to diss the very school that once gave this young man a golden opportunity for a damn good education that most of us had to pay tuition out of our own pockets to attain.

Well............to quote Little Richard (especially on DD's W/L): GOOD GOLLY! MISS MOLLY!

Location: Texas Year: 1836 Situation: Texicans versus the invading army south of the border, ie, the Mexican army Some Key players: Sam Houston, Mirabeau B. Lamar, William Barrett Travis, Stephen Fuller Austin, James Fannin, James Bonham, Jim Bowie, David Crockett, General Dickerson, Deaf Smith, the Twin Sisters (2 cannons given to the Texicans by the citizens of Cincinatti, Ohio. for the mission at hand), Santa "the Napoleon of the West" Anna, General Cos and, of course..............................Jose Cuervo, you are a friend of ours, especially at UNT of late. Key Appointment With Dialogue Few Today Are Aware or Have Read: : General Sam Houston: "After many sleepless nights and weeks of constant mental agony and anguish on the subject, it is you, Colonel Will Travis, that I choose to lead our boys at the Alamo! ................................................................... As any close follower of college football would know, this game was decided on the Texas HS recruiting trails from the last 3 to 4 years. The entire 2006 season will be decided under the same criteria--lucky for us we are in the SBC, but anyone else think that even if we win a 2006 SBC championship that this football program needs to show marked improvement by finishing within the Top 50 football schools of NCAA D1-A? FWIW, I think recent champions of the WAC and even the MAC have more than finished inside the Top 50. Hopefully, our elect will soon cease the acceptance of finishing high in the final SBC football rankings, but still finishing anywhere from #90 thru #117 AND then..............with more than a hardy handful of NCAA D1-AA schools finishing higher than the SBC football champion (whoever that would be in any year). But for this game...........it doesn't help us at all that UT is the defending NCAA Football National Champions. Yet at UNT during the 2005 football season, we saw the results of our recent years on the recruiting trails with most defining or tell-tell "where is our program now" losses to Tulsa University and Louisiana Tech. IMHO, we have a few outstanding players on this Mean Green football team (just as we did last Fall), but this group (unfortunately) will not have enough talent surrounding them in Austin this Saturday beginning with the 11:00 AM kick-off. Closer to this kick-off, more of you are now beginning to post your own concerns of our being able to keep this game respectable. The gap between schools such as most of the ones in the Big 12 versus the rest of us in the non-BCS (which still exists whether one calls it non-BCS or not); anyway, the gap is becoming dramatically larger and, in fact, so large that I wonder if UNT will ever be able to get close (again) to Top 25 football schools as far as being respectable on the gridiron against such in the future; especially as we look at our recent past, the trends of what our leadership seems to be most comfortable and content and toward the top of our recent history, UNT's non-success against BCS schools. .............................................. We can all hope for a Lake Placid style miracle in this game versus the Texas Longhorns and don't we all like those David versus Goliath endings, but most of the time I think most would agree (even on GMG.com) that football games at the NCAA D1-A level are decided on who has the most and best talent and most of the time all that is decided on the recruiting trails each Winter starting with our Friday Night Heroes at Texas UIL 1A schools all the way up to 5A schools. Just for fun, wonder how our 1968 Mean Green football team led by Mean Joe Greene and a bunch of future NFL'ers would have fared versus this 2006 UT football team but.................there I go again, bringing up our higher profile past.

