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Listen, OU and Texas show themselves beating anyone. The people in the stands recognize the schools. Most of them have no idea whether Oklahoma State was good or bad in 1978, but they know they are good now. Only sports geeks like us know. In the law, you call it "puffing your wares." You have leeway to do it, you just can't cross the line into fraud. We've got to sell what we have. We have history. We've beaten schools people in the this area know. You're giving it 5-10 second on a big screen before a football game. Do it. Show people trying the product for the first time that the potential is here, and always has been. Show the people already on board that there is good reason to feel pride in staying on board. The folks down at UT don't care that they've had two sub-par (for them) seasons in a row. They're still going to show their players beating Baylor, even though the didn't do it last year. They're going to show Earl Campbell and James Street and Tommy Nobis, even though they haven't played a down in decades. You sell what you have. We have it. I sell commercial insurance. I'm going to sell you on the benefit of being covered by those I'm tied to - the Hartford, Travelers, Zurich, CNA., Texas Mutual, etc. I'm not going to dwell on Hanover, Republic Group and others I don't sell. You don't dwell on what you don't have. You run your flag up the pole and see who will salute it. The only way to not get it saluted is to run nothing up there. We don't have nothing. We have something. Sell it. Sell Fry, Rust, Odis, McCarney...famous players and games of the past, and the current stars tied to them.

Hey, kids...when you go to a road game - OU, Texas, Bama, whomever - they have these videos that show their history...Ken Stabler, Billy Sims, Earl Campbell...bowl wins, championship wins, plays from big games long past against rivals. See, we do have some of that history. And, contrary to what the young 'ens on board think, we need to exploit it the same way OU, Texas, and Bama, etc. do. We need video screenage of Mean Joe and Cedric Hardeman crushing QBs, Steve Ramsey throwing TDs, Abner Haynes running touchdowns, Beasley Reece and J.T. Smith intercepting passes. We need scoreboards and highlights of us beating Tennessee, Oklahoma State, TCU, Texas Tech, Baylor, SMU...all of it. Hayden Fry and Rod Rust roaming the sidelines. We need it. If you are like many of us in the business world, you know that perception is often reality. That's marketing. We have stuff to market, we just have to do it.

Now that I have your attention... This year, in addition to participating in my 4th Swim Across the Sound, I will be running in the ING New York City Marathon on November 4th. My entry was secured through Paul Newman's charity, The Hole in the Wall Gang and and will be running as a member of Team Hole in the Wall http://www.teamholeinthewall.org/ As a member of Team Hole in the Wall I have a personal fundraising goal of $3000.00 American. Below I've included my donation page...if you happen to have a few bucks laying around, any sort of contribution will be remarkably appreciated. http://events.teamholeinthewall.org/faf/home/default.asp?ievent=488955&lis=1&kntae488955=56049326B8F7476A8FA3C0E7C32D830D&login=t To donate: 1. Click the link. 2. Click "Sponsor a Participant" on the left hand column. 3. Type "Jesse" and "Hemingway" into "first name" and "last name", respectively...then click the link of my name below. 4. Donate. Thanks in advance.

And do you really think a high school recruit will look up UNT's record when a nice victory was recorded in the books years ago? No. They'll see that UNT beat Baylor, TCU, Tx Tech, Houston, Indiana, Tulsa (you know, that team we recruit against every year!), and many others. The Fake Lonnie Finch has it right. Market the good stuff.....plaster it on that video board....whatever it takes. Do not forget the past successes. Should we place the Jonas Buckles "jaw jarring hits" in the bowels of Fouts? Hell no! Nor should we forget about the Ramsey to Barry Moore and John Love touchdown "bombs" of the '60's.

Bama selling Namath, Stabler, etc. along with Trent Richardson in their intros last year:

Let's just whip them all on the field and make Banowsky look like a genius.

