PlummMeanGreen

All good and fine but 2 key questions I would have for Ms. Hairston: (1) Does she like college football? (2) And does she karaoke?

The last play (as I believe Old Timer suggested) should have been a Hail Mary but instead it (in deed) became a spiked ball to stop the clock. Why stop the clock when you can have your entire receiver corp going out on "go patterns" with a hopeful tipped ball for a possible TD? And come on, KBJ, Old Timer has been one of this board's most active and positive contributors as he seems to get articles posted on this forum about MG sports before DFW area newspaper who have those articles ink are dry. Keep up the good work, Old Timer. Many of us don't even have to buy newspapers anymore because we know you will have it own GMG.com before the roosters start crowing in the morning.

As a long time poster on GoMeanGreen.com and on the end part of Harry's Mean Green which preceeded this forum; anyway, during all that time I (as many of you) never dissed any Mean Green football player. Most of us who played Texas HS football can relate to some of what they are going thru, but few of us (certainly not this slow white boy) can relate to what they are going thru at the college level. I think we have talent on this football team, but (unfortunately for some) I think we are going to have a new UNT HFC who brings a whole new enthusiasm and Game Plan for them to reach their fullest potential and.............some discipline on the playing field will come along with that as well. You know, none of us would appreciate any message board commenting on any of our respective jobs for one minute, but when you are in a high profile position at the 4'th largest university in Texas and get paid some pretty decent monies, it just comes with the territory and DD knew this coming in since he grew up in a Big 8 Conference head football coaches home. I think we should actually admire all these guys for signing on with UNT and it is my hope as I know it would be many of yours that our younger Mean Green football players will play on a UNT football team that gets us out of a long drought of not being in the Top 20(now 25) ranking before they graduate. This is do-able at UNT because it was do-able at UTEP with Mike Price and speaking of UTEP Here is UNT and UTEP's all time football series record: UNT 13 Wins UTEP 5 Wins ** 3 Ties

Absolutely and no bout' a dout' it that we want the same thing. And FWIW, I also feel you know more about whats really going on on the inside than you are allowed to post. GMG! PlummMeanGreen@aol.com

ATTENTION: SHORT POST! SHORT POST! SHORT POST! Agree.....and I defer to another post/another thread where I said something to the effect of "come on, fellas, Hayden Fry is pushing well into his 80's" BUT............flyonthewall, IMO, where I feel we missed a golden opportunity with Hayden was hiring him as an athletic dept. fundraising consultant because in my Baby Boomer heart of hearts, I believe Hayden Fry (even today) could raise among all his Dallas contacts the "down payment" monies we need to turn dirt for what will hopefully not be a "too down-sized capacity" new football stadium at Eagle Point Campus. You've seen Coach Fry work a room, flyonthewall? It's really something to behold.