REVISED First of all, kudo's to the UTA president for having the 'nads to say and I most liberally paraphrase him: "There's nothing wrong with being a commuter school." FWIW and to all those critics out there who think "commuter" is tantamount to having some kind of Biblical disease, anyway, UT-Austin is a commuter school (if we use today's standards of students living on campus compared to those who do not); but anyway...........UT has had pretty good success in athletics of late, and has been pretty successful as an university starting with their origins in the late 1870's for starters)? Come on, folks, Arlington, Texas, will soon have the Dallas (Arlington) Cowboys as part of its community and Denton, Texas, won't. Arlington, Texas will soon within the confines of its city limits have the newest and most modern stadium in the world (with a sliding roof --WHAT A CONCEPT in this greenhouse era of multi-100 degree summer days which have become common in our north Texas summers--HELLO! TOM HICKS AND THE TEXAS RANGERS--YALL LISTENING?!? Anyhoooo............while we of UNT (along with Dentonites and those of us who are former Dentonites) are trying to find some"ONE" who will really go outside the box, invest into our present product and be our own green-tinted version of T. Boone Pickens and provide for Mean Green football one helluva' big opportunity to get out of this (seemed) annual near-Bottom 20 & SBC co-existance while being a NCAA D1-A school that still has a track inside its football venue. With our stadium (probably) still being the most visilbe edifice to commuters off Interstate 35-E. And this venerable limping ol' lady that we still keep trying to polish when we all know you can only polish a t--rd just so many times without getting ridiculous about it. Even more to the point: : If Denton, Texas, America, in decades past had had a Tom Vandergriff (a real bonafide civic mover and shaker) as one of its leaders(and FWIW Denton has "NEVER" had such a visionary and from all accounts I don't see one emerging as of yet), I really believe UNT would (at least) be a school that would be a helluva' lot further ahead down the road of NCAA D1-A than where it is today...............instead of our constant attempts of trying to sweep past (much) higher profile successes of Mean Green football under the rug and go back to the womb, athletic-wise). No matter how hard some today may try to convince us, a win over Middle Tennessee still doesn't have the power-punch of a win over the University of Tennessee Volunteers. IN THE RED........... We need professional fundraisers at UNT, folks, and after 116 years of our school's existence and still having (only) $40 or so million in the entire UNT System endowment, I'd say we have not been very successful in hiring professional fund-raisers who can (and will) get off our campus, go out and get the, uh, RBT's..........ie, the Really Big Tater'$. I guess our having no fore-seeable replacement for Fouts Field is further proof? How much UNT has raised toward the new stadium fund as of today might even be a further hint that we will (in deed) still need a Big Donor for a new stadium at Eagle Point Campus OR...............for this new stadium to ever having a chance of getting started and finished B4 some UNT leaders (present or near future) with non-UNT degrees decide we need to tone down all this NCAA D1-A talk and business in Denton, Texas--Home of the Mean Green. Some may also wonder what our answer willl be to Texas Department of Transportation officials when they announce to UNT that they now need their frontage property adjacent to Fouts Field and (1 or 2 A.D's later) UNT still doesn't have anything but (more) talk and those (forever) new stadium blueprints to show T-DOT officials? Think that will delay T-DOT in getting their frontage property near Fouts Field? I don't............... ............................................................................... Meanwhile.............the city of Arlington, Texas, will probably have already hosted 2 Super Bowls while its just more of the same in Denton, Texas, America...........

Just got on the board first time today to read the earlier thread. Hope you have more good news after your next visits, Charles. Take it easy and relax a bit, eh?

You take the cake, Emmitt! How damn funny a post! And, uh, "moral of my, uh, "PMG" post? Uh, well..............................................not long (and redundant) enough, you need rainbow colored paragraphs and small, large and largest lettering mixed throughout as well-----But I will say this---you definitley have all the potential in the world. PS: And do keep a close and watchful eye on those wild and crazy party hogs from SMU!

Rarely would any network that televises said bowl encourage 2 schools from the same state to play each other. Seems the TV folks prefer to match a U.S region versus another U.S. region which would only makes sense (and cents) when it comes to getting those all important Nielsen ratings (which helps them get TV sponsors for the next year). Of course, there could and would be exceptions due to conference finishes; like if in a particular season UNT won the SBC and SMU, UTEP or Rice finished whatever they would have to finish in the CUSA standings to get to the Big Easy, but (traditionally) networks would prefer to not have such an intra-state matchup.

