PlummMeanGreen

TFLF, I will believe that we beat Tulsa when I see it in 3 inch headlines in the Denton Record-Chronicle or the Dallas Morning News. You were born in 1969? Well, I was graduating from HS that same May but North Texas last win against Tulsa many of us older alums saw in an ABC TV Regional Game of the Week. That broadcast in itself was a minor miracle because the SWC pretty well had a hold on that weekly time slot. (As always I stand to be corrected, but you who were around during the Mean Joe Greene era would you confirm that we had at least 2 of our games televised by ABC TV back then)? If you would have mentioned most of the Sun Belt and even some CUSA schools back in 1969 many of us would have said: " Huh? Never heard of em'." Well, many for darn sure knew about the North Texas Mean Green during that era and the era after that one before we went into brain freeze mode on behalf of our then UNT leadership. It's been quite a wilderness journey of which many reading this post know exactly what I'm talking about with that. Best part of present day is I feel with all our pieces of the puzzle finally in place (with Apogee at the top of that list) I feel we will now go further in the NCAA than this program ever has. I really sincerely believe that. GMG!

I fear too many Texas based schools in one conference will begat us too many things of which the negatives outweigh the positives. Arkanasas AD Frank Broyles took the Hogs out of the SWC because of several things but toward the top of his list was his saying "there are just too many Texas schools in one conference." Seems TAMU has a new lease on NCAA FBS level life away from the rest of our Texas schools, too, now doesn't it? Seems their over 100 year rivalry with UT didn't stop them, either. This "let all of us Texas schools unite" attitude did not get TCU where they are today. They made themselves exclusive "away" from a hodge-podge of Texas schools (including SMU) and then they created a coveted (by the Big 12) product that did not come from a league that looked like the old CUSA or the old Southland (1-AA) or even the Lone Star Conference--all quite top heavy with Texas-based schools. If we water ourselves down with schools we've always thought ourselves a cut above our forever perception-driven public would see North Texas as no better than those we dipped down to get in bed with. I did not like Brit Banowsky's almost panic driven choices of schools he later added to the new CUSA truth be known. I think he could have held out a little longer and had 1 or 2 better choices (or even those who may have stiffed the AAC and stayed in the new CUSA). Still, we need our present and future leadership at North Texas who understands the decades long and basic Texas intercollegiate pecking order. Few outsiders are going to change that which has been set in stone for decades, either. Scattershootin': Moving Forward No Matter Who We're With: All we really have to go on even now are results of plans whose foundations have already been laid. If ever a football program needs 6 or 7 wins this season it is our alma mater's. All in all, I think most of us like the direction we see at UNT, but a few bonehead moves here and there can negate all of that in just about a New York minute. GMG!

I've never understood how some pro start-ups, ie, even minor league baseball in DFW (specifically Frisco) and other parts of our state the last 1 or 2 decades could somehow get instant attendance and support over many more home games per season than we ever have in Denton for a any one football season of 5 or 6 home games. I will never understand that. I think most of us would feel better about all of this if we just knew that serious attempts from Rawlins, the BOR's and UNT athletics to once and for all solve this problem were being made; who knows, maybe they are working on this even now but if so it is quite a top secret project. KRAM1? Enlighten us on this subject if you can...., please? If you think about it, a half filled (or less) stadium effects all of us from the UNT Chancellor, the UNT (main campus) President, the UNT BOR's and all the way down to even the casual fan. Matter a fact, wouldn't a filled stadium create the necessary momentum with what we want to do at the NCAA FBS level and even flip many of those casuals and borderliners to become bonafide Mean Green fan'atics? Everyone wants to be part of something that appears to have many others wanting to also be a part, too. GMG!

Brit: Just Say No!

The Mean Green Nation! ..(All in all, we should never discourage the enthusiasm of our youth.....carry on, SSP). OK already! A bit of over-kill with the song, but WTH, I always did like that song. GMG!

No better thing than to be with the kids for any event, but good golly Miss Molly, we are going to take a national TV attendance hit for the Rice game unless something is in the works promotions-wise of a multi-thousands of fans kind of nature to fill in some empty spots. We are both in the entertainment and "how full is your stadium" perception business, folks. ;(

DREX!