YOU WHO HAVE HYPERTESNION PROBLEMS FROM READING PMG POSTS I SUGGEST TO YOU TO NOT READ THIS POST: (OK, I GAVE YOU FAIR WARNING). SNAFU, Bill? That is not the word I would have used for our hiring of head football coaches history at UNT, but I also realize this is a family "PG" rated board, too. My gut feeling is when we have a HFC's opening one day (most likely sooner than later) at UNT, we will stick with our usual modus operendi and hire someone few of our group have heard of and then we will all "with arms open wide" welcome him to our fold just like 99.0 of us did Darrell Dickey with the most careful, responsible "national" search UNT had when DD was hired? uh...........................NOT! Those of the UNT BOR's who are NT Exes and you who are the really Big Donors which gives you some semblance of expertixe in Denton, please do try to help break the unsuccessful cycle of our school's football coaches hiring process while doing the most "un-North Texas" thing for a change and act like we'd really like to get the kind of hire who won't need 4 years of losing while at the same time trying to introduce himself to Texas HS football coaches. Our NT Exes who can need to use their influence to hire the (insert sublimenal "NAME" coach a la UTEP/Idaho) that will get this football program (bowl year or no bowl year) airborne and out of this Bottom of the NCAA D1-A Barrell co-existance. I mean come on now, folks, how many more bowl game appearances do we need to have with our football program still being ranked nowhere near the Top 50 do some of you need until you (on your very own) figure out for yourselves that this thing has not been progressing at all? So just what is it that we could all agree is progress at UNT? Well, we seem to have some examples to follow if we only will...........and we can start with the simple fact that even WAC and MAC football champions have been in or near the Top 25 when they are at the top of the heap of their respective leagues so wouldn't that be a starter for any SBC football champion and not just when UNT is at the top of the SBC? NO RESPECT? Of course we don't get respect because we can't beat anyone in NCAA D1-A ranked between the Top 50 thru the Top 75--so what kind of respect are we supposed to be getting with those kind of OOC results? HOPE ABOVE ALL HOPE..............There have been some "name' coach suggestion coming from various quarters and eras of this message board. That is a positive IMHO. Now if this all falls on deaf ears like it did with our KSU Konnection ring-leader, ie, former AD Craig Helwig still remains to be seen if we start looking for a new MG HFC in the next month or so. OH GOD! PLEASE..............NOT AGAIN? ? ? ? ? ? But still...........my gut feeling is when the time arrives for their to be a change that our officials will blow yet another head football coaches hire because of why? Well, how about the fact that we have a history that suggests that we will blow it once again, that's why. We'll have a couple UNT leaders who will tell us "we can't afford" the kind of hires that even the freakin' Idaho Vandals pulled off with their Coach Dennis Erickson and worse........... some of you will actually fall for that explanation, but many of us will not but merely shake our heads and tell each other: "Whoops! We Did It Again!" We let our own do it to us just one more time! Couldn't they have at least brought a jar a vaseline this time? :blink BUT..............here's hoping that I will have to eat crow (that I have rarely had to eat concerning UNT football going on 4 decases because "dammit" we just have a history to go by in Denton AND.................. just like many of you, I, too, have been pretty accurate with an assessmennt of this football program for going on those 4 decades as far as who should be most likely be employed at our alma mater and (most likely) those who probably shouldn't be on our payroll. So for all us who are "EXPERTS" on such things you might ask "just what has been the barometers that has been used to make our assessments? HOLD THE BOARD................... ...........YOU MEAN UNT HAS A BAROMETER OF SUCCESS WHEN IT COMES TO ATHLETICS? IF SO, WHAT THE HELL IS IT? Is it.............building yet another venue or facility out at Eagle Point Campus that if we don't build such we are going to be out of the inter-collegiate athletic business? No, I don't think we can really use that for our baromether, either, can we? I mean aren't those faclities sort of, uh, bare minimum neccessities? A BAROMETER FOR UNT: With many of us, you can simply start with turnstile numbers at the 4'th largest university in the Lone Star State, thats uh, Texas, for those of you who got here as quickly as you could. But what has been the turnstile count even during bowl years at our Denton-based main campus which is now closing in on 34,000 enrollment; what has been our turnstile count at our Denton-based school located in a boom population city with over 100,000 citizens in Denton and Denton Country closing in on 600,000 citizens? So who would be the one to tell us that during s 4 bowl year run that 15K per home game averages during those 4 years is really the norm? Who would tell you that that you could look at such a person imparting such information and your being able to maintain a straight face while he is telling you such? BE NICE TO CUSTOMERS THAT DON'T GIVE A JILLION BUCKS TO UNT: Also not to be over-looked in past years are attitudes of condescending arrogance some UNT athletic employees have pompously dished out without (apparently) being accountable to anyone for such. And such arrogance (wait a minute--arrogance from those who annually gave us 15K per home game turnstile numbers during 4 bowl years? (FWIW, even that is worth a Norm Hitzghes kind of giggle). Nevertheless, such arrogance aimed at some of our very own fellow NT Exes who have probably forgotten more about NORTH TEXAS than most of the ones dishing out such arrogance will ever take the time to learn about an employer who has paid them pretty well and (quite frankly) not expected much in the area of results while doing so. ARROGANCE, YOU SAY? That is such a non customer friendly attitude from some NT employees who have most of their careers in Denton been an integral part of a department that has (mostly) been an across the boardfailure if one even uses multi-year W/L records as another barometer. And to quote one of those illustrious NT employees: Did You All Like That? Well, many of us don't like that and hope that future administrative methods by Rick V (or whoevers in charge up there) will change that as to insure that this kind of condescending bullshit is not allowed to continue at a Texas state-assisted institution, namely most of our's alma mater; you know, the one that even Texas tax payers help underwrite? For crissakes', you still reading this?!?!?!? It is the belief of many that we would all rally behind a true name head football coach in our future; but is is also the belief of many that at this point in time of our football history and with our past dismal record of hiring HFC's at UNT the last 2 1/2 decades that any less of a hire could really become a problem and UNT leaders can mostl likely count on the fact that there will be no rallying to take place the way it really needs to be taking place right now at a school like UNT. YIELD NOT TO THE TEMPTATION TO KEEP OUR POOR HIRING OF HFC'S AT UNT RECORD IN TACT, CUT THRU THE FAT & POLITICS OF ALL THIS AND PLEASE DO NOT HIRE CRONIES BUT GIVE US A NAME COACH THAT WE WILL ALL RALLY BEHIND (and then you'll really be Glad 2B Green). PS: Have A Nice Day!

