CheckFacts

UNT paid $4.56 million for a facility that is 22 years old and in decent enough shape to have recently had new Radison signs installed on it (though Radison has been declining in prestige) the company that sold it wanted out because it was not as profitable as they would like if at all.....and they are a company that is in the business of running hotels for a profit the real estate credit market is extremely tight right now UNT has stated they believe a full service hotel conference center at or near that location is important.....even though business was slow enough the prior owners wanted out of a lease that was just extended from 2043 to 2053 about 3 years ago what exactly will UNT do different and where exactly will UNT get the financing to demo a functional hotel with a decent name and build something new that will attract enough business to turn a profit.....when the current facility is not turning much if any of a profit and UNT has no experience in the hotel business

I had a degree prior to my time at UNT I could finish my degree at UNT with transfer credits with the possible exception of one course....but I can possibly work that out if I desire.....I work in Ag. Research now please stay safe in your duties

actually this is your thread http://www.gomeangreen.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=40855 this other thread (this one) is the thread that Fire Extinguishing Richard moved over to the football board for reasons he has yet to disclose

there was a great deal more faculty loss than just those 3 and the reasons behind why those three and all the others left is still the same regardless of my experiences at UNT and even if I did not have ANY experience at UNT I am a citizen and a tax payer of Texas which is why all higher education in Texas is important to me.....I pay for a small part of it and I stand to benefit (or not benefit) from it....so that makes it my business while you may consider that I am bitter I actually could be bitter about other experiences at other schools....but I am not.....because those schools did not show the repeated mistakes that UNT does why would I not consider "fighting" anyone on this message board....because you can call names, make personal attacks, and talk of spelling and grammar so eloquently.....real tough crowd here at GMG why would I "go on my way" when I see UNT stuck in the same poor pattern they were stuck in when I was a student there while other schools plan and perform better.....again my taxes go to Texas and Texas pays for a part of UNT and so did my tuition....so I have paid for and earned the right to voice my opinion on UNT and any other state school in Texas but I guess all on this message board are content with not knowing any information about a new stadium, UNTs plans for the raddison, why UNT law (if they get it) will go to south dallas, why UNT continues to hire faculty and then lose them to other schools and why UNT has better laid plans for south dallas and downtown dallas and fund raisers in place for them while the "flagship" campus just has a lot of ???????????????????????????????????????????????????? again when is ground going to be broken on the COBA, how much of the needed funds have been raised, what is the schedule for the stadium, how much money has been raised, why can't UNT issue bonds for in now and build it, how much will the athletics fee be, when will it go to a vote, when is baseball scheduled to come to UNT........the list is endless of the questions ask on this forum yet the only real answers I see are "just wait it will be great" or "we are almost there" or "very soon" and the only person I see anyone hold to any accountability is RV.....when I feel I have presented a decent argument that UNT has issues much higher up than RV and UNT has wasted a lot of time money and resources on projects that have greatly underperformed if people on this forum enjoy 20 threads about where is the stadium that is great.....I offered an opinion on where it is at...it is lost somewhere between downtown and south dallas while jackson (not the bad ass with the gun the fool that can't raise funds on a give away game show) spends his time planning with royce the pig west how the stadium can fit into south dallas so that UNT Dallas can one day play UNT Denton in football like they talked about in a presser just because I offer a different opinion of who to hold accountable and offer facts and information to back it up does not mean I am bitter.....it means I feel there are issues to be addressed well beyond RV the arguments offered up contrary to mine are basically strawmen and personal insults and questions so I will continue to hold the opinion that I do and I will continue to voice it on this forum as I see fit or until someone (anyone) can offer anything to convince me otherwise and back it up with real information instead of "I heard" and "I was told" the fact this annoys some of you is an issue for you to deal with not me

wow people brag about the "communications skills of UNT grads" but you can't even beat back a message board "troll" and many of those professors left long after I did....so I had nothing to do with it.....but a poor administration that does not keep promises they make to faculty in the engineering and hard sciences and spends their time on failed system centers and down town redevelopment does have a great deal to do with it and I would hardly call losing faculty and them making critical comments about a schools commitments to the hard sciences a compliment to UNT as for the business building.....can you provide a link with any progress on the fund raising or when it will actually have ground broken....or is asking for that "trolling" because just like everything at UNT I am suppose to wait until it comes no matter what the original plans were

