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I want to make one thing perfectly clear here before I try and go to sleep to forget about this game, because I know I'll wake up tomorrow morning and read something about it. I think lost in the Benford and RV hate is something that I don't think anyone is absolving the players. Tony Mitchell needs to stop being a pouty bitch. Chris Jones needs to stop trying to be so damn cool on the ball and just make the simple play. Jordan Williams needs to focus all of his athleticism and energy to the defensive side of the ball and never shoot from further than 3 feet out. Alzee and Roger...I like your work ethic. Work on you FTs and I got no beef. But... Players need an offense. Players need a system. And there simply is not one in place. That zone-offense was without question the worst I have ever seen in my life. And I've watched a lot of (COLLEGE) basketball. I often watch more off the ball action than I do where the ball is, and the standing and confusion was mind-boggling. That confusion led to frustration...which led to quit. Some may want to blame that quit on the players, but when you realize that the person paid to lead and put players in position to succeed has no earthly idea how to do so, it's very hard to keep faith. Tonight was worse than last year. Last year was a bunch of shell-shocked freshmen who got down early and got snow-balled. This year was incompetence.

Honestly, I'm a very big supporter of RV, but the way that this basketball season has become is just...unacceptable. Somebody needs to be held accountable. I think it unacceptable to spend $80 million dollars on a stadium, spend a bunch of money on so-called Super Pit renovations, a practice facility, but yet let Tony Benford coach a basketball team and not make McCarney's seat warm (that's for another thread). Tony Benford has NO control of the team. Did anyone see the WAY Tony Mitchell was acting? It was disgusting. He was acting like a spoiled child. There were scouts there and Tony will be lucky to maintain his draft position with this abhorrent play. However, Tony was begging and pleading for the ball, Benford can't plan anything to get the ball to him. It was disgusting. He can't gameplan how to break a zone defense. He lets Chris Jones airball everything. There's NO accountability. With Johnny Jones, this team would be a 2-loss team. This team will implode this year and this will be the biggest failure in NT history. But with the amount of money and hooplah around UNT athletics, this is just REALLY unacceptable. So, at some point, despite Apogee, you HAVE to look at the AD and demand answers. This has been unacceptable.

People have accused me of being too patient in the past. I do try to find the silver linings when things are going badly. I also tend to think coaches should have some time before calling for their heads. Hell, I am usually one of the last ones to give up on a coach (I even had hope for Dodge going into that final year!). But here's the deal. The reason that you are supposed to be patient with most new coaches is because the previous guy was fired and the new guy is probably inheriting a troubled situation. Benford was coming into a situation many, if not most, first time coaches would kill for. And is failing in a ridiculously massive way.

Please let it be because he's penning his letter of resignation

I'm convinced that North Texas athletics will suck forever. I've lost all hope.

I've done some analyzing of this past football season and thought I'd post the results here. Anything to let my tired head rest from all of the realignment changes. I've looked at all three segments...offense, defense and special teams. There are a few aspects where we did well but overall it's not brimming with good news: Offense Stats where we've done well. outstanding: Two statistics were outstanding. The offensive line allowed only five sacks which was #1 in the FBS. We had an average possession time of 32:56.83 which ranked us #7. Stats that were above average: We fell to 38th nationally in fumbles lost but the mark of just under .5 was very good. We were #50 in rushing average with 4.35 yards per carry. Number 52 nationally on long passing plays (over 10 yards). I don't have a breakdown on how many were yards after catch but regardless the mark of 112 long receptions is an exemplary statistic. Another statistic that ranked us 60th was 159 plays from scrimmage of more than 10 yards. We did have some playmakers. Stats that were average to below average: North Texas was the 63rd most successful at converting fourth down plays. We ranked 68th on long rushing plays with 57. Our yards per play of 5.52 ranked the Mean Green 72nd nationally and the 7.0 per passing play was 76th. We averaged 19.9 first downs per game; 79th among FBS teams. And while we were outstanding on sacks allowed we didn't do so well on tackles for loss allowed. We average 5.92 per game. Stats that were gosh-awful Three statistics that stunk up the joint were scoring offense (20.9 per game); third down conversions (32.78%); and red zone conversions (71.4%). Overall, it was an average offense or better at gaining yards but terrible at scoring, especially when in the red zone.