Ouch! eulesseagle, don't put me in that particular AARP category just yet! LOL! Actually, it was the 1970's when I began my walk "down the corridor of years" in Denton. BUT...............Fry Street adjacent to our campus during the Viet Nam war was one very unique place I think we'd all admit. I swear I see some of the same hippies I saw during my era at UNT when I still come up to MG Country. I know I can't be hallucinating, but then again, maybe I am. SERIOUSLY? UNT could afford and offer almost the same package Mike Price is getting at UTEP and El Paso Eagle I think would agree with that since (I think) it was he who posted what Price made several weeks ago. Downsizing some dead weight in the UNT Athletic Dept. would easily come up with the $150,000 some of you have said we would need. Truth be known, those kind of monies are probably "find-able" and do-able w/o downsizing, but at most school's athletic departments aren't there occasional needs for some fresh new faces? I mean come on, folks, don't ministers even move after they've sorta' worn their welcomes out or perhaps they've probably preached one too many sermons on tithing? There are most likely those in the UNT Athletic Dept. who probably would benefit from having their own fresh new start elsewhere if they would admit to it because would our "possible" upcoming and completely new football staff at UNT need to really hear from some old athletic dept. nestors who may just attempt to throw some cold water on their enthusiasm?

Uh, # 15 out of 11 NCAA D1-A conferences? Don't think this is what Wright Waters had in mind. But can we turn all this into an opportunity at UNT? If UNT were to have an opening for our HFC position at UNT AND............. if we hire a high "enough: profile coach (I know, I'm using those 2 "H P" words a bit lately, arent' I) Nevertheless......why can't it be such a hire that elevates the entire SBC across the board inasmuch as if we were to get a UTEP type hire, then a Top 25 ranking in a UNT coaches 2'nd year (as the Miners did with MPrice); then doesn't the entire SBC have to step up to the plate to raise their own football standards as well? ........................................ QUESTION: Who in the SBC has yet to put any of its teams in the same Top 25 neighborhood that WAC and MAC schools have done on more than just a few occasions? Why can't that SBC school who pulls this off be UNT since we did (after all) have Top 20 rankings back in the mid-1970's? And for UNT to be able to do this again, do we hire yet another unknown project coach at our main campus in Denton, Texas, America? PS: This is really not rocket science for those on campus who would make it that. ....................................... CUSA still on the mind? Folks, IMHO, the only way UNT gets into CUSA is if SMU does 1 or 2 things: (1) Drops football (and who the heck knows, they might not do that just so they can keep UNT out of CUSA)! (2) Closes the door of their university which is most likely not going to happen. :rolleyes So maybe we just need to raise the ante (higher profile NCAA D1-A co-existance) with our SBC membership and our alma mater simply bloom where we are planted?

LongJim, when you and your better half come out this time around, I'll introduce you to a whole bunch of NT Exes who now make me look like a MG fan starter kit.

Come on, folks, maybe 5 or so years ago, but I think Coach Fry is approaching his 80's? But I've always thought that Coach Fry putting in a good word on UNT's behalf to a "would be" very high profile hire would work wonders in giving us a chance to interview such and maybe even hire said higher profile head football coach. Also still think Coach Fry should have been hired as an athletic fund-raising consultant but (unfortunately) I think we have way too many egos at UNT for this to have ever happened. Still kinda' funny how we didn't mind hiring Gene Stallings and pay him a small fortune to consult for us just to tell us (among other positive things that he did tell us) to wait almost another full generation before we built a new football stadium on our campus? At UNT, we just don't always seem to function as those we would truly like to emulate do most times it seems.

