PlummMeanGreen

Turn on the lights, the parties just beginnning!

Come on, folks, its not exactly that DD has a million dollar contract for each of the next few seasons for however long our Extended Contracts Gone Wild gang kept handing over to DD all those nice gift wrapped E.C.'s on those pea green tarnished silver platters. I know academia can sometimes be accused of not being part of the real world, but down-sizing of any department's staff is not a stranger to even colleges and universities, either; even at the University of North Texas. I'd bet that UNT could come up with one of those "bought out" extended years by down-sizing a handful of what seems a top heavy D1-A athletic dept. So in that regard and IMHO, what UNT also needs to do is down-size off our campus those who have us in a pickle with all this in the first place, ie, those who just kept on approving the padding on of extended years to those who were hardly what any of us could call an "in demand" coaching commodity by other higher profile NCAA athletic programs who might come a-callin'? I mean come on folks, at this time in our history, are we really in danger of losing any of our multi-year under .500 coaches to any school? Or in the area of recruiting, uh, losing "blue chip" recruits because said UNT varsity coach only has 1 or 2 more years left on his/her contract? Sorry...............but in Denton, Texas, America, we just don't have the same problems of hanging on to coaches as those at other collegiate outposts such as Tuscaloosa, College Station, Lubbock, Corvalis, Stillwater, Manhatten, Waco, etc, etc, etc.

Dennis Francione has undoubtedly been one of the best builders of football programs that have been down that we've seen in awhile. BUT..........with all the resources in the college football world at his disposal at Texas A & M University, this particular coaching gig for "Coach Fran" has thus far been a very strange, slow beginning. I know his 3 and 0 start this Fall will help him among many Former Students of TAMU, but they, too, have their own barometer of success (which I think more and more of our own UNT elect are finally joining the rest of us and beginning to recognize success beyond the SBC as being our own barometer--BTW, don't fret late-comers, it took me awhile to see the light, too); but at TAMU, won't it mostly still boil down with what Francione's overall record will be against the Texas Longhorns? For Those Who Need Even More Proof of UNT's Poor Football Coaches Hiring Record? Dennis Francione was extremely interested in the Mean Green head football coaches job but could not even get an interview with our D1-A college football experts on campus when there was an opening. I believe Coach Fran's interest for the UNT job was after Corky Nelson was fired during a football season that the Mean Green had a win over **SMU at Fouts Field and Nelson also had an "above" 500 record of 6 & 5 during his swan song season in Denton. ** Some of you have suggested that there were even more butts in seats for that 1990 SMU/UNT game than the one at Fouts Field 2 weeks ago.