If he chooses to play for the Mean Green and is as motivated as it appears the rest of the roster is under McCarney's watch, this would be a very good pickup for the Mean Green. Quite frankly, the way our o-line is shaping up these days, it may be a great time to be a QB for the Mean Green. We just need some continued improvement from the WR and TE positions. I think the RB's will be very functional(maybe even better as a group) in the post Lance Dunbar era.... ok, maybe I'm a bit drunk from cool-aid, but it really does seem like a place that a QB can step in a be successful in the post DT era. Given that he buys in and works his tail off in the classroom and on the field here. I can't really compare UNT to FIU as far as a good place for a QB to come in, but I think we've got a lot of selling points right now....for a QB to come in here.

Now that the U.S. is a global super power, can we get rid of July 4? It's just wee Britain. I get just as annoyed with the dismissal of anything current as you seem to, but, for a program with this rough a history, you really want to completley dismiss everything old because we might finally go 6-6 or 7-5 this year if everything goes right?

The irony here is that this is your signature line: "Third Generation Mean Green!" Like others have already pointed out, don't read it or click the link if you don't like it. I, personally, happen to like hearing about some of these old games---esp. anything from the Joe Greene era, which happened about a decade before I was born.

The older guys have suffered through some rough times; I say "a-okay" for the sake of their catharsis. I love me some Dickey bowl years and might bring them up over a brewsy, but count me as one who will not be starting a thread about them 35 years from now.

Douche worthy response.

He must like sheep rather than girls!

I believe you answered your own question.

You are 100% correct and don't forget what you have just said when you hit retirement age, too, if your lucky enough to make it to retirement age. Many of us have numerous friends and acquaintainces who didn't. I will never forget actor Michael Landon on the Johnny Carson show weeks before he died looking straight into the TV camera telling America just how short life can be and would be for him. I remember seeing Ron Shanklin at Fouts and a few months before he died pulling for his Mean Green and looking too thin and frail. It was an unsettling scene for the many of us who loved that guy. He was family. GMG!

Not sure I understand the turn that this tread has taken at all. I assume those that dismiss NT history, at least acknowledge that NT was the first by years in the state of Texas and most of the South to integrate. Damn important and something all fans should be proud of, no matter if most were born years afterward. I don't expect fans who were not alive for the Greene, Ramsey or Fry teams to be overly impressed with something that happened decades ago; but it is important to realize that NT has a long athletic history. More remember the DD 26 game Belt winning streak but that is old history to some. The subject loss/robbery to Arkansas to me was much more significant than the 1988 UT game; that Arkansas team was much better but before downgrading the UT game remember that NT was a fc/1aa team playing a UT team that was down that year. Also that NT beat Rice and Tech that year. I hope fans have a lot more landmark games to look back on, years down the road. However, that doesn't change history; it just adds to it. To dismiss the past because it is not relevant anymore, is incredibly short sighted.

Look, here's an OU example. They don't care. They roll out the black and white stuff from the 1950s! Old men doing their thing in a modern intro. You think honeybadger gives a f*ck? Honeybadger don't care. He give you all he has until you are ground up in his belly...just like OU, Texas, etc. They will force feed their history to those who choose to enter their gates: We could make a hell of a 2 minute intro like this one with our history - from the MVC stars of the 50s - 70s, the wins over Tennessee, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, Baylor, the four consective bowls and those players, and coaches like Rod Rust, Hayden Fry, and Dan McCarney. I'd fade in the first TD in Apogee versus Houston, the win over Indiana, the crushing of ULM, and the dismantling of MTSU. This can be done. Although I respect what UTSA is doing. They have no history at all. We have some stuff and some guys from the past. We have facilities and momentum for the future. Tie it all together in one big bundle and put it in the eyeballs and ear holes of everyone - friend and foe - who walks into Apogee Stadium for a game.

Yea... And the only people who care about that kinda stuff at those schools are OLD too. This world is for younger more kickass fans. Sorry gramps.

Neinas did a good job. Regarding other schools and their success relative to others--It's always easiest to just bitch about what others have and whine about what you don't. Takes less effort, and makes a convenient excuse for lack of the same. Or even better, just make sh1t up and pass it off as truth, or continue rehashing the same old half-truths or outright lies, rather than just getting your own act together and going on with your bad self.

OK, consider this '72 & '75 graduate of UNT "pissed" by what you have said!