Rick "GGII" Spears, you never cease to amaze me with your energy! Gosh, I'd love to have a copy of that photo of you, Dallas Green, Coach Fry and myself at the old Denton Center on University Drive near TWU. What a memory and collectable for me. But.............I will quickly remove my name for consideration before a "Draft PMG for UNT Head FB Coach" begins on GoMeanGreen.com! FWIW, I am not high profile enough for the UNT job but once I get high profile enough, I might change my mind completely! (just kiddin' folks) BTW, another full blown Karaoke/BBQ party is on the horizon here at the ranchero. Rick. An Elvis Tribute Show will be added to this party and he even performed at FW's famous Green Oaks Inn's Feathers night club just last Thursday night. BTW, the real Elvis actually stayed there in his last FW appearance and they have an Elvis Suite for those who want to shell out some bucks to stay in the same room that "The King" had slept in. BUT.........I hope many of you who came to the last one are not too pissed with PMG's pointed and poignant opinion to come out because as LBJ used to say: Come Let Us Reason Together? Even have a Tea-Sipper, ie, LongJim, who says count him in on the next karaoke gig/BBQ. I am going to try to get FFR to come out (again) and do his BBQ thing (and even pay him for his services since there will be a nice crowd; and hopefully, our own Dallas "Polk Salad Annie" Green and wife will make a re-appearance. You ain't EVER heard Polk Salad Annie until you've heard Dallas Green's version; also our own infamous Harry Miers (and do bring your wife this time, Mr. Miers) as well as others of you who couldn't make the last one but said you wanted to come to the next party out here in Commanche/Kiowa Country (can I say that)? PS: To others who want to see what Baby Boomers (and a few young gun alums) do for fun and will make the drive, just email me and I don't care if you're For or Against our school's present football direction--you'll get an invite.