Water under the bridge now, but if TDodge's teams would have won all those 4'th quarter and last minute heartbreak losses he would probably still be at UNT as the HFC. Todd Dodge was a class act for those who recognize such and can admit it and he also left North Texas the way any "fired" employee should leave their job no matter what profession. Riley Dodge? What more can we say about him especially the way he layed it all on the field---our field. Like many of you, I'm content with who we have at the helm now to the extent that I expect this group to take us all places none of us have seen in MG Country no matter what era we attended North Texas. Yes, I said "no matter what era we attended North Texas." GMG!

Still nothing like being in an Apogee Stadium seat for this Mean Green fan. Heck! How could I be part of "the wave" sitting in front a giant screen with 3 other people? GMG! GMG!

My long time friend Buffalo Bill and even sometimes Fouts Field West Stands Wrastler'.....your advice well taken. Actually, I think the one(s) I really wanted to read that epistle I have a big hunch already have. Those who want to try to get thru the whole thing do so at their own risk of falling asleep at their own keyboard and drowning in their own cup of coffee. Love Those Mean Green!. BTW, Bill, I did take Cerebus advice and only left the DMagazine link on that post instead. My own words still a tad manifesto'esque, though. Some things I will do till the day I die I guess.

Cerubus, I am having a low sugar Type 2 sort of morning. My apology. PMG.

Cerebus, you mind your business and I will mind mine. Deal? Do I tell you what to post or to not post? Go eat some oatmeal, it will help you stay regular. GMG! PS: If Harry needs to adjust or even remove this or any post he knows I will not object. Yet for those who want to get serious about real college football promotions at North Texas I thought it an important article to read. Greatest thing about that program is that it first worked for a football program that had mostly been losing. I think we of North Texas can relate to that, right? AND......one year (an announced) 6,000 fans show up or an SMU/Rice game in Dallas and then 2 years later, uh, 60,000 for an SMU/Rice game at Texas Stadium. To us who were around back in that day, that did get our attention at North Texas to say the least. UTSA has been getting national pub for what they are drawing at home and for damn sure not what they've won the last 3 years. That should show to many just how important those turnstile numbers are with even the national media. We have not received similar attention.

LOL! Yes, probably my wordiest post EVER! Yet the DMagazine feature article on SMU's Mustang Mania is the real read of my post. I'd place a small wager that most UNT alums are not old enough to have seen it least of all read it so.... .........just ignore what I've posted if you have to choose between the 2. (I know we have a real busy readership on this message board, though, especially the ones presently in their offices and on their bosses nickel who spend most all day posting on it)? Yet for those wanting to know how a real (and successful) college football promotions program works will read the DMagazine part above albeit may be just 1 or 2 but they will still read it. And who knows, It just might be the "right" 1 or 2 who read it who would be the very ones to put some feets to a similar program at North Texas in the sweet by and by? I'd bet Coach McCarney and his football team would love for UNT to try something even close to a Mustang Mania kind of promotions program--no doubt they want to coach and play in front of larger crowds? (Still, even at my approaching older age, one can still dream, ya' know). AND.............any bets on how many from the UNT staff have already read the DMagazine part of my Manifesto #339? Actually, it was my hope that 1 or 2 from that group would, because what is in the content of that feature article is sorta' the kind of thing that some of them do for a living at our alma mater?.

I must have missed the post which begat this response. Someone feel free to enlighten me on what that post was. Thanks in advance.