REVISED THURSDAY AM Sad but true, KingDL1... Losses to La Tech and Tulsa (our worst home loss in history) pretty well told some us that even after bowl games that most our recruiting efforts during the DD Era have been just enough to beat schools like Middle TN, ULaLa, Arkansas State and........oh wait a minute here, these are all schools in the Sun Belt Conference now aren't they? So to you young gun alums some free advice: Don't spend too much of your valuable family or quality time thinking UNT leaders will advance this athletic program much further than we've seen the last 2 or so decades. Don't look for too much more grandiose advancement for MG football in your next 30 years of following all this because our alma mater (truly) has a history that suggests that it won't. NOTE: Of course, if UNT's version of a T. Boone Pickens (who most of you say we don't have out there or at least you're not aware of it if we do; anyway, if such an athletic donor for UNT were to step forward with a huge announcement of a mega-milliion$ donation all this changes most dramatically and for the betterment for all concerned and I think most would agree that we are all concerned). We make a giant step forward then retreat 3 or 4 back has been our history at UNT. FWIW and IMHO, our best time to have made the big jump upward & forward would have been following the Mean Joe Greene and Hayden Fry eras. Well, that wasn't mean't to be because we changed style of administrative leadership at UNT following those eras. There was much lip-service support for UNT football following those eras to be more specific. So check your football media guides if you need a refresher course to see just how we did follow those higher profile eras and even the Fry era since it was the most recent (as compared to the Joe Greene era) AND............... to see how UNT officials have spent money on athletics or, moreso, merely allowed UNT varsity athletics to have just enough budgetted monies to stay on life support. At UNT, we have earned our present status (athletically) because this is the direction NT Exes & Mean Green fans have been given by our leaders who have all the power & decision-making options to hire those who would lead us. Looking at many of those hires of the last 30 plus years makes some of us grateful that we still have intercollegiate athletics at UNT's main campus. Again, I defer to your gettting out your media guides for further proof on that. (Lets not even bring up MG varsity basketball in any of this discussion). UNT officials can ask for all the monies from those, ie, the gr-UNTs (or troops if you will) till the cows come home and they seem to have that donor's list down pat each year although this group of donors haven't built any new stadiums last time I checked. Wonder if UNT leaders have figured that out, too? So does that possibly mean that maybe there needs to be more "new" names on future UNT donor's list? You know, just like we need more "new" faces to fill those other 15,000 empty seats at Fouts Field most any year? Yet it still is our UNT leaders who hold all the cards. It is our UNT leaders who have the "A" list of potential donors, ie, the kind of donors once such a donor(s)write the Big Check can play an enormous part in helping to take Mean Green football out of this annual NCAA D1-A #90-#117 co-existance and to the Promise Land of upwardly bound football schools who finish in the Top 50 every year. The other part of the equation is for UNT leaders to hire "proven" heavy-hitter collegiate fundraisers who fully understand the fact that they probably need to spend most of their time out of their offices and off campus (probably even outside the city limits of Denton, too) and such fundraisers who understand the art of smoozing the Big Donor types as to get them to turn loose some of their big bucks and who knows, maybe even get a "well located" major college football stadium named after themselves leaving such an honor as a legacy to their own family and to, uh, (more specifically) the University of North Texas, ie, the 4'th largest university in the sovereign state of Texas. .

Happily single, happily divorced, happily no kids (which equals no child $upport) although I do have many nephews/nieces I dearly love......... So seriously..............I do have some time on my hands and even when I don't but want to express an HSO on why we of UNT should not accept a co-existance in the subterranean part of NCAA D1-A...........I will most definitely make the time to do so!

