untjim1995

I totally agree with your assessment and the concept of how to fix the problem. However, it sounds like the problem can't/won't be fixed for whatever reasons. This all leads me to ask a few questions. What happens to UNT Football if we don't get a new stadium in the next 5 years? If the students vote down another fee for stadium/athletics/football, would FCS be in our future ever again? (I pray not.) My fears are that no stadium gets built, and that Dodge, if successful as the head coach, pulls a Fry and leaves because the university just doesn't improve the facilities. Actually, there are some profs that I have heard over the years that tell their students that we should drop football because of the cost and the fact that we are a "music and arts" school. I guess this is my worst fear for UNT. I am just interested to hear what folks think about the future if we don't get what we want. We often talk about the other side of when we get a new stadium, but what if...

Chris, No offense taken. I don't think that football has anything at all to do with my degree value from UNT in the Metroplex. My degree in finance was very appreciated by employers when I graduated and ever since--probably because of the proximity to the Dallas/Ft.Worth area and the knowledge of our business school's strength. Remember, we get many profs that have expereince in business in the Metroplex, which of course would carry alot of weight. That is what I was trying to convey--that my degree from UNT will always have more value here, with or without football becoming anything bigger than a lower-rung program (bottom 20). No offense to your TSU degrees, which, of course, they have strong programs in other areas, but, as far as my degree goes, I really believe that my UNT degree in finance will have more worth here in the Metroplex. It might be different in Austin or San Antonio, but I am fairly certain that I won't ever have to find that out. I will say that the amount of donations and LOYALTY that Texas State has created over the last few years and will continue to build is highly admirable. For that, I am extremely envious. If they do get to play in a confernece with people like UH, La Tech, UTEP, SMU, or even TCU, while we get Florida International and Louisiana-Monroe, I think we all could figure out the big winner in that scenario--and that is what burns most of us up about our school's habitual dragging-of-the-feet with a new stadium. Now, as far as building a football program, if Texas State or UTSA can make things happen to move forward their programs, ala UCF, USF, WKU,etc., and we can't, I think it says more about what we shouldn't keep doing than what it says about the forward movement of Texas State and UTSA. That's all I am saying.

Could you imagine how embarrassed we all would feel if UTSA or Texas State pass us by in terms of Division I-A football? I believe that my UNT degree will always carrry more weight than a degree from either of those places, even if they move forward and make all of their football dreams come true, but the level of donations and prestige for those schools would soar compared to where they are now--which could really raise the view of a degree from either of those places. Meanwhile, back in Denton....

All I know is that if they do start up a new program with a big-name coach and get into CUSA real fast (within 3-5 years of startup), we better not be in the Sunbelt still. Because if we are still here in the SBC and UTSA and Texas State move over there, we should just quit I-A football. It would be proven at that point that we just don't want to be serious about college football if in 5 years those two schools pass us by. We may have been paseed by many other programs across the country over the decades, but we have never had a state-program blow by us--yet. That would be the sign of the apocalypse, as far as D-I football goes.

I only saw two games in Irving listed, but I am sure that they were well-attended, since they involved two other Metroplex teams. I imagine the SMU game was big just because they were making their way back to the top with $$ and Texas Stadium was their home stadium at the time. I was just imaging what the folks would say now, in 2008, if we only had 4 "home" games, of which two were scheduled at Fouts. I do still think that scheduling a game at Texas Stadium/ JErry World/ Cotton Bowl to play a huge team would be great for UNT. I still think that a "home" game against a huge Big Ten team or Pac-10 team could be done. This would be a nice in-road for recruiting for those schools. I could see us playing a Michigan or Penn State or UCLA one day if we scheduled it correctly (2 for 1). Could you imagine the attention that a local game against a ranked team like Ohio State would bring. Heck, even Iowa or Purdue or a team like West Virginia or Louisville would be absolutely great teams for our program to get to play down here. Of course, all of this would probably not be necessary if a new stadium does get built in the future to accomodate the bigger crowds.

Could you imagine the uproar that having only 2 games (out of 11) in Denton would sound like today?

Thanks for your answers and your research. I truly didn't know who Howie had scheduled, but I figured that it would be a decent team to come there. Trust me, I agree with much of what you have posted regarding UNT's program.

Speaking of this, and I don't know the answer, but who has FAU scheduled at home with Schnellenberger as head coach?

Troy usually plays these teams very well--something to prove. It only falls apart when they have to play SBC teams that they don't get motivated for. Reminds me of the Corky days at UNT--play D-I teams very tough, lose to Southland teams that were less talented.

I wouldn't be at all suprised if one day the elite programs try to form their own super-conference...

I don't know if I agree with this. TCU has been good-to-great for a while now and their attendance has been around 30K for that whole time. But, when Tech or Baylor show up, the crowds are huge and Patterson even says that these games mean more to the fans and his team than the MWC games do because of Texas ties. As a matter of fact, TCU's average attendance last year was 30K, which was 77th out of 119 I-A teams. I know that the winning helps, but so does playing teams that people care to go see--like the Texas schools, for example. They know that the casual Ft. Worth fan that has taken up TCU as their home-team want to see OU, Tech, Baylor, etc. come to town. When they play a FCS team at home or a MWC doormat, their crowds are not close to 30K. All that being said, your Creighton friend is right about winning!!