Ammeded Wednesday AM, Sept. 26: The SMU Mustang Mania promotions project as described in the DMagazine feature story "way down below" and that promotions efforts by SMU had a real bonafide & well planned infra-structure in place along with corporate sponsorships for it to have a real chance to succeed. We've never tried anything close to this at North Texas; most years we did not have the budget or the manpower (and still don't) to attempt giving such a promo program "the good ol' college try." SMU's Mustang Mania promotional program was not the reason SMU had a Death Penalty. As for North Texas? Take the good aspects from the below D Magazine article and just leave the bad & ugly behind. Again, Mustant Mania had nothing to do with what SMU HFC Ron Meyer and his staff would eventually do to create quite a mess that went all the way to the Texas Governor's Mansion. Firstly, let's get something straight: North Texas does not have near enough personnel within the UNT Athletic Department to pull this kind of promotions program off at the moment and is another reason why our entire UNT constituency would have to work together to make something similar work for the Mean Green. Many on this board will remember that SMU didn't half a$$ their promotions program but had a "can do" attitude from the git-go--nothing would stop that era's Mustang Maniacs from succeeding. They walked into a business owner's office and would not leave until that Business Owner did something for the Mustang Manica cause. There was no shortage being pro-active for what at that time was a losing SMU football program. They, too, were selling a dream. . (I do think they had a budget to get the ball rolling, though, which they say they didn't in the below DMagazine feature story.. Brad Thomas, ie, the SMU promotions guy working under SMU AD Russ Potts had a literal army of SMU supporters (students) who did all the grunt work for him, AD Potts and what would become a successful promotions program. Sorry, fellow alums, but such an army for UNT cannot be organized in the middle of this football season, but not that we shouldn't still try some things this Fall that could still work on the spur. If we have good attendance at North Texas this Fall (or any Fall for that matter) its because the UNT student body would have been inspired to have come out en mass for said game; or to not have come out en mass for said game, ie, the Ball State game. Most games I feel we have good UNT student support. That seems contingent on what any new UNT freshmen class chooses to do since I feel that is the group who make or break any home game attendance at Apogee. Like in the article below, even "then" SMU AD says "eventually it's all about winnning" and we know at North Texas we've not had much of that lately but.........most seem to see a light at the end of our green-tinted tunnel. Still, most attendance at Apogee seems to be determined on if our UNT student body is inspired to come to a specific game. Still, it seems we are literally at our UNT's students desires as "to want to support all this or not" mercy at this point especially with no other "built it" large numbers of butts in seats promos like Band Days, Scout Days, PeeWee Football, etc, etc, etc promotions on our future Apogee agenda. For those kind of promotions to be a success, it will take many leaders on the UNT campus going outside their usual pay scale roles as well as their usual Monday thru Friday job requirements and responsibilities plus............an army of UNT students, volunteers, UNT alums, Mean Green fans e from the UNT constituency. IN CLOSING: In other words, what we need at UNT is more manpower and a promotions plan with a viable infra-structure of corporate support.........there are no shortage of ideas at North Texas. Our main shortage is in man-power. We have enough ideas coming from this message board to fill an ocean but we seem to have not been successful in getting this message across no matter what athletic regime has been in place in past decades, but even if our leaders had wanted to try a few of em' they still would not have had the budget and/or manpower to get to 1'st base. Coach Mac on his radio show on Monday night was all but begging our fans to come out and see the Mean Green. He was preaching to a choir, but that choir are already the same ones who will already be at Apogee Stadium home games the rest of the season; yet Coach Mac said.............. "the Mean Green plus.........Brelan Chancellor--"he's a most special football player" that you need to come out and support............but between you and me..............what has been done since that Monday night radio show to insure that Brelan and his teammates will get more fans at Apogee for the MUTS game (which will draw well but might a "all out" Mean Green Mania promotions program have filled Apogee Stadium to the brim? I think our UNT athletic department does all that their limited promotions staff and lack of an army of manpower can do. This is still IMHO..........an entire UNT constituency problem--we cannot put all of this on UNT Athletics alone. If we want to blame anyone might we start by looking at our bathroom mirrors? All of our intentions from this message board are good, but there is just no infra-structure in place to see much different at Apogee's turnstiles than what we have seen in the past. As the article below says: "Winning is essential to make any promos work long term." And To the UNT student body: HELP! We can't do any of this w/o YOU! ____________________________________________ Is Mustang Mania Horsefeathers? Want a "pack em' in" football stadium promotions program for UNT? Well, roll up your sleeves like an entire army from SMU did as the link describes: http://www.dmagazine.com/Home/1978/10/01/SPORTS_Is_Mustang_Mania_Horsefeathers.aspx GMG!