REVISED ON WEDNESDAY DG, I think we would all prefer our alma mater's football program be a living legend (a la UTEP?) and such a program of legend-status that would clear and soothe the minds of the many of us who have followed all this for many decades now, yet have truly expected much more (as comparison to what we were doing on the gridiron during most of the decade of the 1970's). FWIW, I'll take a win over Tennessee over Middle Tennessee any day of the year (or decade). OK, FELLER'S...FEEDING FRENZY TIME WITH THOSE AFORMENTIONED THOUGHTS! .......................................................................... OK, I'll add my .02, too, a la drex... 2 Things Needed @ NORTH TEXAS: (1) We will have to come up with our own version of T. Boone Pickens because it will have to be such a Big Donor with a very BIG DONATION that helps to catapult us out of whatever this is we are right in the middle of now. IMO, I think we have taken another step backward with recent higher up hires starting with our "non-pro-active" for varsity athletics Chancellor, one Mr. Lee Jackson. FWIW, Norval Pohl had a passion for athletics and UNT varsity athletics benefitted from that. NOTE: Hasn't our own history shown us that UNT presidents who really only "lip-serviced" suppport for Mean Green athletics proved to hurt our program rather than help it? DON'T NEW UNT HIRES ALWAYS COVER THE ATHLETIC QUESTION PRETTY GOOD? In order for UNT officials to ward off numerous (early) strong "anti" opinions with their recent UNT presidential hire of a woman (and non-Texan), couldn't new presidential hire advisors train a monkey to say: "We must have a strong athletic program." (Well, since its officially been said.........please show us the money and prove it, madam UNT president). Doesn't UNT's LogoGate and the attitude shown from campus from one of Lee Jackson's boys with the email that was mistakenly sent to one of our own board's posters sorta' tell us the kind of attitudes that may exist in other areas from our decision-maker's committees? Could it be a more of the "tell em' out there what they want to hear but still stick with pre-determined agendas? (2) SOMEHOW/SOMEWAY..............WE MUST GET OUT OF THE BOTTOM QUADRANT OF NCAA D1-A as in, uh, TOP 50 or just forget it all and go back to NCAA D1-AA of which present attendance averages at Fouts Field more resembles that level as it is. 1-AA is last resort, though. For a program like UNT, we will have to have the Big Name Coach (again) to get in the living rooms of the kind of Texas blue chip recruits who can get us out of our annual #90 thru # 117 co-existance in NCAA D1-A that too many on this board seem to be just hunky-dory with. BIG NAME COACH? How did UTEP leave its multi-decade's "basketball school" only reputation to gain Top 25 in NCAA D1-A football in only their 2'nd or 3'rd year after their hiring of the Big Name Coach? When was the last time UNT was ranked as high? Sorry to say this, but we now find ourselves toward the end of a 10 year plan with DD that is hardly getting anyone's attention even in our own state of Texas and that after 4 bowl games as an SBC champion; albeit we did lose 3 out of 4 of those against CUSA competition. In fact, there is doubt in the Realistic Department of a hardy handful from this board and beyond of how we will fare against SMU who has had (what?) one winning football season in how many years now? Why would a UNT football program after 4 bowls and what would be expected decent recruiting classes following such have to even worry about our SMU game in a few weeks in the first place? Did big losses to Tulsa and La Tech make some pretty big statements about what we've really been doing the last 3 in recruiting and even after SBC champion hosted bowl games? Many of us have just seen much better at a higher profile and there is no one on the UNT staff today who can convince us that beating the SBC/Bottom 10 for our "success" is where its at for the 4'th largest university in the state of Texas. Have some from campus also been suggesting to us how NT Exes should be content with SBC championships but don't let those very low end of season finishes among the other 117 school be of any concern? SBC championships and a bowl win with (at least) such a season-ending finish in the Top 60 would be more like it, now wouldn't it? Shouldn't any NCAA D1-A football conference champion be (at least) inside the Top 60 football schools of NCAA D1-A or is that asking a bit much in Denton? How high have WAC champions of late finished at the end of their recent seasons?