WHO DO WE HAVE AT UNT WHO CAN (AND WILL) TAKE THE BULL BY THE HORNS AND RIGHT ALL THE WRONGS THAT ARE NOW REARING THEIR UGLY HEADS? : SUB-TOPIC: IF WE DON'T RAISE A LITTLE HELL, FOLKS, ALL THOSE EXTENDED CONTRACTS WILL JUST KEEP ON A-COMIN' IN MEAN GREEN COUNTRY... YET.........wouldn't most agree that the first step for any mid major to show that it is truly a program that is progressing or one that is on the rise is being able to beat (with regularity) such schools as Tulsa, Akron, La Tech, Air Force, etc, etc, etc, AND.............if a school like UNT is not beating such schools, just what is the hook or reason (other than the obvious with our Extended Contract Gone Wild gang) that causes some on the UNT campus (and a hardy handful on this message board) to want to persevere all this; that is, a football program that is standing still which at the NCAA D1-A level usually means you are going backwards. Salary buyouts? It's been done before at UNT and FWIW, UNT leaders in the past have always been able to find the monies to take care of wht they decide they need to take care of as far as personnel is concerned. But could our leaders have a new mini-crisis on their hands with all this going on off campus such as a fan/alumnus revolt that may very well translate (soon enough) with crowds such as the now infamous "Pull the Plug" photo showed in a photo on this forum? And the Pull the Plug photo showing of an extremely sparse crowd at Fouts Field in what I think was DD's 1'st or 2'nd year at UNT? BTW, anyone have a copy of that photo to post on GMG.com to serve as a reminder as to what can happen when our Mean Green fan base starts making their own statement to our UNT leaders? The only downside to such a protest are that our present MG football players who signed on to all this get the wrong impression that this is all about them who are being protested against and nothing could be further from the truth. Many just think new leadership in the near future can even brighten their own futures at UNT; that is, to those Mean Greeners who are our most recent signees from the last 2 or 3 recruiting classes. Yet at UNT the last 2 or so decades, we seem to go into some kind of brain dead "duh" mode when it comes to hiring coaches at UNT that truly fit the needs of our students, Exes and Mean Green fans base. Hiring selection committees (which we did not have one that was fully functional during Dickey's faster than white lightnin' hire); yet past selection committees didn't seem to do the necessary research OR even more importantly, observe what other Texas schools of similar scope as UNT did to hire those who had turned their (sublimenal utep) football programs around almost 180 degrees. As of late, though, we do seem to go with the hiring practice that seldom has really ever succeeded at UNT and thats going with the "good ol' boy" hire after a few buddies recommended another buddy? Anyone remember when that ever worked at UNT? Wasn't the Dennis Parker hire basically tantamount to a "good ol' boy" hire? His name was put on the table then all his Texas HS coaching buddies started making the calls on his behalf? Then we had a particular NT VP under Dr. Hurley who no more knew Texas D1-A intercollegiate football than some of us know Washington D.C. politics make the final decison with Coach Parker from all that some of us heard about that failed bit. OK, ONE MORE TIME.................... How many UNT'ers even had one iota of a say in the hiring of DD? As I've posted to the point of ad nausem to even myself that was pretty well a Kansas State Koup at the expense of some sleeping NORTH TEXANS who really got caught off guard.. Sure we had SBC success in the lower ranked depths of NCAA D1-A and FWIW, no one can really ever take away from those 4 bowl game appearances inasmuch as we still didn't have to beat schools like a Tulsa, Akron or La Tech to get to the NO's Bowl. YET............ even in our losing 3 of 4 of those bowl games at least they did give our school national TV exposure on ESPN and even more importantly, a new Athletic Center, so all has not been negative even at the lower depths of D1-A. YET............after reading this forum one week after an SMU win and observing how so many have suddenly changed their tunes, it seems most of our Mean Green elect (not just posters on GMG.com or Scotties board either) have moved on beyond the "4 bowl game" era to a (seemed) brand new era for a much larger group who all seem to now have a desire for much higher accomplishments for Mean Green football (and athletics in general). With what I am reading, there seems to be a growing concensus who have seen the light and believe a fresh new start in Mean Green Country will ultimately be an important decision that many are waiting on our upper echelon UNT leaders to make. The time-table for that to happen will turn out to be the $64,000 question, though. BUT FOR THE TIME BEING..........do we really have confidence in some of those presently in charge at UNT to better our situation even if DD were to become job-less after this football season? After all, our alma mater once turned down even giving Dennis Francione an interview so we could hire a Texas HS football coach. Can't you just imagine using our recent history as to what our present group of UNT's leader's short list of candidates might just look like? Might it ver well look like UTEP's during their last time to hire a new coach before some progessive thinking official on the El Paso campus took the bull by the horns and said: DAMN IT, PEOPLE, LETS DO SOMETHING VERY "UN-UTEP-LIKE" AND HIRE A NAME COACH! This kind of attitude we have not had in decades and I guess some might say we have paid the price for that and will continue to do so until we go outside our box "UTEP-style?" UTEP! UTEP! UTEP! Can we of UNT possibly learn from UTEP's school officials as to how they turned it around like no other time in their football history when they went outside their usual box and hired Mike Price? Check out how much UTEP's athletic upside increased (across the board) upon their hiring of Mike Price. Look at UNT's very own former SBC conference-mate, ie, the Idaho Vandals? Immediately after they announced Dennis Erickson as their new man, record-breaking season ticket sales would soon be that school's immediate rewards for going outside their normal box as to who they had been used to hiring. BUT WE NEED MORE FUND$ FOR A HIGH PROFILE COACH WHEN THAT DAY COMES? Simple: Do like many businesses in the USA and downsize : Eliminate some very nicely paid ancillery athletic positions that we can most likely live without. At UNT, you could probably come up with an additional $200K to $300K by doing such without skipping a beat. That amount would even be one year's worth of a certain coach's buyout as well? But wth a high profile coaching hire who has set objectives to win game and sell football tickets (just like Mike Price's contract at UTEP) UNT can probably make the $200K to $300K back quickly because we would have the high profile coach on our staff and campus. The upside of a high profile hire for damn sure out-numbers hiring a present UNT assistant (why would UNT want to hire an assistant coach who has also been part of DD's mutli-year under .500 football program for crissake's?...........plus a high profile hire would have a much bigger upside than even hiring some "bright, young" project type of coach 100 to 1. In football we know about impact players, right? But wouldn't most agree that any mid-major ranked toward the bottom in football (like UTEP used to be before Price arrived); anyway, doesn't such a school that meets that criteria need an impact coach? The size (or lack thereof) of the crowd at a Fouts Field home football season opener 2 Saturday nights ago against SMU would be a clear signal, ie, a fairly big wake up call for most upper echelon college leaders at most NCAA D1-A outposts; that is, it would be a tell-tell sign of whats really going on with the MG fan base. So how long do we continue all this? Wonder if our leaders have heard the phrase: He Who Snoozes............Loses? Folks, the SBC shows signs of passing us by (2 and 9 last year is a pretty good hint of that happening) but even if our SBC-football mates didn't completely and dramatially pass us this year or next does that even really matter as we look down the road and what this forum seems to presently all want with an upgrade of this football program? We already have a trend well in place and one that I now believe most of our elect would really like to see change and fairly soon, right? AND I SAY THAT BECAUSE...........isn't the bottom line with all this how we are ranked among all other 118 NCAA D1-A schools when all is said and done at season's end--and thats whether we go to the NOs Bowl or we don't go to the NO's Bowl? QUESTION: Would a UNT upset win over a Texas or an OU (or any Top 25 school) do more for our football program than a win over the 3'rd or 4'th place CUSA team in a bowl game? Which one would help us get our Mr. Big Donor out of the woodwork as to want to write the first big check that gets the dirt turning for our new football stadium? Next question is: How far is this present MG football program from even beating the 3'rd or 4'th place CUSA football team in the NO's Bowl? Some of the aforementioned may be an over-simplication, but how many of us in our own lives have stumbled over simplicity? What we need at UNT also seems to have a simple answer, but for heaven's sake, we seem to have some on our main campus who continuously keep trying to stall for time with all this (for whatever reason) and then they try to make rocket science out of all this. And its pretty obvious that we seem to have no one on our campus who seems to have the 'nads to pull the trigger on key UNT athletic employees when they've all had close to a decade or more to prove themselves and show how they fit (or don't fit) in an NCAA D1-A athletic program whose alums would like to see get back to an upward bound mode, but this time around---at a much higher NCAA D1-A profile. We Can Do Better @ UNT.....LETS' JUST COPY TO THE TEE WHAT UTEP & IDAHO HAVE DONE IN THEIR RECENT HIRINGS... ←

BINGO!

chrisfisher, but were you able to salvage the lasagna?