The money may be there, but the facilities for each of those schools are similar to UNT. Tulsa's football stadium is awful, Moody Coliseum is terrible, and Autry Court is worse than every D-1 arena except Texas Hall in Arlington. To me, Fouts is god-awful, but the Super Pit is terrific, much like Ford Stadium is great. The thing about the Sun Belt is that there are schools that have made tremendous strides in the last 10 years--much like Tulsa, who I don't include in the mix with SMU or Rice. The other two have not made significant progress in anything as far as winning goes. If the Belt can continue winning in tournaments and bowls and CUSA keeps struggling, it wouldn't surprise me to see the public schools in CUSA leave these schools behind (SMU, Rice, Tulane) and get into a conference with other state schools that have much more in common. It is not easy for me to see SMU ever letting UNT in a conference with them. It is not hard for me, though, to imagine a day (in less than a decade) where a conference existed like this: UNT UAB Houston Troy So.Miss ULL Arkansas State Memphis UTEP La Tech New Mexico State Middle Tennessee These schools are large, public, and in need of good traveling crowds. You would get the Dallas, Houston, New Orleans, El Paso, Memphis, Birmingham, and Nashville markets, which are all growing with large alumni bases of each school. What gets me going the most is that the private schools in the state (Baylor, TCU, SMU, and Rice) think that they deserve to determine who they should be conference-mates with. It ought to be the other way around. SMU should never be able to dictate if North Texas gets in a conference, whether we are talking SWC or CUSA. It galls me to no end that our leadership over the years has let that happen. Those schools may have money but there support in terms of viewership is piss poor-and it ain't gonna get better. The SBC/CUSA public schools have the potential to do just that if they would sit down and find some common ground. It would make for a better sports world in football and hoops--that I can guarantee myself.

Poor posting--don't type after midnight anymore.

My thoughts are this on the subject: I would prefer to get in the MWC if at all possible for one reason--prestige. But, BYU and Utah are often mentioned as teams that could move up to the PAC-10 if the politics of the situation could get settled. If that happens, the MWC immediately gets Boise, Fresno, and Nevada to come over, and probably entertain getting Hawaii, since they used to be in the same conference for years with most of the MWC as it currently sits. That would leave 11 teams in the MWC, meaning that they would need one more to get that coveted championship game. The perfect fit would be a Texas school. Our dream would be that they got us to come over. Reality probably suggests that an Original WAC member, UTEP, would get the call. I just can't see TCU jumping up and down to get us in the league with them. Even if BYU and Utah never leave the MWC, it is not out of the question to see them get Boise, Nevada, and Fresno to move over to get to 12 for a championship game and petition to become a BCS conference, which could happen with another power conference forming and a bowl slot available in the new game that was created last year. This last scenario is why the WAC makes no sense to me for us now--cost is too high and the power teams in the WAC want to move up, too. Trust me, out west, this is discussed often. Unfortunately, I think that our days in the Belt and having teams like Ark. State, ULL, ULM, FAU, FIU, WKU, and Middle Tennessee as our peers will continue for a long time. What I would do if I worked for UNT right now, is propose that Texas State be admitted to the SBC in 2011 (?) and immediately begin talking to UH, UTEP, So. Miss., and UAB about the why it is more important and beneficial for them to be partnered with large public universities in the Belt vs. their current benefits of being partnered with the private schools that have limited potential, support, resources, etc. Schools like SMU and Rice and Tulane may have dollars, but not much else--not much of a base to travel to watch games in your stadiums/arenas. This is where you could get some realignment that could get us in a better fit with schools that fit our mold--large, public, and, in many cases, metropolitan. Any thoughts?

He is also very intelligent

Maybe I am alone in thinking this, and I really do think this is great for the athletic department, but I really can't see students VOTING for a large athletic fee increase to fund a stadium because the last fee increase helped get womens athletics on an even par. No offense intended at all, but I just think that the average student has proven that he/she will not vote for a stadium funding fee. The BOR needs to slap this fee on and do their job--hell, if they want us to be a great music and arts school first, then do the same thing and apply a mandatory fee to help expand their needs, too. Trust me, the demand for a UNT degree won't drop substantially. It is still the flagship public university of the Metroplex and will always be that for many years to come. (sorry UTA and UTD)