again there are more than CS stories....Ut is one of the top CS departments in the world....UNT is not no department counts students enrolled in their classes they count students that are MAJORS in that department......you need a huge clue Dr Tate is a fine professor.....I did not have nearly a year to wait to take any class....especially when UNT was asking me to take more garbage courses as for the sob stories....I guess all those students in the CVET program were cry babies when that program was CUT because of lack of faculty when Dr. Shelton and 2 other professors left and the program could not continue I guess Dr. Bruce Gnade, Dr. Kim and Dr. Wallace were cry babies when they shopped themselves as a group to UTA and UTD and eventually left as a group to go to UTD http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archiv...amp;p_topdoc=11 pay to read story #13 if you can't figure it out from the headline.......that is 3 of 10 faculty leaving at one time and seeing that Dr. Gnade has risen rapidly at UTD I would say UNt suffered a large loss when he left as well as the others I guess Dr. Michaelides is a cry baby too when UNT released this BIG ANNOUNCEMENT about the FIRST EVER ENERGY ENGINEERING PROGRAM http://web3.unt.edu/news/story.cfm?story=9610 only to see him leave 9 months later to UTSA http://engineering.utsa.edu/~mechanical/faculty.html UNT has had to place the former chair of chemistry in his old position until they they placed the chair of ETECH in the dual roll of chair of ETECH and "mechanical and energy engineering" I have never seen a person be a chair of two departments at the same time...even on an interim basis http://www.mee.unt.edu/people/index.htm http://www.etec.unt.edu/ UNT has still not replaced Dr. Michaelides and is a long ways from it just like they got money from PACCAR 18 months ago and still have not found a way to spend it http://web3.unt.edu/news/story.cfm?story=10142 http://www.eng.unt.edu/paccar-adtdfredline-ONG.htm but hey don't you worry UNT has you covered on a BAAS degree

how does my attitude play any part in a professor missing 2/3rds of a M-W-F class to the point where Matt Duncan (a CS admin at UNT) told out class that Dr. Kavi would allow any and all of us that desired to take the class again for free the next semester how does my poor attitude play any part in the secretary for the Cs department walking into a class of 40+ students on the first day of class and informing us they did not have a professor yet to teach the class, but they were working on it how does my poor attitude play a part in that "professor" being Zhi Lee a Phd candidate that had 4 lectures worth of another professors power point notes before she was left on her own to teach a class she was no prepared to teach.....to the point where other students that were older than I was at the time and better CS students would mess with her in class because they were bored how does my poor attitude play a part in having a class taught by Mr Coyle who was a nice man, but was not even as able to teach the class as 3/4s of the students in that class were how does my attitude play a part in the fact that at the time the COVAD had nicer general use computer labs available to art students only than the CS department had for CS students....CS students had to use GAB 330 or GAB 550 where you could be bumped from your computer after 2 hours even for someone who only wanted to browse the web....much less the monitors in gab 330 would ask you to not sit together and try and work together because you might disturb other students......even though you had a group CS assignment to work on how does my poor attitude play a part in a number of faculty leaving including groups leaving together to go to UT-D and programs at UNt folding because of loss of professors.....all while the south dallas campus is pushing forward how does my poor attitude play a part in Dr. Nagi Aboulinine (sp) standing before my class of CS students at the end of the first summer session and appologizing for having to cram the first semester CS class into one summer semester when it should be an entire summer class and he has recommended that UNT no longer offer those first two CS classes in single summer sessions (unt did change that) and that he was leaving academia because of the poor experiences he had at UNT I bring up Dr. Jacobs because he is the one that stood before my class and explained why UNT was on ABET accreditation probation and there response was not to try and hire new faculty as soon as possible, but instead to ask for a 5 year probation instead of a 3 year probation so they could wait 4 years to hire new professors instead of 2 years the CS department was looking for a new chair before Dr. Kavi came along....on their own site they had 800 under grads and 150 grad students....and 24 faculty members....which is why they were on ABET probation they also only offered the final CS course that was needed for a degree once in each long semester because Dr Tate and 1 other professor were the only ones that would teach it.....so for 800 undergrads they only offered a core course 2 times a year and limited it to 45 students.......800/5 years (for a 5 year plan for students) = 160 students a year that could be looking to take that final course to graduate....when they only had 90 spots a year available....and were on ABET probation for lack of faculty...and UNt will not bump lower level students for graduating seniors......they were going to offer the course in the summer, but it was taught by Dr. Shahrokhi.....most every CS student considered him an ass so they would not take his class....I think I was the only one that signed up for it and it was canceled......during early registration for the fall when my time opened up.....the course was again already full.....so that is when I decided to leave UNT the state does not have to approve borrowing and when a system borrows it goes against the entire system and limits what they can borrow in the future no matter where the money is spent....and you glossed over the fact that there are not near enough students in south dallas to pay those bonds off.....which means someone else is going to pay part of them do the math on a 20 year bond that is over 1 million a year to be paid off in principle alone.....with under 1000 students there is no way south dallas students can pay off even the principle I know how THECB feels about the project because I read the published articles and posted the links to where THECB is going to take steps to limit any new campuses or system centers in the future and they are going to go back to 3,500 students as the starting point for a free standing campus....all based on lack of performance by UNT and south dallas I also read the articles where the THECB is going to limit ANY new funding to south dallas until enrollment limits are met....which means the UNT system with its limited resources and extremely small endowment will need to fund some of it themselves it is all pretty clear as for the COBA at the Raddison....it was discussed in the past and UNT has not raised the private money yet for a new COBA building....I am not saying the COBA will go to the raddison for sure....but UNT owns it now.....they discussed it in the past.....and it is the "cheap, low cost, easy" option.......which means it is what UNT will most likely do....because that is what UNT has a history of doing and why no pharmacy or law school....because those programs are extremely expensive to start up and UNT has shown they are in over their heads in south dallas and downtown dallas....I see no reason to let them sink further