Kind of amusing that when people jump on a misspelling while missing the difference between your and you're.

I hear Tony accidentally stood under the basket in the REC for an hour and watched 3 dudes pass the ball around the arc then assumed practice was over. Benford'd

Seeing two 2 on 1 fastbreaks end in a charge and a missed layup without a pass was the most frustrating thing of the night for me. Basic basketball. Give it up, get it back. BASIC, BASIC, BASIC, and yet Jordan Willaims (who has a terribly low basketball IQ) ran over his defender while Alzee decided to take it in on his own and miss a heavily contested layup instead of making a 5 foot pass that would have resulted in a lay up. Maddening.

While you're accusing people of over-reacting shoot off an email to ESPN, all the college basketball prognosticators and anyone who had a vote in the Sun Belt pre-season poll. They all agreed that we were a mid-major power. ONLY poor coaching could lead to this abomination.

I thought these were the records of RV's latest hires..

maybe the preseason NIT rules disallow post game interviews all season long?

The heros here always throw out that rv is doing a great job. In talking to two coaches (ie.that would answer the question about what they think of rv) They said that "he's too comfortable in his job".They were not smiling either. Look at the stands in the major sports (bb & fb), look at the lack of coverage this weekend for our girls bb tournment in NM, look at the way major donors left the program (one did not even give the 1 mil that you guys said came into the program), lack of promo's for games, etc. O, ever been on the ath. adm. side of the house, there are 2 people in every room now & falling over each other with little or no results.That's were your & my money is going rather than promotions or advertising. Did you ever think of "What does his dept. do from March to July anyway?" Why do most people here just see roses without the thorns. Absolute no accountability in the ad office { ie. think about all the quotes about rv worry's about the crowd for our Tuesday ESPN game at 8PM- if he was on top of things why would he worry}. By the way, we are such a power in the SBC that we turned down the big 12 to get a slot in cusa. Thanks rv. ( I don't want those responsibile (K) for this post getting their pants in a knot!). By the way Harry, your Christmas card form the ad's office came to me- so, Merry Christmas bro!

I would like to dedicate this song to the preseason expectations

Amen, meangreener. Preach on. I'm contemplating taking a poster to the game Saturday night for our front row seats next to the bench that says: Buy Out Tony Benford and I'm going to put a collection tin underneath it. This is effing ridiculous. The team looks lost. Benford was handed a Sun Belt Conference championship caliber team and he's done squat with them. We're running players in and out within seconds ... no one knows how to drive the ball to the hole ... they all look scared to do anything (aside from Franklin, he's a beast). It's pathetic. Rick needs to be accountable for this fiasco. I wholeheartedly agree. I just pray to God that this isn't Shanice Stephens all over again. Did he bring a binder to his interview, too, or what? And, while I'm ranting ... this reminds me of Barry Switzer's Cowboys takeover. Only Barry's stupidity wasn't enough to squash another SuperBowl win with the talent he had ... until his second season of coaching. *sigh*

You know where we sit. That loss is on the coach, not the players. Tony Mitchell can't do much when he is the only offensive threat player within 10 feet of the basket and he has 3-4 defenders on him. Just swinging the ball around the arc won't get it done. A head coach should be able to notice things like this and change the plays or the personnel (maybe add another big, like Coleman, to pull off some of the pressure on the other post).

RV has done all he can do here. He finished the stadium, got the ball rolling on baseball, but his coaching hires have mostly been atrocious. It is time for him and his entourage of yes men to be shown the door.

I'm going to get shitfaced.

How is it OVERHYPED? This isn't OVERHYPED. This is POORLY COACHED. The team has superstars across the board who are not given a gameplan to their strengths. They don't get Tony the ball. Tony is pissed because Benford is ruining his career. This was our ONE chance to get NATIONAL recognition.

I swear to God I'll pistol whip the next one of you who compares the college game to the NBA.

This team looks like it has already quit on him, no one is playing inspired basketball. THIS IS PATHETIC

Your a big jerk...

