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Wrong. Losing in the Belt is killing us.

That was part of the promotion. You wouldn't have to see the poor tackling, dropped balls, interceptions, etc.

Why are we arguing with a guy who doesn't even know what conferences we've been in?

DO YOU GET IT NOW? wKY's Jack Doyle, #82. 9 catches for 89 yards. He was that big bastard who kept catching and converting the third down and 5 or 6's over the middle all damn night long. They finished 9 for 16 on third down conversions. We finished 0-6. I give huge props to their FIRST YEAR offensive coordinator Zachary Azzanni for the lesson he spooned out to us on how to use the tightend and calling an all around great game. Rick

Considering this was opening weekend for the new twilight movie, not bad at all.

Hmmm...sounds like we may have borrowed the Ponycounter while they were out of town for the weekend. Maybe it was just because the crowd was quieter than usual, but it sure didn't seem like 17K to me. We've got to do something about filling that conspicuous Wing, because if it's going to sit there empty every game, I would rather that it just fly away. Hope a LEGIT promotion for the finale gets announced on Monday.

Apogee is bringing 28. We are sponsoring a punt, pass, kick contest in the second half. Let's get to 20k!

Don't forget the big money maker with C-USA is the $5 million a year each school takes in from TV revenue. We currently get 0 from the Sun Belt TV deal.

They should have kicked the field goal. Pretty easy call.

I'm not sure if you are saying that we would never get above 17K vs UTSA. If you are, then I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. I didn't do an official count, but I'm guessing that WKU brought about 20 fans to a very important game. Plus do an unofficial survey of students. Would they be more interested in attending a game vs UTSA or WK-who? Does anyone think that UTSA would bring any less fans than WKU? Here's a little historical perspective. From the 2005 official football guide. Highest attended games at Fouts. 1. Baylor (2003) 29,437 2. Baylor (2000) 28,315 3. TCU (2001) 22, 837 4. SMU (1990) 22,750 (1-AA years) 5. McNeese (1994) 20,733 (1-AA years) 6. Montana (1994) 20,730 (1-AA years) 7. SFA (1989) 20,252 (1-AA years) 8. NMSU (2002) 20,064 9. ULL (2003) 19,271 10.UNLV (1999) 19,011 Yearly average attendance (selected years) During our "Bowl run"years 2001, 14,769 2002, 15,260 2003, 18,694 (boosted in large part by the Baylor game attendance) 2004, 15,184 Averages during our 1-AA days when we were nationally ranked on a fairly regular basis. 1986, 12,730,4 home games (record 6-4) 1987, 13,764,4 home games (record 7-5) 1988, 15,319,5 home games (record 8-4) 1989, 14,289,5 home games (record 5-6) 1990, 14,783,6 home games (record 6-5) What I'm seeing by looking at these numbers is that there was not a whole lot of difference in our attendance from our 1-AA days and our bowl run days. THIS STATEMENT DOES NOT MEAN I'M ADVOCATING A RETURN TO 1-AA. Opponents with better name recognition helps somewhat, but not all that much. So, I'm not the least bit inclined to sneer at the prospect of being in a conference with Texas St. and/or UTSA. They will bring in a hell of a lot more of their fans than FAU, FIU, WKU and Troy. ArkSt. and ULL do alright, but I would be willing to bet that UTSA and Tx St. fans would travel to Denton in much higher numbers on a regular basis than either of them. What I have advocated all along is that North Texas look at it's CULTURE as much, if not more, than it's conference affiliation.

Let the first year wear off and see what happens.

Right. And I'm willing to bet there were three to four of those conversions to Doyle in which he caught the ball then had 3 to 5 yards after catch because the defender grabbed him up high around the shoulders and he drug them for the conversion? I'd hate to be in the film room this morning. Rick

I assume that since your claiming the Sunbelt will be the end of our program that your new around here and missed out on what happens when we actually field a winning team. But then you supported with facts against your own claim, so I guess you do get it. We do have a solid core of about 8 to 10,000 fans that turn out rain or shine, Tuesday or Saturday. We saw them there last night(No way in hell there was more than 10k there last night). If we want more we have to field a winning team. Stop crying about the Belt. It's helped us get where we are now. New Stadium, more money in the program and a beautifully restored smoothbore, 6 pound cannon that the few who showed up in red last night won't soon forget. Rick

I still get questioned and looked at cross wise when people find out that UNT and all the schools in our conference are in the same football "division" as UT, OU, LSU, Bama. Most just assumed that all the schools in our conference are D2.