CHASING GREEN RABBITS TURNED LOOSE (LOSE)! First of all, we are all concerned for the health of Darrell Dickey. I don't know any monsters on this board who would be so low as to wish ill health or ill will to DD or anyone (even if they don't agree with their style or opinions). Jeez, folks, UNT athletics is still the toy section of all of our's department store of life, now isn't it? Many of us don't mix with NT athletic officials because we don't live in or near Denton and most of us probably don't have the time nor will make the time, so how could any of this group hate (I prefer "dislike") Darrell Dickey or Rick V or anyone on that staff? Most of us have no more time for them than they probably should for grUNTS (although I suppose they are to be admired for that). BUT..................wouldn't we all rather our UNT officials be mixing with those out there who could give more money (insert sublimenal "build our new football stadium" types?) to NT Athletics than most of this message board's members added together, but still...................their giving those any semblance of their time is something you just won't get at UT, TAMU, Texas Tech, Baylor, UH, UTEP, Rice, S M U or a TCU----get my drift? ADLER, I vowed to not attend another DD-coached UNT football game after last season when my light turned on with all this because I had just seen all I needed to see with this gang (and apparently many, many others had as well); but, right or wrong, this is how many of us are choosing to make our statement and I know that you know many of this group, personally. After 30 plus years of many of us following MG football, this is just not what we had in mind as what should be the direction for our football program. There are those out there who are downright a helluva' lot more angrier about all this than I could ever be to be honest. YET............I'm not sure why those of us (until last Saturday night) were being preached to (by some on this forum) as to how unloyal we were to our school (in general) because we actually wanted something better for it? I guess many of us still need someone to explain that concept to us if they feel they can. Also, some of us can still send monies to UNT to their chosen academic departments (most of the time what they majored in) at UNT. Are these also NT Exes who are not loyal to their alma mater? And no, I don't get into pissing contests on this board with any poster until (I feel) a poster calls me out with something I deem a bit ridiculous and so I bring out my pit bull keyboard when that happens. On GoMeanGreen.com, I have always tried to post on the subject of a post rather than the poster (even if I didn't have that poster listed in my GMG.com Top 10 favorite posters); but I don't have to have a "remove" button or link on this forum to not pay attention to those who I think are a bit touched with their dedication to what has been our alma mater's athletic life in the lower quadrant of NCAA D1-A and even what many of us saw as even worse----how so many seemed to be quite comfortable with that co-existance of an athletic program. THERE ARE JUST SOME THINGS IN MG COUNTRY THAT ARE TOO PREDICTABLE: Many of us knew if we were to get beat (few of us never dreamed we'd get hammered) by MTSU, that there would be many who would make 180 degree turnarounds with their attitude toward Darrell Dickey and the direction of this football program because that is just the nature of many sports fans. Not sure why it took so long for some, but on the other hand, I'm not sure why it took so long for me, either. I think about 99.9% of us on GoMeanGreen.com at some point had (with gritting teeth) supported DD Ball even when he didn't seem to be doing well like for example: How many of us weren't at that UNT/'MTSU game in 2001 when DD's back was way against the wall having gotten beat by ULM the week B4 when he was supposedly fired after that game by Rick V and then immediately rehired by NT BOR chairman Bobby Ray? At no point have I said our methods of the way we are making our statements known to UNT leaders is the right method but its just the method we have chosen because we do think that even UNT officials who can pretty well at any time proceed with their own personal agendas using our alma mater as their personal vehicle to do so; anyway, we do think even they notice empty seats. Anyone don't think they noticed all of your own empty seats after many left after the 1'st half last Saturday night? How about the fact that they (I'm sure) noticed the empty seats to all of you who even chose to leave the MTSU game early as well? Well..............I don't judge anyone's choice as to how they want to express to our leadership that we have no personal vendettas toward any of them at all, but its just that many of us have seen much better (and higher profile) wins in the history of Mean Green football and that probably because we had the much higher profile hire in charge if present UNT leadership will only look at our athletic history and learn from it for a change. And yes, there are many, many of us who can read our past history of hiring head football coaches who still don't trust those of even this group and who they would end up hiring to replace DD if he were to not come back next Fall. Could they possibly blame us for that, too? BRING OUT THE MEAN GREEN! Hellsbells and to you present UNT students and to you who are brand new young gun alums; anyway, UNT once had a football program of whose quality was that that it made the NCAA's top division's Top 20 a couple or more times. Now there are many more of you (as of this 3'rd day after our hammering by MTSU) who also seem to now think we can hire those who can raise this football program back up to get us back to a level as to where more will want to support and validate those who our UNT leaders hire and those who UNT leaders choose to keep on payroll as varsity coaches because those varsity coaches are doing the minimum of what any alum from any NCAA school would expect and that is: Winning more games than they lose after having a fair number of few years to do so. WE CAN DO BETTER BECAUSE WE HAVE DONE BETTER...

Please, please, please don't hire any buddies or cronies! Didn't we just experience something similar as that with one of Craig Helwig's buddies? Do we not learn from our history at UNT or do we just want to keep repeating it? Our record of head football coaches hiring is also toward the bottom of NCAA D1-A if anyone would dare look at the list of names (some who were some real characters) who have come and gone thru Denton post-Fry era. Its an abysmal record of hiring with some bright moments but not near enough for all the years we are talking about here. BUT..............Bob Davie is an interesting new name and I, for one, am glad he was listed. He is presently an ESPN TV analyst, but he has that TAMU background with Texas HS football recruiting ties and hellsbells.............he was the freakin' head football coach at Notre Dame folks! NOTE: An over-enthusiastic Notre Dame alum got caught in paying some Irish players during the Davie years but I don't think Coach Davie was tied to that any more than the late Jim Wacker was for a similar activity at TCU back in the 1980's. Yet isn't a Davie hire (or one who has a similar Texas background) the kind of hire we need at a Texas-based university? AGAIN...........Please, please, please don't hire buddies or country cousins who wouldn't know how to pronounce the Texas town called Refugio or wouldnt' know what part of Texas Tenaha, Timpson, Bobo and Blair are located. Of course, a Texas Almanac can always come in handy even for a damn-yankee. We can't do another 9 years toward the bottom of NCAA D1-A can we? I hope those 2 key UNT Board of Regents who monitor this board will read this entire thread. We cannot screw up this next hire, folks, when we have just as much right to emulate what a UTEP and an Idaho did with their own high profile hires.