http://www.thecb.state.tx.us/ClosingtheGap..._pdf.cfm?Goal=1 THECB projections for enrollment.....UNT is at 41,000 in 2020......it was mentioned previously that UNT had a "mandate" for 45,000 by another forum member UNT is certainly not using state funds to do things in south dallas and downtown dallas.....they are using a great deal of borrowing against the wishes of the THECB.....read the article below http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...T.3bd13c04.html """""Staff members at the Coordinating Board recommend rejecting UNT's request to buy the loft building, which has 129 units and is nearly full. Enrollment is down at the Universities Center, and most students are part-timers, so housing isn't really needed, according to a staff report. Also, UNT would rent to nonstudents, and that “does not fit within the educational mission” of UNT, the report said. If the board denies the lofts purchase, UNT officials said, they would still try to expand downtown offerings but would have to look for other ways to finance them. This could include passing more costs on to students or taxpayers. """""" now read the presentation by the idiot jackson to the THECB http://untsystem.unt.edu/pdfs/chancellor-p...CB_09-20-07.pdf """"Progress slow in turning 1900 Elm Street into a student residence"""" also look at where the fashion collection is going.....the center of a 14 million dollar campaign to move something OUT OF DENTON now read the old articles on this forum http://forum.dallasmetropolis.com/showthread.php?t=334 """""Since 1999, the state has given UNT $16.69 million for the center's programs and allowed it to borrow $25 million for construction."""""" while I agree the 16 million might not have ever made it to Denton..........the 25 million that was BORROWED is certainly not being paid off by the 800 students in south dallas read the article....UNT is making NO FRIENDS at THECB right now and in a time when higher education dollars are hard to come by the fact UNT was able to fleece the tax payers fo Texas for 16.9 million is nothing to brag about......it is selfish and stinks of pigs feeding at the public trough......look at the degrees offered in south dallas........they better fit at a community college with a SEVERE shortage of classroom space......one would think efforts would go into EXISTING universities......not building new failed campuses I am not in favor of UNT starting any professional schools until they prove they can clean up their mess in south dallas and downtown dallas....and there is no shortage of lawyers....and if those programs are attached to south dallas I am not in favor of them at all if there is a long line to renovate buildings on campus....why is UNT buying more buildings and properties they have no idea what they will do with yet.....and why are they trying to start two other residential campuses.....when neither have met projections and one serves as a "ms manners" school for DISD kids I had a number of other poor experiences with faculty at UNT...but those are personal stories that would be hard to verify.....but anyone can go to Dr. Jacobs office at any time and ask him when he was the acting chair of CS and the CS program was placed on ABET probation for lack of faculty was UNTs response to ask for a 5 year probation instead of a 3 year probation so they could wait 4 years to hire more faculty anyone can also go into AB Grubbs office and ask him why the civil engineering technology program folded at UNT (faculty leaving) and they can also ask him why the construction engineering technology program does not have ABET accreditation http://www.etec.unt.edu/construction.html """"The Department of Engineering Technology will seek accreditation at the appropriate time of the CNET program by the Technology Accreditation Commission of the Accreditation Board of Engineering and Technology (TAC of ABET).""""" I am no longer at UNT....I left at least 5 years back when I had to wait 9+ months to try and get the final CS class I needed towards my degree and after talking with the CS adviser at the time he told me I did not need that class or the piece of paper because I had all the class work I needed and I already had a degree (in an entirely different subject) I called royce west to talk about the south dallas campus because in addition to it being his pet project.....he is also the head of the Texas senate committee on higher education....and additionally I contacted the THECB lets be clear again.....being a LARGE university in no way is any sign of quality....UNT has fine programs in some areas....unfortunately they often choose to under fund those programs specifically I have been to multiple schools because I have moved often and took advantage of what was in the area I was in......I have had poor experiences at other schools and I have also performed poorly at other schools......but UNt was the only one that I felt was poorly managed from the top down.....and they are the only one I still see doing so many stupid, wasteful, and poorly planned things in 2004 UNTs own estimates put the purchase price for the raddison at 7 million.....for some reason that same year or the year before UNT changed the lease on the raddison to go from 2043 to 2053 as for the new business building UNTs own information states is is dependent on raising private funds to complete it.....can anyone show me where those fund raising goals are and how much has been raised ask your contacts if UNT did not discuss a future location of the COBA at the raddison in 2004 depending on what happened with the lease/purchase of the hotel there will be no way for me to convey my opinions in a popular manner so I see no reason to try.....the information is there for all to see from credible sources and the "stories" I have can be easily verified by faculty that are still on campus and would be glad to discuss this with you I suppose I could put it in the form of a poem or a Haiku, but that would just give ammo to those that would want to challenge my ability to rhyme or my ability to put things in 3 lines and my neglect to mention a season (football season)