The sunglasses are the darkest ever made in the history of the universe. I couldn't see through them in daylight let alone night time.

Anyone want to bet that if we get into CUSA, there will be threads complaining about playing UAB, Marshall and ECU instead of regional opponents local people care about?

There is no way the SMU-UCF game had 22k attendance. I saw that game and if lucky, there were 12k people in the stands.

...ideally with a service academy.

We have an excuse for every occasion. We've used the Big West, Sun Belt, coaches, weather, unknown opponents, commuter school, hippies, fraternities, Fouts Field, tailgaters who stay outside, SMU, money games, administration (especially Lee Jackson), recruiting, publicity, fund raising, athletic department, lack of donors, no baseball, Denton, Denia Park, and injuries for not winning or poor attendance. There may be a small element of truth in most of those reasons but how many are willing to accept the blame for their lack of effort? I know that some do what they can toward the success of this program but most don't. We think that if we give to the Mean Green Club and buy season tickets that we have done our share. Financially, some can't afford a higher level but most can. It's a matter of priorities. Even if you are at the highest level that you can afford you can do more. How many others have you tried to get to support the Mean Green? The Mean Green Club, if indeed it is a club, should organize so that there are stated goals with plans and efforts to meet those goals. For example, the membership committee might have as a stated goal to add members and increase giving so that we can advance to a better conference. I, for one, would not increase my giving if we only planned to continue in the SBC. Put as many as possible on a committee to further the growth of the Club whether it be season ticket sales, attendance, publicity, or another function that would make us stronger. Getting started would be difficult but once rolling it would become easier to perpetuate. Have quarterly meetings (heard of that before?) to keep members informed of our progress and our needs. We need to quit making excuses and act. Pump the AD staff with ideas and follow through with whether they were accepted or rejected and why. Currently, the student body is not pulling their share and should be encouraged to attend at least one game per season as a show of school spirit. The alumni, many who have purchased season tickets (and even chairbacks) do not attend. There should be someone that they can call so that the seats gets used if they are unable to be there. Work rather than make excuses. Others have succeeded with a later starting point and less resources than we have. We can do the same if we try.

UTSA average football attendance this year is 35,500.UNT average for past 10 years, including 2011 ytd, is 1/2 that, and includes our 4 Sun Belt championships, 4 New Orleans Bowl appearances,amd last 3 winning seasons. i don't have a clue how to expand our fan base, but what ever we are doing is not working. being in a regional conference would certainly help, but it's our responsibility to put N.T. fans in the stadium and not count on visiting teams to add much. i don't think Houston brought more than a few thousand fans, and if we did obtain membership in Western Division of CUSA,Tulane,Rice,UTEP,Tulsa,LA.Tech,or UTSA are not going to bring more and maybe even less.

Dunbar is a warrior and has given his all, there is a lot of stupidity in this thread. It is obvious that he has not been 100% this year but he has also been running behind an inexperienced offensive line against defense strongly focused on him. I do wonder what in the heck, McCarney and Canales were doing with Dunbar in this game. He was too injured to start or in fact play much and they put him in with a fourth and 1 at the gold-line. He is either fit to play and in that case should have played more or he is unfit to play and should have stayed on the side line. Putting him in at critical plays made absolutely no sense to me.

The fee is high because of stadium rental+parking+concessions+having to have an entire police department to work security and close down the highway/direct traffic. Thank you City of Denton.

So have you already put in for your 2012 Roadrunners season tickets yet? They even get to play in the WAC!