Sorry, fellas, but I think the extra $150,000 could easily be found by down-sizing the NT athletic department which would probably free up more than $150K. Then you hire the high profile name football coach, a la Mike Price*, Dennis Erickson, etc, etc,....................and then several thousand additional football season ticket sales later you can re-hire (if you even need to) those who were down-sized out of Denton to make room for the high profile hire. Just looking at past football souvenir programs and the complete pictorial of (almost) our entire athletic ancillery staff, it really seems to be a bit top-heavy for a school that has been operating toward the bottom part of NCAA D1-A. No, I will not go into any names but some of you have said to me for years: "What in the wide world of sports could that multi-year UNT athletic employee possibly be making for what he seems to not be doing?" * Didn't El Paso Eagle recently post that Mike Price was not making all that one might have thought he would be making at UTEP (or at least what his base salary was)? Yet Coach Price had the kind of incentives, ie, increased attendance, increased fundraising for the Miner Club and of course, winning seasons as some pretty nice perk if he became successful.

And didn't most every 1995 Mean Green football game (home and away) get televised here in the DFW Metroplex? And GrayEagleOne, we all remember what new head football coach who came to Denton after Rust's disasterous year came in here like the Pied Piper, raised in 2 months what would be the equivalent of $1,000,000 today and we went from being a very bad Rod Rust football team to tying for the Missouri Valley Conference football championship under Coach Hayden Fry. Jeez! If we can only live long enough to see all this happen just one more time with a similar hire, Jack (and many of you others who were around back then, too). Of course, the ol' Mo' Valley that Fry's team tied for its championship in 1973 had mostly schools now in the Big East and CUSA as I recall. It was a shame the MVC did not have a bowl tie-in or AD/Head Football Coach Fry would have never taken us out of that league.

No matter who calls the plays, we have to have the personnel to execute the kind of running game DD had wanted last year and well into this season.

I'm praying for all of you!

In fact, UNTLifer, found out just today that there are actually 2 of our most influential BOR's who monitor this most diversified spectrum of opinion forum. Guess many of us have also read where Bill Gates when he was actively running MicroSoft frequented his company's "grunt's message board almost daily to see what the pulse of his people were as well; probably not a bad idea.

eulesseagle, you know just as well as the rest that (especially) now we don't just need "anyone" to replace DD; that is, if he were to be re-assigned or terminated after this football season. We have been doing the hiring of "just anyone" at UNT since you know who left in 1978. We of UNT need not banish ourselves to life on the NCAA D1-A lower shelf just because that has been our direction for most of the last 2 1/2 decades. NOT UTEP AGAIN?!?! UTEP hired someone who had them in the freakin' Top 25 in his 2'nd year. Hellsbells, folks! UTEP has been a basketball only schools since they were called Texas Western U. When the time comes, UNT still must look into hiring the "impact (high profile) coach" who can come into Denton on the run and get us back to where we once were in the eyes of the rest of NCAA D1-A. We all know that 4 bowl games did not get us inside the Top 25 or FWIW................ ............not even inside the Top 50 which happened with the football champioins of the WAC and the MAC. We need to copy other schools similar to UNT hires that can elevate not only our school for the first time in a long time, but elevate the entire Sun Belt creating a scenario where even our fellow Sun Belt schools need to copy what NORTH TEXAS is doing. FAU's Coach Schnellenberger is now in his 70's and does not have the same energy he had when he was at Miami close to 30 years ago winning a national championship or two. Yet it was Coach Howie' who gave the Miami 'Canes their 1'st N.C. ever and no one can ever take that away from the FAU head football coach. AND ONE SMALL REMINDER? UNT has yet to beat FAU in 2 attempts with one of those losses during our last bowl year when FAU was a SBC member-in-waiting. .............................................................................. THE TOAST OF THE TOWN WAS WEARING MEAN GREEN! NORTH TEXAS was (literally) the toast of the 1976 Winter NCAA convention a couple of months after our win over the University of Tennessee. I recall hearing Coach Fry talk about all the kudos UNT was receiving from the real Big Boys of that era. At that time, it was NORTH TEXAS who was the up and coming football program as well as a new college football force that would have to be reckoned with in the Southwest BUT HERE WE GO AGAIN AT UNT AS............... ................AFTER WE HIT AN IMPRESSIVE PLATEAU IN OUR FOOTBALL PROGRAM--WE THEN GO INTO RETREAT MODE AND WHY IS THAT? It's because we go to the lower shelf to hire our head football coach replacements.......... So at UNT its "1 Giant Step Forward & 3 Back" time in Denton which is a cycle that we must break next time we hire a new head football coach. And we all know one of the characteristics of those 3 Steps Back times right? Well, that usually starts with our pulling in all the stops (instead of pulling out all the stops) and then you hear talk among the troops of hiring "our own folks" to get this thing turned around to where Fry had it. FWIW, has that really ever happened in Denton as of October 2, 2006? SO WHY NOT? Why not save ourselves from having to take 4 or 5 years to introduce a new UNT head football coach to those who will count the most in our state in the long run, ie, those who are members of the Texas High School Football Coaches Association?