This is a great idea. 1. Definitely see a new stadium that is legitimate (in other words, no aluminum seating or facade) 2. Join a better conference with teams that people have heard of and what to come see play at home, as well as to travel to see. 3. See more students and alumni care about the athletic department and show it through attendance (avg. 30K+ for all games in football, 10K for hoops) 4. Develop a bitter rivalry (hello, SMU, TCU, UTEP, UH, etc.) 5. Finish in The Top 25 and go to bowls regularly 6. Beat a BCS big name in a game' 7. Host BCS teams from Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, and Louisiana at the new stadium 8. Keep Todd Dodge for 20+ years because he becomes the next Bobby Bowden that builds a program from the ashes to become big-time 9. See GameDay visit Denton for a big game 10. Go undefeated and play in a BCS bowl 11. Win BCS game 12. Finish in The Top 10 13. Finish in the Top 5 14. Win the National Championship 15. Enjoy stories about Hell Freezing Over many times 16. Die with a smile 17. Leave millions to athletic department 18. Have my name on a field or facility because of significant support (not because my millionaire buddy gets pissed and holds my alma mater hostage until they name the field/facility after me even though I was below .500 for my enitre career and crapped on said university by wearing Hutch black jerseys in my finale) Enjoy!!

What PSL envy are you talking about? If they can get folks to shell out the funds, more power to them. I realize that they have a much smaller enrollment, but they also have had the benefit of all of those SWC years to build what they have (and no drop down to I-AA purgatory like we had). Plus, as mentioned earlier, the city of Ft. Worth and its paper do a terrific job of marketing to the citizens about rooting for the "hometown" team, unlike Denton. And yet with all of their winning over the last 10 years, many programs across the country would sellout ALL of their games, regardless of the team on the schedule--not TCU. Why is that? You seem locked in pretty good down there, so I am interested to hear why. My personal opinion is that no matter how good they have been and will continue to be, there is only so much interest in watching teams from the western time zones that can't travel many fans to good ol' Amon Carter. Not PSL envy that I suffer from--really just mad that TCU, SMU, and UNT aren't in the same conference with other folks that would help fill up their great stadium, especially if it does get expanded in the end zones.

I don't think it would be a stretch to say that we at UNT would draw a helluva a lot more folks to come watch BYU/Utah/ New Mexico, Air Force, etc., than our SBC mates, so yeah, I can criticize them. They can't fill up Amon Carter unless a big name state school comes to town--like Tech. Otherwise, a typical MWC game gets between 25-33K depending on TCU's team and how the opponent is doing. Expanding the seating is not necessary. That be like us expanding Fouts with our current SBC schedule--not necessary. Now if they are expanding private box seating for big money at Amon carter, then that is a smart move ont heir part--and that is probably what they are doing.

Just curious, do we know that Dodge is worrying about journalists? If so, how do we know this?

I was a manager during his first 2 years at UNT. Simon was a different guy--trust me, coming from someone who had to work with him everyday, he was mentally unstable. One moment, he would be very genial, almost paternal. In the very next moment, he would turn on you, like someone with paranoia issues would. As a matter of fact, one day at practice, on a beautiful fall afternoon at Fouts, he made me go into the stands and ask a female student who was studying in her psychology text book and taking notes, to leave immediately. He was certain she was a spy. During the LSU game in 1995, he was on the sideline screaming at the ref, saying that the white official wanted him to call him, "Massah" since he was certain that the ref was racist and hated him. He got called for an unsportsmanlike-conduct penalty and just as the half ends, he turns around to me, who was carrying the cord to his headset, and just throws it right into my face, busting my lip open. Doesn't say a word about it until I go up to him on Monday afternoon at practice to say that this was just crazy. His response was, "I heard that happened--very unfortunate." Like I said, he was just unstable. Never was one to apologize. Ahh the stories that could be told from that time frame.... I feel no sympathy for the man getting fired--absolutely none.

I finished 15th--damn Boise State.

I picked KU in this one because I felt that they did have a great team, and although VT has a better reputation, KU got to hear how they didn't belong in this game for a month. The surprise was that KU's defense and special teams more than held their own against Va Tech. Maybe it is a fluke and OU, Texas, and Tech will kill them next year, but I don't know that for sure. I think KU has a chance to beat both Texas and Tech next year in Lawrence, but the OU game in Norman is still too high for them, I think. I do know this, if they had gotten texas or tech this year, I feel that they would have beaten them both. As far as building a program and getting the most from his players, Mangino has been doing that for a long time now up there. Its just that this year was finally a break-through for them. This whole scenario is my dream for us here at UNT with Dodge--and I believe it will happen here too!!

I agree with your assessment--it is getting awfully expensive to run a Division-I football program, though. When the other metroplex teams will pay millions for a coach and even more millions for superb stadium/facilities, I just hope that we don't say that this game is too expensive for our university. Unfortunately, with the last 30 years being our history, if certain mindsets get put back into place, I could see that being discussed in Denton.

I cannot agree more. If KU had done anything right in the first half of that game or if there was about 2 more minutes to go in that game when KU got the ball back, I think they would have won that game. Reesing is a gamer, and although the schedule was not great, they won at K-State, A&M, and OSU. By the way Texas lost to two of those three, and Tech lost to one of those two, so just because KU didn't play Texas or Tech, doesn't mean they got all the breaks on their schedule. Kansas has to play those two teams next year in Lawrence, but they could have beaten either of them this year--road or away.