I can say with all honesty that when I was a student at North Texas (early to mid 70's) I didn't know any of these SBC schools even existed except for Coach Larry Lacewell's Arkansas St football program and University of Louisiana. North Texas (just out of the Mo' Valley) was pretty well one of the pioneering schools of getting on the schedule of many of the true Big Boys. It was truly a big deal in our state when UT's Darrell Royal scheduled some first time ever games with North Texas. We've heard alums from schools who have sinced passed us by even say that North Texas was their model for dramatically upgrading their own schedules (and thus their programs) as Fry was able to do with great consistency. They just kept advancing their football programs--we went back into our usual retreat mode. I've heard UNT AD/Rick V even say Southern Miss at one time looked up to the North Texas of the 70's because they, too, at that time were beginning their march into unchartered waters of a more big time football program for themselves which they knew they'd have to upgrade their schedules for that to happen. Their ex football coach (Bobby Collins) in an old Southern Living magazine annual football edition even had a full page photo of Coach Collins standing in front of their newely expanded football stadium press box side when he said "we now have an impressive football stadium which will help in our recruiting." Those familiar with their program's history will know that it did just that. Folks, that was over 35 years ago and we all know which stadium we spent that same number of years in. Seems even back then that your stadium determined who your conference neighborhood would be. Most of those years we did not have the leadership who would say: "We must have a new football stadum at North Texas--Fouts Field has out-lived its usefullness." (Fry sorta' put a strangle-hold of the importance of a new on campus stadium by his wanting to use Texas Stadium--but his plans were that we'd need that stadium for his program to grow with the schools he wanted to play). Also, I think some past leadership at North Texas thought football would eventually just be dropped so they certainly would never talk about the need of a new stadium. (Anyone else think Gretchen Bataile got canned because of her leading the way for a new stadium)? GMG! PS: Isn't it amazing the mood & attitude this board takes when we lose a football game? GMG!

If they have the same numbers and attendance 3 and 5 years from now then I will give them credit. In the meantime we'll be improving and getting better as well.

But, But, But. Frats.

I guess those who think 17k is accurate are the ones who sat in one of the few crowded sections and never got up from their seats and walked around last night? No way in the world there was even remotely close to that. This is late Novemebr, in a losing season. 11 years ago in November during another losing season, in a conference that included BOISE STATE, with us coming into a game against NMST at 2-8, we drew maybe 900. That's Nine Hundred! Those of you who were there will never forget it. 24 months later against the sameschoole, NMSU, around the same exact weekend in November, but with the conference championship on the line we drew 24k. Since that time we have had a solid core of about 10k show up for our late season games, because again, we have a solid core fan base. Not a huge one, but a solid one. This was why I bitched about the time change for the FAU game. We have a solid core of people who are there, heat, cold, rain or shine regardless if there is a Ranger World Series game or if the team is 4-6. In order to grow this we have to win. 4 Bowl games got us from a solid core of about 900 to roughly 10,000. Hopefully another run of wins in the future will see the same results. Rick

Not bad considering this was the last weekend opportunity to do xmas shopping prior to the holiday shopping season when there's tons of people out.

I swear they only ran 2 plays. Rainey off tackle or throw to the TE. I guess if we can't stop either they didn't need to do anything else.

Our people have been apathetic long before the Sun Belt.

Meh, beat MTSU and I will be very satisfied with what this Team has done. Especially after the total mess that Dodge left this Program in. Coach Mac with the possibility of 5 Wins THIS Season? While Dodge could only win SIX TOTAL GAMES in his three-plus years here?! Heck yeah! A .500 Season is well within reach next Season. And, do I dare say a being Bowl-eligible or winning the SBC Title? Seems like more of a possibility in '12 and beyond now than just a couple of months ago!

The WAC and Southland are even more terrible. You're right, we need to get out of this conference. But we have to start beating the teams in it like they just slept with your sister. Especially the ULM, ULL, WKU, MTSU, FAU, FIU of the world. Ark St and Troy, for some reason are the only 2 other schools they seem to recognize.

Says the person who missed the 10-15,000 Mean Green fans that gathered in New Orleans on a TUESDAY NIGHT, four years in a row. Rick

Exactly my point. Thus the SBC is killing our program. A good % of people on here are really blinded by UNT's irrelevance.

The die hard and super good fans know this information. To most people this is irrelevant. It will take a complete turnaround and BIG TIME winning for people to notice. We have two schools in our own backyard that has done a complete 180...look at TCU and Houston and heck even put in SMU to a degree. If we do what they can do then regardless of what conference we are in people will show up. Also look at schools like Boise, ECU, UCF....it took time but it took some good winning and some ranked teams for them to be be relevant to their alumni and fanbase. At the end of the day we have to realize that we were a whopping 4-6 and now 4-7. It will be hard to sell for any team.

The circumstance being that we were playing a small, obscure Kentucky school that no-one in Texas cares about?

If its one of the first couple games, yes we would. UTEP would bring a lot of fans.