Vito's DRC quote: "UNT had too many recruits who didn’t pan out in the past few years and left the team. The Mean Green’s offensive and defensive lines are possibly the weakest groups to play at UNT in years. The number of difference-makers on defense is startlingly low considering how many stars played for the Mean Green just a few years ago." The Fry/Moore Curse! Sadly, we are almost back at square one at UNT from the first year DD arrived on the Mean Green scene. You cannot go to 4 bowl games in a row and "NOT" recruit somebody...................unless you have other diversions, ain't trying to recruit and have a coaching staff with visions of sugar plums and the Big Time on the brain? UNT has what I have called (forever) the Fry/Moore curse, ie, UNT head football coaches who followed those 2 NT coaches thinking a little success in Denton mean't a free ticket to the Big Time. I think that so called "curse" has now ended with DD since 4 bowl games with a 9 & 3 record in his 2'nd bowl game didn't even get him a Big Time interview. Hey folks, did you ever ask yourselves: What is wrong with that picture? I finally woke up, smelled the coffee and asked that question. Hayden Fry and Jerry Moore, of course, were 2 Mean Green coaches who both got higher profile jobs after a few years in Denton. Few years? How about only 2 years in Denton for Jerry Moore? We all know from our Mean Green football history book which wins Fry had that got him a Big 10 job. Probably, few of our young gun alums know too much of Jerry Moore's short 2 year stint in Denton. Well..............a 2 year .500 W/L record amazingly helped him get the Texas Tech head football coaches job. Yet...........honest to goodness..............there were few tears shed in Denton when Jerry Moore left for Lubbock as he really never did "positively" connect with our alumnus and MG fan base. He took some left-over Fry talent, was .500 in those 2 years with that talent and then got the Texas Tech job? Too many dust storms in Lubbock that year I suppose. Jerry Moore probably did more to get the "Fry/Moore" curse started than his predecessor who at least spent 6 years at UNT. Yet the Fry/Moore "curse" didn't stop most UNT coaches who followed those 2 from still thinking they could get a little success at UNT and then boogy down the road out of Denton to the Big Time. But IMHO and FWIW.............I believe it would be safe to say now that success at UNT by DD (albeit in the lower profile SBC) has forever ended the Fry/Moore curse since 4 bowl games seemed to not impress the ones DD needed those trips to the Big Easy to impress the most: Texas HS blue chip prospects.