FedMart was a very early fore-runner (1960's) to SAM'S. If you could have seen the women shopping at FedMart, one back in that day and time might have suggested it be added as an Olympic sport? NOW BACK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND, RIGHT?

Awe shucks......... It took hours and hours of practice to get to the level of where I am today with BOLD, FONT SIZE AND... C..........O..........L..........O..........R With your kind words I will still remain most humble as always.................After all, BonfireBrian, you have read my latest book, right? You know, HUMILITY & HOW I ATTAINED IT?

megagreen, I take it you are still a Houstonian? BTW, what are the present plans for the Astrodome? Surely they will not tear down the "Eighth Wonder of the World" or will they? In old Colt Stadium (B4 the Astrodome was completed) I got to see Stan Musial in his farewell tour as a MLB legend and future Hall of Famer. Any of you other posters on GMG.com ever attend a game at Colt (.45's) Stadium and sit in the Houston heat, humidity as well as among the Texas-sized mosquitos of which there never seemed to be a shortage? PS You older alums or MG fans who lived in or around Houston back in the day remember buying those annual shopping memberships at FedMart? Remember Globe Discount Center not too far from FedMart, too? I recall my parents making frequent trips to FedMart which I think was off Mykawa (sp?) Road?

Yeah, Brian, now come on...........GET WITH THE PROGRAM!

Mine in Houston, too. Grand Opening of Astrodome--LBJ & Lady Bird were there, John & Nellie Connally, etc, etc, etc, Saw Mickey Mantle hit first "dome" run in the Astrodome and Nellie Fox hit a late innings game-winning single as Astros beat the Yankees in this exhbition game. Was 14 yrs old at the time and that first walk inside the Astrodome was breath-taking since most stadiums of that day had that gray, cold concrete'ish drab look much like........oh well, nevermind........... UCLA (Lew Alcindor) vs UH (Elvin Hayes) in the Astrodome--UH WINS! (Hey! Anyone have some binoculars)?!?!? I've heard ESPN sports media types say the UCLA/UH nationally televised event (mostly to be found on UHF stations during this era) was the single most event that brought college basketball to a national awareness previously not experienced by the sport.

2 out of the 3 aforementioned "system" schools have law schools. Not saying it was all their attorneys who gave them (IMHO) very impressive endowment numbers, though. FWIW, 2 of the 3 listed have had engineering schools that have been in operation many more years than ours which (comparatively) is still in its infancy. Not real surprised at Texas Tech's number$, but UH's endowment is sort of a surprise. Both of those schools were never "normal" colleges like UNT, though. "Normal" for some of you young gun alums who may not know be aware of this were the names given to "teacher's colleges" back in late 1800's into the next century. In fact, of our 6 names we've had in Denton, wasn't our first name Texas Normal? Well, if we could only have all the "normal" things happening athletic-wise at a university based in Texas that has about 32,000 students, 100,000 (+ or -) alums within one hour of its main campus, even more growth on the horizon (& that mainly due for its location***hellsbells, Fidel Castro could have been president of UNT and it was still going to grow in enrollment). The aforementioned endowments numbers of UNT, UH and Texas Tech is the main reason that UNT should have never taken on the south Dallas County project IMO. It's one thing to establish a university, but its another thing to have all the extra funding and resources (raised from corportations and individuals) to turn it into a good university and I think its taken our main campus about 100 plus years to finally figure that out; henceforth, our $39 (or $50 million) endowment in this our 116'th year of existence in Denton, Texas, America? Do any of you remember when we used to hire fundraisers at NT who could not even (literally) raise monies that would equal each of their respective salaries? I do.........