I suppose one of my all time memories of college football was on a Fall afternoon back in the mid-1960's when I was a teen and it involved our opponent of last night, ie, the Tulsa Golden Hurricane... Anyhoo............my late father and I were down on Bastrop Bayou (not far from the Gulf) fishing for speckled trout, red fish, sheephead (uh, yuk--too boney to eat) or whatever fish wanted to partake of the stinky shrimp bait on the end of our lines that day. Earlier my father and I had loaded up our "fishing car", ie, "the old jalopy" (since mom didn't like us taking the family car on any fishing trip) but we loaded it down with a days worth of fishing gear, summer sausage (a favorite when we went fishing), some saltine crackers to go along with the summer sausage and a cooler full of, well, uh, ice tea. (Hey, my dad was chairman of the board of deacons at the local Baptist church back then--what can I say)? Anyway, to follow our Fishing Day tradition down on the Gulf Coast, I always stuck inside the jalopy a Zenith transistor radio so as we fished we could also listen to Southwest Conference icon one Mr. Kern Tips broacast the SWC Game of the Week (sponsored by the Humble Oil Refinery--remember "Put a Tiger in Your Tank" and............."Hold That Tiger"?) or we would listen in on who "my" team as a teen was and that would be the University of Houston "eat em' up" Cougars of Coach Bill Yeoman. So as our fishing expedition off Bastrop Bayou progressed, I had the radio turned on to KPRC (I believe was the UH radio station back then) to listen to long time Astros radio guy Gene Elston who doubled as the UH play by play man as he broadcasts the UH vs TULSA GOLDEN HURRICANE football game. To say the least, it was a most memorable day for both the UH Cougars, the Tulsa 'Canes as well as my father and me as we seemed to be catching as many fish as the Cougars were scoring touchdowns that crisp Fall afternoon over in the H-Town Astrodome. OK, ALREADY, I'LL SHORTEN THIS STORY: On this UH Cougar football team that included future country singer great Larry Gatlin (as he was recruited by UH out of Odessa HS); anyway, the UH Cougars (and their vaunted Houston Veer offense) ran up over 100 points on the little ol' tu golden hurricane that day and (if memory serves me well) I believe the UH defense even kept Tulsa U under 2 or 3 touchdowns. It was a collegiate football massacre of biblical proportions. Wish I had some moral to the story or a............"And now..........you know the rest of the story" but I don't.................yet thats what happened to the tu golden hurricane that day. Some might just happen to wonder how much respect the Tulsa radio boys had for that Texas college football team that day in the Astrodome, ie, the Cougars of the University of Houston. We Will Have Brighter Days Ahead in Mean Green Country...... ............................................................... PS and what the heck I do have a moral to the story: Call up your father today and tell him you love him, because one day you won't have that luxury. Peace to all...

Not sure that I was ever as frustrated as an NT Ex/Mean Green fan after last year's "worst loss in Fouts Field" history against the Tulsa Golden Hurricane. The game today will in many ways and (once again) tell us where we are as a non-BCS football program as our game last season (coupled with La Tech) both seemed to do. Maybe the only other time I got as frustrated was when a Hayden Fry-coached Mean Green team (YES, ALL YE WHO HAVE NOT CENSORED ME WITH THE IGNORE BUTTON READ THAT CORRECTLY) was schooled by Oklahoma State "60 something" to "how's your family doing?" BUT..........that was also the same season we came back to beat UHouston (who would be in the Cotton Bowl the next season); also had a near miss (17-15) with Mississippi State but was also the same Fall campaign that Hayden took his apple-green clad Mean Green up to Knoxville, Tennessee, and the rest of that story is Mean Green history.

You got me on that one, CMJ; but don't forget, our group of whom AARP bugs us to death with their constant mailings of AARP related materials; anyway, Harry (in his goodness and all fairness) has actually allowed 5 senior moments on GMG.com per academic year for those of us over 50 years of age. I think I may have just one more left so I will have to be careful from here on out.. AND......hope all is well for you out there in Hollywood, CMJ.

Harry, is there a way to bronze this post of Gray Eagle One's for posterity?

Yeah, Baby Arm, there is a way and its really pretty simple: How about when you see someone's post that usually gets you all tensed up and blubbering all over yourself because said poster may just be exposing more stark, naked truth concerning our school's present athletic co-existance in the subterranean depths of NCAA D1-A and with many such revelations from some of those "said posters" :rolleyes:more than (perhaps) you're capable of handling........then how about this most unique concept: Just don't read "said persons" posts, period! AND............do you really need an "ignore button" to keep you from doing that? I've had an ignore button working for me on this board long before Harry put an official one on this forum for any poster to use. And just what it is that you majored in at UNT? And to Gray Eagle One: As has been the case for years with your posts and your philosophies I've known long before Al Gore invented the internet, I wholeheartedly concur with your thoughts on the NC State coach and the Wolfpacks "probable' future prospects in the ACC and FWIW........... ...........I would hope the next time we have a new head football coaches selection committee at UNT that you (and a few more on this board I think know good college football from bad college football going nowhere fast); anyway, I hope you are highly considered to be on such a selection committee.