My son and I were wearing ours in Section 205 and NO ONE else was wearing them... The UNT Angels were sitting in front of us and they cheered mightily when the video board showed a picture of them all wearing shades, but they weren't wearing them at the game... It was really disappointing... I thought this was a great promotion that was so easy to participate in... There's just so much apathy...

Better question, where are the fans? This is embarrassing.

RPI's heading into today. 22 FIU 63 Denver 92 MTSU 106 ULM 136 USA 137 ULL 142 Troy 161 North Texas 168 UALR 193 ASU 212 FAU 254 WKU BTW -- we're the #9 conference with the #1 SOS.

We get to tailgate and experience another Game Day at Apogee after being off for about a month. It seems that every game I'm more and more excited about that wonderful place. Obviously winning helps trememdously and I'm so thankful that our team is building a winning tradition at home. I have a good feeling that Saturday will be a very special day. Our menu is pretty basic this weekend...Fisher's Meat Market sausage and smoked cheese and hotdogs for the kids... anyone else have their menu planned?

I think that's all anybody's saying. No one's going to commit upon playing a HS playoff game in a college's stadium. But it can generate interest when players see the quality of the facilities, and can help us get a foot in the door.

12,430

if you get a chance, try to walk around Texas Hall and take in all the views. It's neat. I'll miss it, but can't wait to see the new arena either. I saw UNT play on TV the other night...Mavs are gonna have their hands full. UTA is a veteran team this year, have several guys that can get hot from outside. Not much post scoring, but some guys that can gather up errant shots and put them back for 2 points. And kinda like ya'lls superstar freshman guard that was penetrating all night on Tech, we've got Cameron Catlett who has a similar game, so watching those two probably guard each other will be fun. Our best scorer is Bo Ingram, a senior who can score from outside or inside. Fun to watch. Our post play might be a weak spot, since most of our scoring is outside of 8 feet. UNT shoots and makes a lot of 3s, but we try to go a little more inside, but will take the open 3 if needed or someone gets hot. Lagerson, our 7' center, will block some shots and is still developing his offensive game. No doubt the arena has helped our recruiting. We're bigger and more talented than ever. Enough to beat a well-coached UNT team that's been recruiting exceptionally well now for several years? Good question. I see UNT as super-skilled and young, UTA is a veteran team that is still learning how to win close games (we lost a bunch of 2-4 point games last year)...so I see another close game at the Hall. Prediction: UTA 87, UNT 85 in a nail-biter classic (as they often are). Here's a page with some pics of the arena in progress: http://www.facebook.com/#!/UTACollegePark

And hopefully playing them every year. We would not see a 17k night against them, good or bad teams, frats or no frats.

Fielding a winning team in the Sun Belt...15-18K attendance. Difference now? Nothing. If you were at the game, then you'd realize there were about 17K at the game. A little less than homecoming. The Belt hasn't helped us do anything other be disrespected and increase our irrelevance in the D/FW market. We will never move up because conferences go "UNT has the D/FW market" then see on all the websites us at the very bottom with one or two stories and any research will prove to you that we don't. Why? Because we play teams no one cares about. We play Indiana. Everyone knows Indiana. Even though we lost one game in typical UNT fashion and one in heartbreaking fashion, we still draw 20K+. Idaho, yeah, no one knows them or really cares. Texas State, UTSA, etc. people do know them. New Mexico? Yeah, they suck but people know them. Shall I go on? Go ask people about the opponents we play. No one knows/cares. Even alumni. Those are the people we need to sway. Like it or not, WKU/MTSU aren't getting that done. MAC crowds still have 20K+ in much smaller markets.

What does that really have to do with anything? UNT has a core die-hard fan base of 13,000 who go to the game no matter what and would go to New Orleans to watch us at a bowl game.

I've never been the biggest fan of the Sunbelt but don't blame the conference for our 7 years of god awful suckdom. It's like blaming SMU for our historical track record of sucking and not advancing our athletic programs. Get real.

And when you come see UNT play you get to watch an irrelevant opponent who is from the other side of the nation. "Middle" Tennessee gets me giggles and a "LOL wut" from everyone. People assume we play FCS schools. Look, UTSA/UTEP may be inferior to a WKU but they'd bring fans, and they'd bring respect, which would consistently bring 25K+ no matter the record. UH's attendance was so good because UH brought fans and people wanted to see Houston play us, because they know UH. Such the case with Indiana. If we're 0-9 the stadium will still have 25K+ for SMU.

It looks like my attendance prediction was pretty spot on.