Well, Jack, Bobby Ray has yet to ask me to join him and family for a summer vacation so I guess I am not on his "A" list of potential invite'ees for a summer vacation like Coach DD and family have had such an honor. Actually, I've never met Bobby Ray, but I think many of us question why he and his board seem to have no trouble (whatsoever) rubber-stamping all these extended contracts of UNT coaches (many years at UNT with under .500 W/L records) and UNT coaches that other higher profile schools are not exactly knocking their doors down to hire them away from us. Last I read in some UNT publication the endowment was actually about $39 million, but I like your numbers much better and will believe your sources to be updated and more accurate. Of course, one question might be: Are we talking about future land-holdings with (perhaps) gas wells on them that UNT is projecting in these new and much larger endowment numbers OR.......... do they really have $46 million in real monies in our present endowment? Jack, IMO, the jury is still out with Lee Jackson. I am not alone with those feelings. With what was supposed to be his Texas political strengths and savvy, I think many are still surprised that a UNT Law School is not open for business even as we post on all this. Not sure why a non-academian/ politician w/o a Phd would receive the call for such a high academic position as Chancellor of a major public university as UNT, but what is done is done. I think many of us will always wonder if a true advocate, ie, a mover and shaker of UNT athletics who is attempting to make UNT a true player in NCAA D1-A will really ever receive from our present Chancellor a leader who doesn't squelch such pro-activity for Mean Green varsity athletics? And Jack, you know any university leader can squech any pro-active athletic's advocate in so many (most) subtle ways; one for example, like not allowing the "A" list of potential UNT donors to be made available to our Mean Green athletic fund-raisers? But rather will UNT only get this from our Chancellor: "I'll stay out of the way of athletics, but it is not a passion of mine." I believe one of you on this board posted that you actually heard similar words come out of the mouth of Lee Jackson). Personally, I would rather the Chancellor have the Noval Pohl approach toward athletics. I think that type of attitude gets us closer to where we would all like UNT Athletics to be than the passive "it's not a priority" approach. To say the least..............interesting times ahead for UNT.

Yes, DG, it was Texas Tech and there was a full length article in the Sunday Dallas Morning News a few years ago which I posted about on GMG.com about 7,000 posts ago. That DMN article went on about how Texas Tech took a delegation of their movers and shakers to (& as to quote you, DG) "smooze and booze" USN&WR officials and "WALA" the Techsters suddenly move from Tier 4 to Tier 3. All this was also taking place about the same time TTech officials talked SBC Communications out of a $20 million cash gift to get their renovations and expansion of Jones Stadium started. In that same DMN article, the UT (Austin) president was quoted saying he was of the opinion that that the USN&WR ranking methods of U.S. colleges and universities were about as bogus a ranking system as there was. ALWAYS SEEMS TO BOIL DOWN TO MONEY and therefore, our short-coming and main nemesis for having a lack thereof): If UNT had more in our financial coffers, ie, our school's total endowment, then we probably would get a 3'rd Tier ranking as donotions loom large in the USN&WR ranking system. I believe if UNT had the much-larger financial endowment that our academics (at least in the eyes of the USN&WR officials) would receive a new look-over and almost overnight (suddenly) get their attention. (Amazing the power and influence of the almight dollar, eh)? Yet at about $40 million for all 3 of our campuses in the UNT System at present, we are probably about $360 million short what a school established in 1890 and one with our size constituency should probably have as our endowment. UNT-Dallas will (in many ways) not directly affect UNT-Denton, but in an indirect sort of way I belive it will. I say that because Dallas corporate or individual monies will have to be raised to make UNT-Dallas a viable academic institution. Such Dallas monies raised for our south Dallas County campus would (naturally) cause many of us who attended our main campus wonder why such monies had never been actively sought after or made available for our school with its 100 plus year history. Yet we will have all these new Dallas donations suddenly become available for a brand new yet unknown commodity of a campus in south Dallas County? So unless a UNT version of T. Boone Pickens steps forward, I believe the continued establishment of UNT-Dallas as to make it a complete free-standing university will be the #1 priority and focus for the UNT Chancellor and the UNT Board of Regents. After all, if you have an incomplete campus in south Dallas County with our Texas legislature wondering why its taking UNT officials such a long time to get the thing jump-started (with big donations needed to do that); anyway, if you were a UNT Board of Regent do you even bother to bring up and discuss with Chancellor Lee Jackson and the rest of the Board the subject of building a $50 million football stadium in Denton, Texas? Especially in light of the fact that we still only have $40 million in our school's entire endowment? These are really some tough times in the UNT System, especially for those who have dreamed of a new football stadium in Denton that will serve a dual purpose of helping us get rid of our pink elephant of a track & field stadium off I-35E and help us step into this new millieneum with a new NCAA D1-A stadium that will (somehow/someway) help us keep some semblance of our place at the table in a BCS that seems to have been financially distancing itself from the rest of the non-BCS almost since the time the Big 12 began its operations.