He was mentioned by another poster or 2 in recent weeks and it was an intriguing thought...although, I think R.C. was re-assigned at TAMU and probably makes more in that job than DD makes as a head football coach at UNT (would be my guess). Here is our illustrious list of coaching hires post-Hayden Fry: Jerry Moore: Was hired at NT with our being told he had been the offensive coordinator at Nebraska when (in fact) he was only the receiver's coach. Maybe a bit of deception from our leaders even as far back as then? Texas Tech saw in Jerry Moore what few of our biggest fans did. In only a 2 year career in Denton, he was .500 in W/L's at and many UNT head football coaches who would follow Fry/Moore thought they had to just have a little bit of success at UNT to get their own Big Time job. How totally untrue that theory would become. Bob Tyler: What can you say other than we played a couple games in the Cotton Bowl during the State Fair and we all got to meet some Deep Southern fried comedian named Elmer Phud-Pucker (during a post game concert that featured T.G. Sheppard among others). Here's hoping that Elmer doesn't apply for the UNT job post-DD because he would probably get an interview over R.C. Slocum. Corky Nelson: Let's all say "ROLLER COASTER RIDE" in unison. In all fairness, Corky never complained about our lack of football facilites or the gross negligence of those we did have. Dennis Parker: All you who like Texas HS football success stories here is one that was not a success at the Leading University of the Metroplex. UNT and Parker was never a good marriage almost from the git-go. Matt Simon: 1994 was a special season for many of us with much unity among the troops to buy season tickets and show up en mass at Fouts Field (which we did) to meet the attendance criteria that got us back into NCAA D1-A; Simon saw early on that he would be another NT coach post-Fry era that would not follow the "Fry Tradition" of winning a few top games as UNT coach and then getting a Big 10 type job. Helwig's scheduling drove Simon crazy. He really lost it toward the end of his career at UNT and had many worried that he'd truly had a nervous breakdown. Darrell Dickey: Was on a very short list of coaching candidates with only one name on that list--namely his. DD's was probably the quickest hiring coup in NCAA history, but with not one from UNT (or the NT Exes or Denton civic leadership) having any semblance of say whatsoever. DD was destined to never be able to win the kind of games that would get him to the next level of NCAA D1-A as a head football coach. He and his staff really did seem to give up on recruiting following a 9 & 3 season that did not get them to a Big 12-type job and now has us sucking wind in the lowest rated NCAA D1-A league of them all. Next Head Football Coach At UNT? Depends on who really has the major influence on who hires the next UNT head football coach, now doesn't it? Want to get depressed? Then just think about those who just kept sending up those extended contract proposals for all those under .500 varsity coaches at UNT and then think about all those who just kept on rubber-stamping them as the ones who will hire our next head football coach at UNT. So does anyone prefer an R.C. Slocum-type hire over some Deep Southern fried hayseed from Yazoo City, MS. who wouldn't know that if your going to have a band in Texas, you have to have a fiddle in the band? Nor would they know any Texas HS football coaches who could help our cause to some extent. BUT HOPE OF ALL HOPE WOULD BE THIS SCENARIO: Maybe some UNT official on our campus will do like some official at UTEP and Idaho did and say: What we've been doing the last 20 plus years hasn't been working gang so----------LETS TRY SOMETHING TOTALLY OUTSIDE OUR USUAL BOX IN OUR NEXT HIRING OF A HEAD FOOTBALL COACH, OK?

Yet don't mis-underestimate this forum, HoustonEagle. A most reliable source says that one of our most influential NT Board of Regents regularly monitors what is being posted on GoMeanGreen.com; but your suggestions are still pretty darn good ones IMO. The part that concerns many of us the most are the ones who will actually make all the future decisions for a new head football coaching hire at UNT when that day arrives. We as UNT alums are (literally) at the mercy of those who might be tempted to hire some of their "good ol' boy" type buddy hires or past coaching associates/friends to lead our future. I think many might now agree that we have already been in the midst of such a football hire the past few years but that is all I will say about that.

If there was a job opening at UNT in a few weeks: There will certainly be many names kicked around. I'm sure Coach Spence has a bright future, Got5onit, but would his coming to the Lone Star State help his career and help the Mean Green get into the homes of real, bonafide blue chip Texas HS football players as an R.C. Slocum (or someone with Texas recruiting ties) would as UNT head football coach? R. C. would have the name ID going for him although I was never too wild about his offense at TAMU which could remind some of what we run now with our present "less than creative" offense. This time around, we cannot allow our leaders to even hint to us that they can low brow us into thinking we are not worthy of something better or that we cannot do what UTEP and Idaho did when they made their own coaching changes to something different than they had ever had. At UNT, at least we've been there (high profile hire) and done that and some of us who were NT students/MG fans from that era still cannot keep our mouths shut as to what we witnessed back in that era that made a lasting impression. Another top choice (probably my favorite because of his national name ID) would be Rick Neuheisel which would give a school like UNT a chance to (finally) recruit a blue chip QB since even Troy Aichman gives Coach Neuheisel much credit for his own development as a college QB. Hey folks! If the freakin' Idaho Vandals can get a Dennis Erickson as their head football coach, can't UNT talk to a Rick Neuheisel about a possible future opening? IMO.................shooting for the moon and hitting the barn in the area of higher profile hirings at many non-BCS schools will still give them something better than what they have now (and a brighter future as well). But............that is just my .02 on what I've seen happen at other similar outposts as UNT.