In my heart of hearts, I feel your scenario will be the actual final scenario with all this (for at least awhile), TIgreen01, and that is because our G5 group will vote for just about anything the P5 guys want. Heck, even most of our G5 commissioners (except the SBC) are for the stipend and that would mean CUSA (and subsequently) North Texas along with most of the rest of the G5. I just see stipends as being one of those things that could very quickly get out of hand if not monitored and the NCAA is sometimes about as effective in doing that as.............. the U.S. goverment is in trying to run a lemonade stand (or worse, touting low cost health insurance that most liberal based polls say Americans do not want). I still see that if down the road the Big Boys got it down to a few conferences, then it would be schools like TCU, Baylor, Iowa State, the ACC, etc, who would need to start sweating than the G5 group. Some of us remember back to the year 1979 when the first volley of all this re-alignment began and with NCAA D1-AA resulting from that one. That is probably the main fear from some of us because we all know how all those years in 1-AA affected the pysche of our UNT alumnus base (of which we're still trying to recover to this day). GMG!

HINT: It's got to be their idea and I defer to the content of my post just right above your own post. GMG!

Agree and................ ..............that's it! We shut'er down for a year or 2 and then have our own start-up program with an NCAA FBS National Championship as our start-up goal! Funny part of that is how we'd be too naive to know better than to shoot for less; instead of our (sometimes) jaded'ness of past not so successful seasons which has created a few attitudes from us all at one time or another. GMG! PS: I'm beginning to (almost) see an advantage of all these shoot from the hip "riverboat gambler" attitudes from schools like UTSA and other past start-up programs we've seen have early success in past years. One thing the UTSA Road-Runners will find they are for certain losing is............ .......................the element of surprise. Any of you see Coach McCarney letting our team look past UTSA now? PS II: I am glad UTSA is a member of CUSA and I think both of our schools have a great chance of creating a great rivalry with lots of visiting fans from both schools when we tee it up. As a lover of Texas history, San Antonio is (obviously) one of my favorite places to visit (and a city I can drive to as well since I do not fly).

Got hungry for a bowl of Rice Chex when I saw Fresno State's checker board squares end zones during their game with Boise State. Are not some of these end zone paintings actually temporary that can be washed off with a power hose? Apogee is like a super model that someone from the trailer court gave a her a very bad toe nail polish job with our very drab end zone look. It's all about show business, folks, and that is what NCAA FBS football is all about--whether we like it or not. I understand that these things most times have to be planned a year in advance; much like serious numbers of "butts in seats" promotions. With 9 of our games on TV this Fall, wouldn't most of us have liked our "Lady" to look like she was dressed up even more for prime time? GMG! Addendum: This is Fresno State actually having the red and white panels put in place--so forget the paint job theory! LOL! Of course, I'd bet their national TV appearance with Boise last weekend inspired them to do this, but most likely did not plan doing it 1 or 2 weeks before that TV game. AGAIN: It's show business and that is what NCAA FBS football is all about--like it or not.

It is a universal message that if you want to do something big, stop being intimidated and get started. It doesn't take a heroic effort to start (although it sometimes takes heroic effort to keep going), and in the long run, unless you start doing something, you're never going to get it done. (copied) What our school, ie, the University of North Texas needs to do for the Apogee turnstiles involves our entire UNT constituency, but the UNT Adminstration, the UNT BOR's and UNT Athletics has to be the first ones to say: "we do see the problem here so........"come on everyone, let's get started in solving it." How much positive mileage has UTSA received based on their attendance alone in this their Year 3 of an NCAA existence? Has any of their national publicity been about wins? Well, uh, what wins? The whole time concerning UTSA has been all about their remarkable attendance and all you fellow conference re-alignment watchers just watch..........all happening in the shadow of the Alamo could one day get them a MWC invite (if they want one) for those who can look past today and their nostrils. GMG!

Everyone deserves a fresh, new beginning. After all, how many have of us had to have one of those (or more) in our own professional lives? Coach "B" the same. Would like to see the this chapter of the "Oxbow Incident" come to an end and the lynch mob disband one by one because Coach B can't completely have that fresh start until this happens. All UNT enthusiasts want this thing to work out at North Texas...so does Coach Benford. GMG!

If we can play ugly, poorly or whatever and still win on the road then this team will have even more saying "WE BELIEVE IN THE MEAN GREEN!" GMG!

My Cary Grant impersonation: "Rudy, Rudy, Rudy" (old take of a dad kind of joke from Goober on the old Andy Griffith Show). And Rudy, the old bag over the head trick could get dear ol' alma mater a lawsuit from the unknown comic? Just sayin' (and jokin'). Time for the meds and close to bedtime. GMG!

Let me help you guys out a bit here..