The new stadium when built (whether in the next 5 years or way out there in the sweet by and by) will do many things for UNT, but at the top of the list, it will replace Fouts Field which is the single-most negative perception-creator of a facility on our campus. Damn shame it just happens to be located where 40,000 commuters can observe it every day of the year they drive pass our pink elephant. Any other UNT academic facility of similar disrepair and age would have been condemned and torn down years ago. Sadly, Texas Stadium will probably be torn down before Fouts Field because of our traditional snail pace we move in Denton which too many times has left us waiting as the alter for better conferences. Jeff, I most always agree with your posts and we both (of late) seem to share the same frustrations and disappointments with what we see as our alma mater's athletic department's lack of an upwardly mobile direction (or at least a direction that will rise beyond the SBC/Bottom 10 level); but this time around I will agree to disagree with you on UNT's potential inclusion into CUSA and (IMHO) the reason for this is: As long as SMU's doors are open for business and as long as ol' Death Penalty U, ie, SMuuuuuuuuu, a school with more NCAA infractions than any other NCAA D1-A school last time I checked; anyway, as long as SMU is a member of Conference USA, UNT can kiss off any chances of our ever getting in. SMU seems to love to piss in our bowl of soup any opportunity they get; you know, the kind of attiitude and mode of operation one would expect from a "Christian" oriented university? Also, as much as I hate to admit this, I see about 3 other schools (2 in the SBC) who are presently ahead of us in overall football (stadium) facilities that I think CUSA would call on before they would UNT. CUSA (located in Irving, Texas) will most always listen to what SMU's desires or wishes concerning their league's expansion in the future. For UNT at the time there was an opening in CUSA----still another blown opportunity because all we (mostly) have to offer is "potential", also because of the (forever) SMU influence and our overall lack of football facilities at the time Chuck Neinas was touring all the potential CUSA schools. Just my .02....

The part I highlighted in large red letters has been the norm at UNT, ganggrene. I really wish we could hire Troy U's fundraising dept. so they could show us the kind of people we need to talk (and not piss off) who could build a new football stadium at Eagle Point Campus. I bet we have some fund-raisers at UNT now who barely raise their salaries (and that was also the norm for most of the last 30 plus years in Denton FWIW). Yet.................the same MG people on the same MG donor's list of the last 20 years at UNT are not going to (financially) catupult this program any higher than it is now. Those on that list are for damn sure not going to build a new football stadium in Denton, either. That 20 year old donors list will get even smaller if some of these (downright) stupid public relations blunders of a few in the present UNT athletic dept. don't drastically come to a halt, either. Who do they think they are working for anyway? Themselves? Only at UNT would all that have been so swept under the carpet with some acting as though some of these blunders didn't happen at all.