I vote that we bring back the daffy eagle helmet. We almost beat Texas Tech in that helmet in 1999.

Totally different. There are Pre-Training Camp Tryouts where players are invited to work out (No Contract involved at all), where they are evaluated and some will get a call to sign a contract. The Team will pick up the tab for flight or pay milage and then pay for their Room and Board while attending. The Undrafted Free Agents (Signed to a League Minimum 3-4 year contract) generally gets a player through OTA's and into training camp until the team decides to release them, up to and including the Cut Down dates, during preseason. UFA's get daily per diem's and free room and board through training camp or until they are released/waived. Practice Squad isn't created until after the final roster has been announced, if you don't make the final roster you are cut and will have to sign a new contract if brought back to the practice or active squad. Players signed to the practice squad get weekly checks in the amounts specified in the CBA which is much less than the UFA Contract (League Minimum divided by 17 games = weekly check), but still good money ( >$5000/week).

These close losses we love to opine over would be dismissed as failed opportunities to take the program to the next level were they to occur present day? Question, no info.

It's little too soon for this type of article. He put a band aid on the wound. OU and Texas still get more share than the other schools, so he did nothing to change that. Texas will still jump when they want to jump. Ditto Oklahoma...and, denying that they are clinging to Texas' tail all the way. The Big 12 being alive has nothing to do with Neinas. It's solely a function of the Pac-12 telling Texas no dice on their own network if they switched conferences (the Big Ten negged Texas for the same reason). And, on that day, Oklahoma learned how little use the Pac-12 had for them without Texas in the package...and, on down the line to hangers on Texas Tech and Oklahoma State. Texas A&M, win or lose on the field of play, will get a bigger payday in the SEC. Mizzou is the biggest winner of all. Decent occassionally in football, and more known for basketball, they got a miracle invite into the SEC, giving them more money and exposure than they could have ever dreamed of in the Big 12. A&M hosts Florida in September and LSU in October. They'll go to Auburn and Bama. Those are all potential national, and at minimum regional, pickups. That'd double what they'd have in the Big 12. Beyond OU and Texas, there is nothing worth watching in the Big 12 from a national TV audience standpoint. Mizzou really hit the jackpot. Home games with Georgia and Alabama, roadies with Tennessee, Florida, and South Carolina. That's a ridiculously mammoth increase in exposure for Mizzou, who never in their Big 12 days had OU and Texas scheduled in the same season. If there was ever an absolute dumb luck winner in all the conference restructuring, it's Mizzou. They went overnight from getting a smaller share in the Big 12 to an bigger equal share in the SEC, plus better exposure. It's crazy what's happened to Mizzou. It doesn't matter who the commissioner of the Big 12 is. The Big 12 is only the Big 12 as long as Texas gets to call the shots, and they can keep getting OU to believe they are co-equals in taking more share than the other eight chumps they have clinging to their respective coattails. Texas will dump OU in a New York minute if the can as well. The potential biggest fool in all of it could be OU, who had first shot at Mizzou's slot in the SEC. If Texas bolts on them, they are stuck with what is basically a garbage conference. And, what a day that would be...OU left at the alter after sucking up to Texas in an effort to get into the Pac-12, then passing on the SEC for "equal" lording over of the Big 12.

BOOM

I like Tacos. I even invited NT03 even though he gives me the creeps.

We some day want to be thought of as a great program just like the UT's the A$M's, and yes, the TCU's and even the SMU's of the world. All of them HAVE a history, and all of them CELEBRATE their history. This is just a good time of the year to remind the newer members of the family that we too have a history.........and it wasn't all bad. Interesting and ironic that this threat,and some of the negative comments happened around Memorial day.

I agree. There's not a lack of room on this board for any MeanGreener's opinions or reminiscences, and that is especially true now that we're about to go into the annual message board doldrums before 2 a days begin. If people don't want to read a thread because it's too old fashioned for them, they should simply avoid clicking on it, and instead just start one of their own if they believe that "more modern day stuff" has more relevance. Replies show the demand, and if no one replies the threads will just go away. Personally, I enjoy hearing the whole spectrum of the NT experience whether it's 1890 or 2012. I'll just choose to click on what interests me.