Met DD on a couple of occasions and he is very much the gentleman (although I observed was a bit stand-off'ish at the 2 events I attended........but none of this is about the person but rather what the person is delivering (or in the case of UNT) what he is not delivering for our alma mater. Folks, we have got to get out of this "Green Acres Retirement Center" mode we seem to be stuck in with those athletic employees who are just not delivering the kind of results that would unite a Mean Green Nation and mobilize the ma$$e$ as to cause the majority of our constituency to want to support all this en mass (& not just the fractured support that will become even more apparent in the weeks and months ahead). All this is why Mike Price was such an important hire for UTEP because he did all of the above and the UTEP Exes and Miner fan base's reward for that? How about Top 25 for the first time in Miner history in only Price's 2'nd or 3'rd year in El Paso? How far are we from having the quality and overall recruiting classes to be Top 25, folks? We do have some talent on the Mean Green football team, but not in the kind of numbers that will ever get us into the Top 50 or even Top 75 NCAA D1-A football programs. AND...............'twould also be nice when others could start posting about the post subjects rather than the poster? Seems that would also show a real sign of maturity that would be expected from adults who say they have a college degree? But......on the other hand, it is kind of fun "responding to" posts (which is all I do when prompted) or counter-pointing posts from those who only have 9 years of a poor W/L record coupled with a coach's very bad PR for any NCAA D1-A football program to have as their ammo. In fact, it's almost like shootin' fish in a barrell. Some should look in a mirror, remember what we once had in Denton that made us Mean Green & Proud, and then be ashamed as to what level they continue to validate and support without raising any questions whatsoever as to why we have to support what we are getting. We Can Do Better....

It was a 2 minute TV interview with Pat Buchanan, Bubba, which mean't he could hardly say anything but he did bring up the 150,000 non-Mexicans who cross the border. I guess there will be some who will have to see a mushroom cloud over downtown Houston, Dallas or Fort Worth before we take action in Congress? So BG maybe you and others who have posted on this "most controversial" thread might want to, uh, buy the book and find out where Buchanan got all his facts and data? FWIW, I am not surprised at what he said whether it was 1,500, 15,000 or 150,000 non-Mexicans crossing the Mexican border because (unfortunately and sadly) we all witnessed what a mere handful of Islamic fanatics did on 9/11/01.

Even more amazing is how those of us "progressives" who want much better for our alma mater's athletic program don't need an "ignore button" to ignore a hardy handful of you non-progressives/SBC/Bottom 10'ster's posts and you all know who your are, all you who kiss DD's butt while you fiddle around just like Nero as Rome burned but in our case, you watch support for NT football dwindle away year by year while you support those who have proven they cannot take us to the next level? Pretty freakin' (I'll leave it at "freakin') sad how yall are so easily led by Deep South'er and USM would-be AD and enthusiast, ie, Rick V and his department of fellow bull-shippers (you know, all the ones who had some of you gullibles actually believing that "the SMU game is almost a sellout gang, get your tickets before they're gone?" Anyway, so very sad how some UNT alums expect so very little from our athletic program anymore and are so easily led just like a bunch of sheep by just about anyone who leads them, but of late it seems the NCAA D1-A slaughter-house may be that group of "green tinted" supporters/lambs destination? But all it takes for some of yall is free beer from DD and (apparently) good ol' Rick "I've got my resume updated once again" Villaarreal to simply make a cameo appearance on GMG.com and post things that he should have been saying in public at all those, uh, quarterly meetings? IN THE RED...................Baby Arm (or some of you other none PMG post readers) : Ask Rick V for the rest of us who will be the next under .500 varsity coach at UNT to gets his next recommendation for yet another contract extension he can send up to UNT's other Co-Athletic Director, one Mr. Bobby Ray, you remember him right, UNT's little Napoleaon of the North? , Please find out all these things for the rest of us, Baby Arm, that is, unless you, too, have wussied out over reading the post of someone (a 33 year known to many on this board supporter of Mean Green football) who just happens to think (in fact) he just happens to know that at UNT..................WE CAN DO BETTER BECAUSE WE HAVE DONE BETTER (but at a much higher profile). Sorry some of you young gun alums also don't know what the hell I'm talking about here but put yourselves in this bit of role playing: ROLE PLAY FOR US, YOUNG GUN NT ALUMS (and present students): Just imagine that you are walking on campus listening to your radio to Mean Green football who are on the road playing a known opponent...........AND THEN SUDDENLY in the closing minutes of this football game a Mean Green RB receives and then runs back a kick-off for a touchdown to seal the deal for a victory (not over Middle Tennessee, young gun alums) BUT rather...............freakin' UNIVERSITY OF TENNESSEE VOLUNTEERS! Then follow this kind of football program that even has other high profile wins (and near wins). THEN Young Gun Alums (and apparently some of you older UNT alum farts who have some kind of strange affixation to Darrell Dickey Ball and his most unique to any NCAA D1-A school style of public relations); anyway, then force yourselves to create within yourselves the kind of emotion that that kick-off returned for a MEAN GREEN TOUCHDOWN would cause you to have and all the "feel good" it would create within you for your school's coach, your school's football team AND...........your alma mater's bright football future .................THEN.............. ...............bring yourself back to the present, listen to a Darrell Dickey Post Game Radio Show when he starts getting sarcastic all over the radio airwaves and just (in general) makes some NT Exes that some of us finally got to show up for a Fouts Field Game Day who on the way back to Fort Worth ask this question to me: "Jim, why is the NT coach getting all over our fellow alums AND our school?" Try that on for size all you Dickey Butt Kissers and perseverers of his style of college football and public relations because that happened with my ex NTSU college roommate who told me after that game: I WILL NEVER COME BACK TO FOUTS FIELD UNTIL THEY GET RID OF THIS DARRELL DICKEY CHARACTER WHO INSULTED BOTH YOU, ME & ALL OUR FELLOW ALUMS ON THE RADIO AIRWAVES, JIM! Do Have A Nice Day......