HYPERTENSION PROBLEMS? THEN DON'T READ THIS POST, EITHER! Save some of that stuff for me, too, KingDL1! OK to the few, the bold, the brave out there who just can't stand to read my "hard to understand" posts (but for some reason or another still read them anyway and get all tensed up over what they read); anyway, here is what would (eventually) be nice at dear ol' alma mater someday in the future. AND THAT WOULD BE.................Whatever league we're in now or in the future for us to win its football championship and finish out the year as an actual bowl winner; but more importantly than those 2 things would be for UNT to finish inside the Top 50 ranked football schools in NCAA D1-A. I am sorry, but merely winning the SBC and going bowling yet still finishing #90 thru #117 in the final polls is hardly what many of us older nestors consider a really "got it going on" college football program at the NCAA D1-A level. With all our so-called success of late, just why didn't all that translate to the Texas Bowl officials having no problem leaving an "up and coming" Texas D1-A school off their list no matter how they explain it. In fact, have they said anything on an official basis to anyone about UNT? I might be wrong, but I'd almost wager no one from UNT with clout even confronted those Houstonians on this matter. When the aforementioned (Top 50 rankings) starts to happen in Denton, I'll be a new convert and even get re-baptized all over again over at the Denia Duck Pond , but until this happens, I will still remain a Mean Green infidel and will raise some kind of holy hell on this board (and beyond) until the day, hour, minute and second we get what we "ALL" deserve at UNT and FWIW, what we should have gotten a long time ago in the area of personnel. . Hard for me to believe that here in the year 2006, we are still having to talk about trying to get this program jump-started (again) into something acceptable and what would make most NT Exes proud of the 4'th largest university in the state of Texas. I know many who are not proud of hardly anything at UNT now and the resignation of Norval Pohl started many of their own soul searching about just what are we going to get now from all these new non-UNT graduated leaders who (quite frankly) won't give a rat's ass about you or UNT the first 5 minutes they are off the UNT payroll. Sorry I can't be more PollyAnna'ish about what I am posting here as to not make some of you get all tensed up. 2006: 4 and 8 and DD kiss up & vacation pal Bobby Ray gets him yet another contract extension after 4 & 8. Once the ink dries on that contract extension at CEU, you know, ol' Contract Extension University; anyhoooooo, there will be a public hanging of the ghost of Dr. J. C. Matthews at the Denton Courthouse court yard. Ol' Uncle J.C really must be haunting the hell out of our school's leadership to make sure we never hire people who will ever actually be able to get jobs of a higher profile than the ones they have in Denton, Texas, America.

Sorry, one more comment: Responding to that that I put in bold type of your post, MGE, and I respond to that part of your post by saying..... THEN WHAT THE HELL WE WAITING FOR? ARMAGEDDON? And to MG61's question: Just use your imagination to what I am posting on this entire subject. I have to leave a few subtle-ties, now don't I? ............................................................................................... And to Deep Green's: LET PLUMMER SPEAK post? Well, just what is it does the Bible have to say about casting pearls? Come on, Phil, let em' know how you really feel about all this, too.. I know way too many who have stopped caring enough to even post how they feel anymore. AND..............I hope all is fine down there in the Golden Triangle, DG. YET..........Ain't all this more fun than a barrell of monkeys! I just love to see how people try to justify mediocrity. Almost gives me some kind of sordid rush in a way!

Sorry, good_ken, ol' Puff has run out of beer! Hayden Fry was not perfect, but for NTSU, he was almost perfect. He's also the only coach UNT has ever had thats in the College Football Hall of Fame, albeit was his success at Iowa that made that happen BUT..................there would have been on Iowa for Coach Fry had there not been an NTSU for Coach Fry. Over and out (at least on this subject).

MG61, I am going on the history of the UNT/UT game (with DD as coach) as my basis for this Falls game. I think UNT should go for a 2006 NCAA National Championship, too, but I just don't see that happening, either. BEAT TEXAS! But even more important for the long term, someone please turn this football program into a year in and year out Top 50 program that can win some important OOC games! Asking too much for that am I? And LongJim ol' buddy, have em' put lots of butter on mine! BTW, I'll let you and the Mrs. know about the next party & soon. PS: Will someone let me know when this pissing contest is over so I can (safely) put ol' Puff the Magic Dragon back in his cave (and zip up that cave accordingly). Can I say that, Harry?