Well, it's a shame that he couldn't utilize their talents while he was coaching them.

Fixed??

I was a HS senior when that North Texas/Arkansas game was played in Little Rock. Yes, this is the past and I'd think the kind that North Texas would want to learn and maybe even build from especially compared to all the under-achievement we've seen in most of the last 30 years. Most of those years have become quite forgettable for most except I suppose the ones that thats all they've seen for the most part. Still makes me proud as a UNT alum when an AD from an ACC school who played on that Razorback team said that North Texas was 1 of the 2 best football teams he saw in his 4 years at the University of Arkansas. I'm trying very hard to understand why that would suddenly be a negative with a few who have yet as UNT students or alums ever seen a UNT MG HFC leave Denton above .500. in wins/losses. Hell, most of us Old Gun Alums have to go back decades for the last one we've seen Free advice: Don't like a thread................don't read the thread, but criticizing a thread that several have responded to with fond memories (because #1 they were there) and a thread about our North Texas legacy and history at its highest pinnacle of success just takes the cake. GMG!

That's so seven seconds ago.

I see the words you are posting but in my mind I hear:

I'd like a QR code stretching from one 30 to the other 30. Game changer.

WTF was 1994 thinking?

What does The Tulsa helmet say? Tulsa

Amen, Deep!

I am saddened by some of the replies to older, passionate fans who remind younger alums of North Texas' history in major college football. Are you telling me that you're tired of hearing about the Tx Tech wins, the Tennessee victory, beating Oregon State, or Tulsa and Louisville, etc. back in the 1960's? Is the SFA win in 1994 as meaningful? Should we just quit bringing up the names of great players too, like Abner Haynes, for instance? Hey, Joe Greene's name should be buried too! Right? Is that what you younger fans are telling the "old guard"? All the while our neighbors to the South still think of Kyle Rote and Sammy Baugh as gods. People these victories, these people who donned the green and white are all part of our history! Embrace it and never grow tired of hearing the stories from the great fans that were around to witness our history. This thread has turned in the wrong direction and is disturbing to me. Shame on those of you who have derailed Plummer's post.

I thought we were saving the hash tag thing for our new helmet logo.

LA Tech, LA Monroe, Arky State, Idaho.....

We could then post videos from the games...assuming someone knows how, of course.

...or maybe #F SMU.

So, they fall into the crap category because you aren't a fan of boots?

No problem, I figured as much. As for the polished turds I will be safe with my boots on.

Don't forget that Feeley has actually started two years. Mc is prone to exaggeration, but he said that Johnson was 6'7 320 now. I think the offensive line may not only be the strongest part of the team this year, but could be the unit that allows this team to go up a notch. I see a good runner game despite the loss of Dunbar who with the exception of a couple of games last year was playing hurt. I don't see any star running backs, but a lot of depth.

I believe that this is the strongest (no pun intended) unit of the team. Lemon should be all-conference and the others are not far behind. I don't worry about Coleman Feeley. He has two things going for him that he didn't have as a previous starter. Those are OL Coach Mike Simmonds and Strength Coach Frank Wintrich. If he holds off Cam Feldt he'll be a strong part of the front five. I know that everyone expected Cam Feldt to be an instant all-star but as talented as he is I think that he's still pretty raw. Plus I'm not sure that he was as motivated as he needed to be. When his brother Boone gets here this fall I believe that they will feed off of one another and be a formidable pair of offensive linemen for the next three years. Throw in the potential of Micah Thompson, Travis Ellard, Connor Trussel and perhaps Grant Shaw, and Brent Rentfro and this group will continue to be strong. I trust Coach Simmonds to keep it that way.

I like All About UNT's definition but seriously it is SEAR'ul.

How do you pronounce Lemon's first name?

I think we have been fortunate in the "good luck" department this off-season. Between moving to C-USA, Mitchell coming back for another season, signing some quality coaches, winning a few conference championships, and landing a few quality players, I'm content. The helmet agrument can wait for another off-season.