first the Hilton program at UH is great because of the funding from the Hilton foundation.....not only because they have a hotel to operate second UNT is talking about tearing down the Raddison (actually they have no idea what they will do with it yet) third in 2004-2005 UNT projected it would cost 7 million to buy out the raddison.....now they are talking about tearing it down....yet you claim it would bankrupt UNT to tear down some of that crap in cement city.......your argument fails fourth the THECB has PROJECTIONS for UNT to be at 41,000 students in 2020 not a mandate of 45,000 students fifth there is talk of moving the hotel program to eagle point and now the COBA as well (look for the raddison to be the new COBA building)......the TI campus already has students.....more students should go there.......if students are unhappy about a bus to TI why would they be any less unhappy about being bussed to Eagle Point......it is not like it is actually close to campus and once I-35 construction starts it will be worse......and the fact that students don't like going to TI shows the poor planning of UNT.....they really don't need that property either....especially for undergrad classes.....and they do not have the research and graduate students to support a "research campus"....but the mistake has already been made.....might as well go with it instead of yet another mistake of putting academics at Eagle Point as well Environmental Sciences was built a long time ago at this point and the COBA has yet to be funded or built and may soon turn out to be the Raddison all of those buildings are nice, but with the exception of the Rec Center all those buildings are state funded under formula funding....while there is nothing wrong with building under formula funding.....there are a number of things happening OFF CAMPUS and IN DALLAS that should be located IN DENTON or associated with the Denton campus.....as of now the Law School (God Forbid UNT is allowed to start one) will be attached to the south dallas campus as will a pharmacy program (God Forbid UNT gets one of those and it will be a long ways away if ever) the fashion collection built by the faculty in Denton with no permanent place to show it in Denton is now the center piece of a 14 million dollar campaign to build out a facility to house it in downtown dallas as an economic development tool........that 14 million should be spent in Denton where the collection was assembled in 2004 UNT planned for 3 million in Art Building renovations to start in 2007-2009....I have seen no progress on this UNT has also talked about an Art Annex and larger area for working on projects....I have seen no progress on this again if you are OK with professional programs being attached to the south dallas campus that is your opinion.....if you are OK with 14 million being raised to finish out a museum in downtown dallas to house a collection build by faculty in DENTON that is your opinion I feel a "flagship campus" should be the one with professional programs attached to it and I feel a campus that has a large college of art yet has ZERO museums on campus should be the one that has 14 million spent to house a fashion collection that was BUILT IN DENTON.....instead of seeing it and the fashion program eventually moved to downtown dallas to aid their economic recovery efforts all of those buildings that are built or planned are nice, but to be a top university you need to do more than sit around and wait for state appropriations and formula funding to build everything for you.....otherwise you will see yourself being left behind by others....especially when the administration is busy building up other campuses in Dallas as for being "right" about things when you are at a university and in a program that is at risk of losing its accreditation (and the administrations answer is to ask for a longer probation) and then they start to build an unneeded campus to aid in the economic development of south dallas you get pissed off when you contact people to discuss that and are met with juvenile arguments and race baiting you get pissed off when you see that same university start down the same path in downtown dallas you just roll your eyes when it takes a seven line EMAIL to have your grade significantly changed......you question the quality of the faculty.....especially when her class was a repeat of the previous two classes and was an unorganized disaster why would I not think I am 100% correct in my comments on UNT.....none of you have shown anything to prove me wrong and you have often answered with things that confirm I am correct......like troll calling and other things designed to call me into question VS pointing out something to prove I am incorrect fact professional programs are going AWAY from Denton....it is right there in writing for all to see plain as day fact UNT has failed to meet projections and reduced projections in south dallas and is now having to borrow money and bond things out to keep it going.....this has an effect on Denton because a SYSTEM can only bound out so much before a ratings drop fact UNT is going down the same path in downtown dallas now...and moving programs and collections out of Denton and it will continue