From the field and from 3 point land. Against a bottom third Belt team (if they were in the Belt this year). At home. On local TV. I won't even talk about free throw shooting This team has a basketball IQ of about 1. I didn't think I could ever see an offensive system worse than the one JJ put on the floor. I was wrong. The better coached team with FAR less talent won tonight, Mr. Vito. Yes, Coaching counts. The team I saw play tonight doesn't finish the season above .500. So disappointing.

All of the conference realigment this week has been disappointing as a college football fan. A 14 team Big Ten does little for anyone. Yeah, they make more money with the NY/NJ market access, but the 14 team arrangement just means less games between very traditional rivals. The new Big East looks a like like the old CUSA. I just don't see where the money is, when they keep talking about this big tv deal. Are the networks really lining up for SDSU vs ECU? ACC with Louisville is alright, but Louisville without Cincy & Memphis just seems odd. The new CUSA is really disappointing. As a UNT fan I thought the western division was going to be perfect for us. Compact regional division with winnable games. The new division was really going to cut down on travel cost for other sports, and maybe for once his program could get ahead economically and do things like schedule less body bag/pay day games. I also hates the CUSA divisions. The East looks awful. Two start up programs in ODU, UNC-C, two very new programs in FAU, FIU, a traditional bottom feeder in UAB and either MTSU or SMiss. And as a UNT fan I hate the idea of playing Tulsa & SMiss every year. Yeah, SMissis in the toilet this year, but they are traditionally one of the best mid-majors along with Tulsa. These division just seem really loop-sided. The new CUSA is feeling alot like kissing your sister.

All of this venom aimed at Benford on multiple threads after only 7 games got me to remembering. There was one hell of a brouhaha on here about running off Johnny Jones a few years ago (I counseled patience, you can look it up) and now he walks on water with a large majority of us. I am thinking take a deep breath and give Benford time to straighten this thing out before calling in the hit man. He has the basketball resume and he is surrounded by quality assistants. Lets demand some accountability from those kids whose job it is to play as a team and put the ball in the hole.

I've always appreciated KRAM's desire to find optimisim in everything Mean Green, but at some point you have to look at something and call it like it is. We have a coach who is in over his head. If you truly want what is best for your university, you have to hope for better than this. That's not being mean or cynical, that is understanding the situation and hoping our administration addresses this ASAP. Rhetoric like "do you really know what is happening behind the scenes?" or "is it really on the coaches or the players?" is - in this bad of a situation - reaching for something that you don't even know is there. RV made a bad hire. AGAIN.

Gosh, you know what, you're right. I'm so sorry. Fart some more rainbows. I'll make sure I follow other poster's protocol with your posts. Didn't mean to upset you. Let me apologize again. But, again, that's just my opinion.

Yes, it is. So, pull your panties out of that tight wad when someone disagrees with all of those rainbows that you keep farting out from the back of a unicorn in gum drop land. Again, that is just my opinion.

Cowardly. At least Petersen did his post game show.

Ah yes, if you weren't at the game, then your opinion doesn't matter and you are a lesser fan. I was there and saw an embarassing peformance from a group led by an AD and a coaching staff. If it were up to you, no coach or AD would ever get fired. I hold my university to a higher standard and expect a win every night and consider our toliet bowl athletic dept. status to be embarassing. Unrealistic attitudes like yours keep people like Dodge, RV, etc, here past their welcomes. EXPECT BETTER!

Then lets pay a coach minimum wage and save some cash. Hell, I bet we can get a student to do it for credit.

if the players don't respond, its coaching.

Nobody respects Benford because Benford COACHES NO DISCIPLINE into these players. Mitchell was so exasperated at Benford's inept-ness as a coach that he just gave up. Benford is ruining his career. I don't blame Mitchell for quitting tonight.

DING, DING, DING. WE HAVE A WINNER!