I work on Saturdays, BA, and FWIW, I'm glad I do because in 8 years I've seen enough DD Ball and have listened to enough of his non PR, condescending to NT Exes dumb-ass radio post-game radio comments that I'm going to listen to. Hard for me to believe this man is even still on the UNT payroll and that based (alone) on all those radio comments of the last few years; many of them even after a big SBC win.. Also, if all the newbies who did attend the SMU game last Saturday evening would have read page for page the new 2006 UNT Football Media Guide as to really get informed (to borrow that word from you, BA) about what is really happening around them in MG Country, just how many repeat customers might you think NT would get from many of that group when they see for themselves that at UNT, we don't really expect much in the area of high profile D1-A success from our coaches or athletic personnel? In fact, at UNT they get rewarded for such production. BA, you think somone who just moved to Denton from Michigan (and one who supported the Wolverines while living there) will want to hop on such a band-wagon as the one he'd see in Denton)? Most want to be part of an up and coming football program, not one that is down and going. I mostly feel sorry for the MG football players who don't have any say in who would lead them, recruit quality players to help them in future football seasons and a football program whose history suggestst that they will never see the light of day, that is, to be a proud integral part of a NCAA D1-A higher profile during their 4 or 5 years in Denton. To put it in plain language: That our UNT football players will get just enough from this coaching staff so they can squeeze yet another contract extension from Bobby Ray & Company while (unfortunately) still being a part of a football program forever entrenched at a Bottom Quadrant co-existance. At least, though, our UNT football player's scholarships will produce for each and every one of them a very good UNT education.

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE DON'T READ THIS ONE EITHER, OK? :rolleyes: First of all, let me say how it just breaks my downtrodden ol' heart that some of you DD butt-kissers don't read my posts. Also, please explain to new posters what it is we are all supposed to be excited about with life as an NCAA D1-A Bottom Feeder with DD and others as our leaders, OK? Hellsbells! Some of us would even like to know what that could possibly be, too. Please enlighten us all! Yet......... I am losing sleep over such things as a few of you not reading my post. BUT............. what some of you need to concern yourselves with more than just my posts is what ADLER posted just last week when he posted how he feared the tens of thousands of NT Exes/Mean Green fans who are all truly distancing themselves from this athletic program, and I'd guess that specifically for one of the reasons is that they do not accept or support those who are presently running our Mean Green ship. OK, to you who swear that you are not reading my posts let me say this to you right now: Some of you might want to know why I just don't wave the white flag like so many and just join the rest of many former avid supporters of NT athletics who don't care enough to turn their computers onto GMG.com at all anymore even just to say to hell with em' all? Well, its just not my style to give up so easily without letting those who would keep our school in such a down-trodden mode know that they can't fool or lull every NT Ex to sleep, as they have (unfortunately) done with some of you who are still not reading any of my post). BIG HINT? Might 21K (+/-) for an SMU game at Fouts Field in Denton,Texas, America be a very subtle hint to a hardy handful of you who do support DD Ball that many others of a growing army don't and won't till he (and others on the NT staff who would persevere all this with contract extensions) are also history? Yet still..............to a handful of you who still might want to know why I even continue to post about my own disenchantment with the direction of NT football let me say this: First of all, I am a still a UNT graduate and therefore like anyone with an NT degree, I am also interested in our alma mater's general welfare as an NT stock-holder (if you will) who just happens to think that our alma mater can still regain the kind of respect it had when I was an NTSU student. Many of us are just very curious to know why our present UNT administrative leadership, specifically the NT Board of Regents seem to be stuck on the notion that we just cannot do any better at UNT (with our personnel) than we are doing so they just keep on rubber-stamping contract extensions with this same ol' personnel without looking at many of their multi-year W/L records in Denton. All this is truly an amazing phenomena I've never heard of ever happening at any other NCAA D1-A school the 40 years I've followed college sports. Usually in the past in Denton, UNT was able to run off mediocre employees in the NT Athletic Dept. or those with some D1-A talent just got better jobs, but now in Denton, its all about letting sub-par performance personnel just hang around because UNT leaders apparently don't think anyone else can do better for crissakes'?!?!?! AND.............SPEAKING OF UNT LEADERSHIP: Anyone want to guess how long Bobby Ray would last as Chairman of the Board of Regents at schools such as TAMU or University of Texas or even a Texas Tech with his (apparent) philosophy of athletics at the NCAA D1-A level? How about the fact that he would probably last the time that it took for his ink to dry on yet another under .500 W/L UNT coach's extended contract--maybe even faster than that. Many would also be curious as to what our UNT's administration's own goals are for Mean Green football and D1-A athletics in general; but it does concern many of us that our very own NT leadership seems to not have a grasp or full understanding as to what the real traits and characteristics of an upwardly bound D1-A athletic program really are. One wonders if our NT leaders even look at season ending polls and read what various sports scribes (outside of the DRC thank you very much) are saying about our football program's direction (if they are saying anything about it at all, that is). Also, many are curious as to why 9 years of DD Ball with (still) so little respect nationally among the upper echelon of NCAA D1-A does not seem to say much to those from our school who would lead us. Some of you may even wonder why thousands chose to stay away from (even) a home season football opener with the vaunted and much-feared Metroplex rival (at least a rival to us) SMU Mustangs? For some of you who are mature enough to discuss the post instead of the poster, that (alone) should be a "tell-tell" sign to you especially that DD Ball (after 9 years) has still not caught the imagination of the kind of NT and Mean Green fans who would fill the rest of those 15,000 empty seats we have at most home games. Even how about those home games when we did have a decent crowd that DD Ball mentality and play-calling permeated and stunk up the place as to where you'd see many, many (most likely) "new" fans and faces leaving Fouts Field at half time in disgust with the boring football and predictable play-calling we've gotten. Like some of you are now posting, even 4 bowl game appearances has not won us many friends across the nations (and for damn certain not across Denton County). Many of us wonder why our NT leadership apparently seem not to notice what programs like UTEP and Troy U have done against the Big Boys which might make them think twice before they rubber-stamp another under. 500 NT coaches contract in Denton. BTW, some of yall remember when we used to play the role that Troy seems to have taken away from us? Well, I keep forgetting that many of you don't remember when we played that kind of role because some of you weren't even born yet. Nevertheless, to all of you who are still not reading this post because you gave up PMG post long ago, anyway, you want to know what REAL freedom is? Real freedom is not paying one iota of attention to you who have accepted unadulterated mediocrity for our NT football program and have no apparent charities to help out but rather you choose throwing your good money away at your broken down Studebaker of an NT athletic program getting pretty well the same results and national rankings each year. Oh...........but I forgot, we do have a Top 10 Tailgate program at UNT, now don't we? Real freedom for myself and others is also not reading posts of those who don't have the gonads to suggest to the UNT administration that things aren't quite right or on schedule for a UNT football program that needs to go to the next level; that is, a NORTH TEXAS that even used to be respected by many non mid-major football schools but rather we have our present program that annually hovers in and around the Bottom Feeders of NCAA D1-A. Real freedom for myself and many others of our growing army? Well.........that's being "mediocrity free" from those of you who seem to view our athletic mediocrity and DD Ball as a close friend and ally. In fact, for many of us, it now feels even better to know that the next Mean Green home football game we will attend will not have Darrell "woe is me because I work at North Texas" Dickey as the UNT head football coach. Now when that happens will be anyone's guess in Denton since we have so many who are planning "NT Board of Regent's" approved UNT/Denton retirements (although some of their job results and lack of acceptance by our overall masses suggests that some have retired already). And with the most talented, astute and most aware of whats going on around them leadership in the history of UNT (insert sarcasm with that sentence) I'm sure that they will not yield to all their personal temptations to eventually replace DD with one of their buddies, friend, relatives (grandson's HS football coach) or ex coaching associates; but rather, NT powers that be will somehow hopefully stumble onto the idea of doing a national search for a head football coach at UNT when the time calls for it while at the same time observing how such hires as a Coach Mike Price turned it all around at UTEP. ie, a football program that his coaching leadership and higher profile recruiting put them in the Top 25 for the first time in the El Paso's school's (basketball first oriented) history. So to you who don't read my posts any longer and who are not reading this one as well, its over and I'm out..............(for now, that is).