not a chance in hell have you seen the way people drive on the I-35 bridge

if you are OK with UNT wasting millions of dollars to provide degrees that are not in demand to an extremely limited number of students that is your opinion if you are OK with most if not all of the professional programs mentioned for UNT being tied to dallas that is your opinion if you are OK with a university ignoring the needs of its "flagship" campus and instead putting all of its efforts into dallas.....that is your opinion I voiced my opinions on the issue when it was first started and was met with childish arguments and race baiting in favor of the dallas campus now that it has failed and UNT has still not addressed a number of issues on its "flagship" campus I will voice my opinion that UNT has tied themselves to a pig that feeds at the public trough to the detriment of ALL students of higher education in Texas if you feel you can provide information against my opinions and the FACTS that are now evident to all (except you and a few others) then please provide your information to back up your opinions I don't think you can provide anything to show that UNT is not wasting valuable time and resources in south and central dallas.....except personal shots I would welcome someone showing something to prove me wrong......but no one has as of yet

another member of this forum made the claim in this thread that Eagle Point was needed for UNTs "mandate" by THECB to be 45,000 students first there is no "mandate" by THECB for enrollment and second all academic programs can easily be fit east of I-35 or at TI so someone else made the claim I did not. I pointed out why Eagle Point was not needed at all for academics or athletics second UNT has discussed putting the Hotel Restaurant program at Eagle Point and another program that I will not name at this time because I am waiting for the possibility that UNT actually makes the stupid decision to place that particular program at Eagle Point.......which is what they are possibly "studying the hotel" for and I was 100% correct about the south dallas campus and UNT and royce west were 100% wrong....I have been proven correct on that issue time and again and they have been proven wrong time and again....so I will point that out UNT is also now wasting valuable time and resources and money on the downtown UCD as well.....and they have already over promissed and under delivered to THECB and THECB is getting tired of it