This is just sad to watch this team. There is no purpose to the offense. Any simple jack off the street can get a 3 against the zone. You have to use ball reversal, skip passes, get two people on you, second cutter, short corner. O wait our team wouldn't know about that because they only know how to run the fast break. Im just upset to see these guys go through the motions. They dont even know how to make a fundamental pass. That one handed crap is why we turn it over so many times. Will someone please teach these guys how to value the ball. Im tired of our guys playing like they think they are all-stars. Its going to be real simple to beat UNT this year all you have to do is make them shoot outside of 17ft and its over. They dont know how to rebound either, so you will be able to get over the back calls all night against our guys. There were plenty of opportunites to get the ball inside the zone in the first half, but our guys were content on just throwing the ball around the perimeter and thinking that would accomplish something. Umm timeout coach can I please listen into your huddle and what you told our guys to do at that point when UTA went to zone. Was the message to jack it up until it goes in? Do you have any zone beater plays? Do you have any offensive identity? I got it if you throw enough crap up at least one will have to stick and we will count on Tony to block shots until we start making them. Lots of changes are needed. Plenty of time to right the ship, but damn I feel like I could do a better job of teaching these guys offense and defense. I come cheap too.

Meanwhile, the Toulouse School of Graduate Studies calls me at home to dun me for donation money. Bad timing sister. Bad timing.

Looks like the cupboard was was left bare. Rick

You do realize he's playing a position right now that he'll NEVER play a minute of in the NBA right? He's not a center. Never has been, never will be. I don't know why our past 2 coaches insist on playing him there.

Benford looks like he is absouletetly lost on the sideline.

Please explain why? I understand they are very different. NBA is a one on one game and college is a true team effort. But there are some comparisons. Are they different? Yes very. But it is the same basic concept. And do not be rude to me. Ihave done nothing to you and am a fan just like everyone else. The "rudeness" is not appreciated.

There's no way I'd drive to Denton in the middle of the week to watch this garbage when I can be perfectly pissed off from home. It's not that they're losing, its the way they're losing. No effort, no organization, no energy. I wouldn't pay for a ticket to watch that crap, let alone the gas money to get there.

Benford did not come out for the post game interview. Shouldn't he thank the fans for sitting through that BS?

I just got a text from my aunt who graduated from UTA like 20 years ago and she was rubbing their win in my face. She is a school teacher and known nothing about sports. This is my f'n nightmare!

I've seen a lot of bad basketball at UNT. This tops it.

It's taken Benford about a month to take a dump on 11 years of building.

I'm almost fearful that Mitchell's NBA stock goes down playing in this "system."

There was a thread earlier in the year speculating on the possibility of being ranked. Uh, yeah, no. I see tons of individual talent, but I don't see a team.

We'll always be in the Sunbelt. We can change conferences as many times as we want....

Todd Berry also has a QB that can play. I don't fault McCarney for this now, but I will next year. Whoever is the QB (praying its Brock because he wins the job), he better be able to throw the ball accurately. In year three, that excuse will have been beaten. But for this year--and the previous year--its just a personnel issue. He was left with almost nothing at that position. I still believe that your third year as coach is when you can tell if things are going in the right direction or not. Its just that here at UNT, we don't have the $$$ to get rid of someone if that third year is poor and there are still multiple years left on the contract. Remember when USF came in here to Denton and beat us? Remember FAU doing the same thing? UTSA doing it next year is not beyond the scope of possibility. If it happens, it will be unacceptable and it will firmly place McCarney on the hot seat going into Year 4. But starting from scratch is easier than winning here--I firmly, unquestionsably, believe this. The Texas HS coaches only know North Texas as a loser and as a program that played spare teams for all of their life. Until McCarney got here, the Texas HS coaches in the last 30 years have dealt with Corky Nelson running a 1-aa program the best he could, Dennis Parker, a fellow HS coach, Matt Simon, an unknown assistant with a massive ego and a confrontational attitude, Darrell Dickey, a non-descript assistant that had the personality of a wall, and Todd Dodge, who HS success caused an ego that other HS coaches resented greatly. At UTSA, they known Larry Coker, winner of a national championshp in the last 11 years. At Texas State, they know Dennis Franchione is leading the charge, the same guy who coached at TCU, Alabama, and A&M. Those TX HS coaches don't know of UTSA and TX State as college football losers and dregs. That's almost all they have ever known of North Texas all of their lives.