HEY! DON'T READ THIS ONE, EITHER, TO THOSE WHO DON'T READ THESE KIND OF THINGS! Not saying you are one of them, Green92, but I am amused with those who "stopped reading PMG posts" a long time ago but have responded to others after they have said they didn't. I have never asked the hardy handful of you who support an annual athletic co-existance in the lower depths of NCAA D1-A to ever agree with anything I post. Doesn't matter to me one way or the other if you agree, but it seems we have some who wouldn't know a good upwardly bound college football program if it came up and bit them in the a$$. Yet here we are with UNT, a school with more than its fair share of under .500 varsity coaches with numerous years on the UNT payroll to have time to change that and show us all trends that indicate an upward direction (as compared to ALL the other 100 plus schools in NCAA D1-A (not just the "feared by few" Sun Belt Conference)................ .............and BTW on the subject of UNT coaches career W/L records, just who do we have on payroll who is over .500 with a number of years under their belt to at least reach .500? I hope someone can get all their media guides out and (hopefully) list 1 or 2 so we call all celebrate this long since gone from UNT phenomena together. And BTW, what have I posted that is so far out there; that is, that is not the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me Scrappy? To quote Ross Peorot in a presidential debate a few years ago: I'm all ears! YET...........its just that anyone who has a degree from UNT is what I would consider a stock-holder in the our alma mater of which many of whom (even besides just myself) have opinions of what needs to really happen in Denton that would cause any SMU game at Fouts Field to draw 30,000 plus or ever SRO. So did we really have 25,000 plus at Fouts last Saturday night, folks? That is, instead of the 16,500 one very concerned MG fan and poster posted yesterday was his most concerned estimate? That post along with others soon after the game who suggested there may have been no more than 21-22,000? And one of those "guest-imators" a fan of UNT football for well over 4 decades? BTW, a game that some officials on-campus were hyping as a near sellout which is one helluva' questionable way to promote and attemtp to juke some fans into buying tickets when there were plenty of tickets to be purchased at the ticket office? With what I now do for work requires I work every Saturday (AM into PM hours) so those of you who have the luxury of choosing leisure and recreational type activities (such as college football Game Days are) I really do envy you, but I am not so sure now that I could vallidate what these guys/girls on our UNT payroll have been doing for 9 years (one for 18 yrs. and still under .500 ) if I even had my Saturdays open. FWIW, I also do NOT stand alone with that last aforementioned feeling, either. This is NOT and could hardly be considered a personal vendetta to anyone on the UNT payroll because I hardly know those I mostly refer to in these epistles, folks, its just a matter of.......... WE CAN DO BETTER (because we have done better, but at a higher profile)! So who of any of you prefer our present status among all of NCAA D1-A with trends (uh, 9 years worth of trends for crissakes', folks! suggesting this won't dramatically change any time soon? And choosing all that we have now rather than having such an athletic co-existance where we, too, can play a #9 ranked D1-A school competitively much like SBC'er Troy U did against Florida State just the other night? So come on, folks, at which time do some of you get ahold of your senses and cease your praising of our number of UNT Emporers as they parade around in their, uh, rather unique and nice selections of clothing that their on-campus spinmaters and clothiers have made special for all of them as to impress those who I really think they think are one helluva' gullible bunch of college athetic fans.