I never stated anything about renovating Fouts that has been discussed about why it is not possible. Second I did not say put any or all of the athletics at the TI campus.......but in reality who cares if track and soccer was located there......multiple schools with as much or more success in athletics as UNT has had have their MAJOR sports facilities well off of campus......the cheap paint pic I posted shows plenty of room for football, baseball, softball, and tennis all just slapped in there with little thought. and there is still plenty of room for a soccer field with a track around it.....so anyone with a small amount of creativity could have placed ALL the facilities on the existing space east of I-35 if there was not room for track and soccer UNT also has the library annex property that would be as close or closer than where the current plan calls for soccer and track to be located.......so distance to it is a non-issue the claim was made that eagle point was needed for "mandated" growth to 45,000.....first there is no "mandate" for anything from THECB and second THECB growth projections have UNT at 41,000 many years down the road.....UNT has already placed academic programs at TI so why should they spread them to eagle point as well......pick a place for academics and stick with it....it is not difficult I was around when the south dallas failure was brought up. I specifically contacted royce west to discuss it with him.......his arguments for the campus were juvenile at best and smelled strongly of a fat pig feeding at a trough.....and he tried to race bait me which was when the call ended.....his arguements for the campus were that "dallas and dallas county did not have a public university and I would be shocked to know that"....I explained I was not shocked at all because dallas proper is a small part of the metromess and UTD is just up the road to the north and UT is just to the west.....he had no answer for that his next argument was that 300,000 more people would soon flood into south dallas....I explained the Texas boom and bust economy and that those projections would not hold true (they have not) and if that many people were scheduled to move there with no university then higher education was probably not why they were choosing to locate there...and if higher education was what they desired they should move to one of multiple areas around dallas with a university......he had no answer for that his last argument was that dallas students were under represented in colleges.....I said if someone can't cross over to Arlington or Richardson for an education I question their motivation and there should be schlorships in place and a bus....and that paul quinn was about to go under.....he had race baiting to answer that with I also contacted THECB and was basically told it was now out of their hands and it was going to go through......so I put out the effort.....fat greedy pigs and rubber stampers got in the way.....the total lack of success and the fact that the south dallas campus offers none of the big time degrees they mentioned when it started tells me I was 100% correct in my opinions at the time I knew it was a mistake when jackson was hired (not the one with the badge and a gun the one that can't raise a dime for anything outside of dallas county) Jackson was brought in to be a big time fund raiser....he has been a big time flop unless you consider a south dallas and a down town campus that are both not meeting THECB projections or UNTS own projections as a success. and if you consider moving programs out of Denton and tying potential professional schools to the dallas campus VS Denton a success.......all while raising little if any money for any of them and making THECB reconsider a lot of things in the future while UNT in Denton plods along.....the powers at be in Denton and now dallas continue to put all their time and effort into the south dallas campus and into the UCD.....always against the current wishes of THECB.....and all the while programs and professional schools leave Denton or are planned for dallas.......but I guess you are OK with that as long as you get a stadium somewhere in 8-10 years

I will take your story at face value but I find it difficult to believe that collection of crap would be cost prohibitive to tear down in the long run.....Lubbock just got through with a privately funded project that purchased up many times the number of properties that exist in cement city and either moved them out or tore them down and replaced them with new student apartments, retail and some residential....it was the largest privately funded redevelopment in the US at the time according to the hypsters......so UNT could have waded into the mess of cement city and purchased properties second UNT has torn down a number of properties on the east edge of campus for nothing but parking or for audiology labs or accounting continuing education.....these properties on a per unit basis were surely worth more than the crap in cement city.....and lastly UNT currently has 200 acres north on Bonnie Brae that they have no idea what the vast majority of it will be used for.......so they already have all the land and space they need without the Eagle Point property

like a development similar to rayzor ranch or for a housing development......and there is no chance if PROPER PLANNING was done that UNT would even need that space west of 35 there is plenty, probably excess, land already on the main campus to perform all needed functions to meet any planned growth at UNT and with UNT currently putting all their resources into trying to develop two other residential campuses in Dallas I do not see the growth at UNT that some expect UNT also has 200 acres with academic programs currently offered north on Bonnie Brae.......any athletic facilities for smaller sports that would not fit on the main campus could be located there as could any academic facilities I question if UNT even needed the Bonnie Brae property and feel they could have worked a much more aggressive deal to acquire it if they felt the need to purchase it