I predicted an SMU win several weeks ago (just as many of you). So no, not all is gloom and doom from this keyboard as some have suggested. Like maybe a hardy handful who apparently still believe in Santa Clause, the Easter Bunny and such UNT elect would have been superb inspirations (had you been around in the day) to the one who wrote the infamous short story: The Emperor's New Clothes?" Google that up if you don't know the story and how the constituency in that short story treated their Leader. So just more gloom and doom here? No, not really, but maybe just one who merely has a very strong dose of realism in his 6'th generation Texan bloodlines, perhaps? In short, I am not easily bull-shi&&ed by bull-shi&&ers and let that statement stand on its own as to how it relates to our alma mater. BUT................ Sorry, fellow alums, we will lose to both Tulsa and Akron the next few weeks because they have more talent and better coaching (and don't let the SMU game make you think all have turned over a new leaf with our own coaching staff--you cannot take spots off a leopard); anyway, UNT will (probably) be competitive this year (but probably not next year in our roller coaster ride in the Bottom Quadrant of NCAA D1-A) in the SBC and still too dangerously close to the Bottom 10. And we all know, for those who will keep playing "make believe" games how high our ranking will be with SBC success and also how much regional and national media respect that will gain for us as well. BUT STILL, WHO KNOWS.............UNT may even win the SBC in 2006, make a triumphant return to WW's SBC love-in at the NO's Bowl, then get schooled by the #3 or #4 CUSA team (again) and still be ranked anywhere from #90 thru #117 in the final polls after the final bowl game is played. Then (once again) we will recruit players just good enough to beat SBC level competition (which SMU could even be considered in that company this year). YET..........all this sound way too familiar? Is this what really floats your boat? Hellsbells! Go ahead and just do it, Bobby Ray, "O Ye of D1-A Expertise"; just go ahead and recommend and get approval for everyone in the NT Athletic Dept. to get another early Christmas present of contract extensions. All this at the NCAA D1-A's only school where coach's expections are quite low and at the NCAA D1-A's only retirement club, that is, our own Green Oaks Retirement Center @ Denton of which some of you approve by per$evering all this because a coach or some NT athletic staffer will call you by your first name, give you the time of day and if you get real lucky, buy you an occassional beer? And yes, you all are correct, this kind of attention would not happen at UT, TAMU, TTech, TCU, UTEP OR................. any other upwardly mobile D1-A school whose athletic staff might just be too busy out on the highways and hedges seeking out and getting much larger donors who would actually deserve such attention. A Norm Hitzghes drop on KTCK "The Ticket": "OH, SOMEONE, PLEASE.........JUST KILL ME!" But still..........an NCAA D1-A head football coaching job handed to him on a silver "green tinted" platter after a multi-school/ journeyman assistant coaching career. And this silver platter made possible for him with one of the quickest hires in NCAA D1-A history after Matt Simon was fired............... Anyone ever ask "WHY SO QUICK?" I know many of you who did. Yet this UNT head football coaches job made possible by a very, very, very small new coaches hiring committee made up of, uh, an aproximate 2-man (give or take) committee of which not one had a UNT degree. And from all appearances and pretty reliabe hearsay from some of you, not ONE single person with Denton ties or a UNT degree being asked their opinion by the KSU Konnection KOUP GANG or our new head football coach hiring committee. It was truly, a KSU Koup of sad proportions whose results still have for us a coach under .500 in his 9'th year at Club Med U and with our football program annually ranked toward the bottom of NCAA D1-A. BTW, all this at the 4'th largest university in the state of Kansa'..............whoops, sorry, I mean't TEXAS. Sorry boys/girls, but this is just not the same NORTH TEXAS I attended as a student when our sights were much higher and our hiring sights were much higher too; that is, we hired personnel who had the skins coupled with the talent to deliver and get us in the upper echelon of NCAA Division One back in that day. JUST ONE MORE THING: And to you who equate good Game Day tail-gating to having a good NCAA D1-A football program? Why not just plan a big BBQ in your backyard any Saturday of the year and invite your favorite ex school-mates and friends to such? Just a suggestion.... WE CAN DO BETTER (because we have done better, but at a higher profile).

These are numbers that should disturb any American and specifically, those of us Americans whose states border Mexico. The statistic in the topic title of this thread is in Pat Buchanan's new book "State of Emergency." He was a guess on Channel 4's "Good Day @ 7:00 AM" this morning. Pretty disturbing numbers that should not surprise us at all, though. Sadly, how many of these fanatical Middle Eastern Islamics favor (in looks) some of our Mexican friends? I think we all knew this could happen, but good gosh, folks, 150,000?!?!?

No, MG61, its merely looking at trends of which most businesses who are successful use to base much of their futures and future plans on. What part of what I have posted is not true, MG61? For those who agree with what I have posted, are they also doom and gloom, too? Maybe they, too, have just seen enough in 9 years that tells them what they can expect to see in the next, uh, 9? Sorry, but SMU is not a good football team this Fall and I just think our alma mater deserves more than its present leaders have shown they can give us (and this at a much higher profile that Fry's "40" wins and far less losses seemed to have given our program). And after all, didn't you post just the other day about some NT Top 20 rankings by the Mean Green during the mid-1970's? MG61, surely you are not suggesting that we are not worthy of that level or co-existance ever again so lets just keep the status quo' and just keep on enjoying life as an NCAA D1-A scavenger fish? And do we just keep on giving out those contract extensions to the NCAA D1-A's version of Green Acres Retirement Center For the Not So Successful, Under .500 W/L Career Coaches & Can't Get Higher Profile Jobs Anywhere Else types? One alum just called and said how the official board last week or so had a blurb on the winningest volleyball coach in UNT history but after his doing some research found she had 80 something wins but with, uh........ 114 losses? Good grief, folks, what are you smoking that has you drawn into all this? Could these people on our NT payroll sell you a pile of donkey dung and make you feel all warm and bubbly about that, too? And didn't some of our on-campus spin fellas' have some of you believin' that the SMU game was all but a pre-Game Day sellout? Yet while looking at photos of both sides (with so very few in the endzones) were there even 20,000 in attendance for the SMU game? Some of you posted saying you thought there "might" have been 21K or 22K as I recall your posts. So can anyone really talk or joke about the SMU attendance counter any longer? WE CAN DO BETTER BECAUSE WE HAVE DONE BETTER (and at a much higher profile).

As you have posted, it's a very long season. KingDL1. Sadly for the 'Stangs, SMU is merely a facsimile of the SMU many of us knew from the Fry era when he was (in fact) coach over at Mockingbird Lane, Dallas, Texas, all the way up to the Pony Express era. Not sure why it's taking them so long to turn it around, quite frankly. I think it could be said (and agreed by many who still have unbias as part of their personna ) that had last Saturday's game results been turned around, that GoMeanGreen.com would have many similar down-trodden-type posts (probably more) as the SMU posters over at PonyFans.com have been posting the last 48 or so hours. The DMN coveage with their theme of this being SMU's worst loss in their entire football history was quite interesting, too, and cannot make anyone from UNT feel too chipper; or like Troy U fans must have felt after their well fought game with the #9 ranked Florida Sate U Seminoles? Some on this board may also need to be reminded of their posts of recent weeks and months with all the ultimatums they were making toward DD inasmuch as their posts were saying that he "HAD" to win the SMU game (or else)? Interesting that NT "spin-masters" are promoting DD with all this "40'th win being the same number of wins that Hayden Fry had at NT" angle; YET............not listing the number of years Fry got his 40 wins or comparing the number of losses that each coach had at the time they both reached their magic "40" win milestone. Yet..............it is anyone's right to be a fickle fan oscillating their emotions from one week to the next based on a win (or a loss). In the long run, though, won't it still all be about how far up the final NCAA D1-A ranking's totem pole that our school's football team finishes? Hopefully most NT Exes feel we deserve to be much higher than those final rankings of years past and what the win over SMU seems to have given us, too. Nirvana for many of us for the NT football program? Win the SBC, beat the CUSA rep in the NO's Bowl and then.............much like the WAC and MAC football champions of late, just simpley be ranked well inside the Top 30 at season's end which would tell us that (finally) the regional and national college football sports media are noticing what MG football is doing is different than what they have been used to seeing with our football program. So FWIW..............where else should be the destination for Mean Green football among the rest of NCAA D1-A if not something very similar to the aforementioned? Many would probably even be open-minded enough to listen as to what that could possibly be. I know I would...

Bill, I suppose we are just about the same age then, but after Martin Luther King's assassination in the Spring of 1968 and then Bobby Kennedy's just a few months later, I think most of us who were teens during the turbulent 60's were all beginning to wonder about our country and where our country was headed. Of course, the Viet Nam war was going strong at the same time. But like ArlingtonMeanGreen said in his post: "Never, Never forget 9/11! ! ! ! !

9/11/01 Was tying my tie getting ready for work while listening to WBAP 820 AM with Hal Jay and the rest of his morning show guys and then suddenly they switch to network for breaking news..... At which time I hear a lady reporter describe that a plane had just flown into one of the WTC twin towers and like so many I thought it may have been a small prop plane............then the lady reporting almost screams in horror saying yet another plane has hit the other twin tower. At that moment, I stop what I'm doing and run across the room over to the TV to turn it on and (with the rest of you and America) watch in disbelief as to what I am witnessing happen in our country's largest city. En route to work I listen to the radio as most all who were driving in, around and through downtown Fort Worth were doing and once I get to work, our entire staff gathers in one of our director's office watching all the rest of this unfold on the TV in that office. The girls in our director's office were all teary eyed and (admittedly) most of us guys had those lumps in our throats and then we would all look at each other in disbelief as we watched both WTC towers fall to the ground.

In memory of those who lost their lives with thoughts and prayers to all their families who still mourn today... And God Bless America.......where each and every one of us appreciate each freedom we have because of those who protected them, ie, those who serve today in Iraq, Afghanistan, abroad and stateside AND........... those who served in the past. To all have a blessed day as we all remember the things in life that really matter to each and everyone of us.

meangreenmick, tack on another 10 or so years to your present Mean Green football experience assuming there are (still) few changes with NT football in those next 10 years of following this AND................then get back with us all and let us know if you are still as excited and passionate about what UNT leadership hath wrought to us all with who they hire and would have us $upport, OK? Leaving our MG football team out of this since they did sign onto all this (which is an admirable feat in itself, that is, unless perhaps in a few cases we were their only choice), but in all fairness and on all their behalf, none of our MG football team members make campus decisions that will affect their UNT experience the next few years on the gridiron whether that be positive or a not so positive experience. SO DO THOSE WHO DON'T SUPPORT ALL THIS LOW PROFILE'NESS' OF NT FOOTBALL & AN SBC/BOTTOM 10 CO-EXISTANCE HAVE COOTIES? Actually, who is to say that this growing army of collective voices may be the very constituency that finally reaches the collective minds and conscience of our upper echelon of UNT leadership so that they actually look into all this much closer than their past tradition says they will, but this time around, even they start looking at the bottom line of all this, that is, they start "counting the cost" of their past indecisiveness and how this is affecting the UNT community today and then.............. they make all the appropriate changes I'd bet some of this elite group of NT leaders (our UNT Board of Regents toward the top of this list?) wish they would have made quite a while back. Jim PS: Will also remind a handful of you that some UNT alums will show their continued passion for our alma mater by continuing their financial gifts or gifts of services in kind to their respective academic major or minor departments instead of NT athletics at this point in time. Hellsbells, I even have a rare book on Texas history I want to donate to the UNT History Dept. OR Willis Library.