Hotel and Conference Center "Deal in the Works"

1. Build hotel & convention center

2. HOOKERS AND BLOW

3. Profit

i filled in the question marks...

Edited June 9, 2012 by THOR

Mark G is going bit overboard on the sell job for a convention center.

I agree that the new hotel and convention center will be an economic boast. But saying it will create a cost savings because University and City events are booked somewhere else is a stretch. When was the last time you saw a UNT booked at the Lewisville convention center?

but UNT isn't in lewisville...they are in denton...that makes a difference.

Did they have the gateway center yet?

I pm for the convention center and hotel. But I refuse to believe the school does so much convention business that it can't support it on campus.

Mark G is going bit overboard on the sell job for a convention center.

I agree that the new hotel and convention center will be an economic boast. But saying it will create a cost savings because University and City events are booked somewhere else is a stretch. When was the last time you saw a UNT booked at the Lewisville convention center?

Maybe not at Lewisville but on more than one occasion to Dallas.

Mark G is going bit overboard on the sell job for a convention center.

I agree that the new hotel and convention center will be an economic boast. But saying it will create a cost savings because University and City events are booked somewhere else is a stretch. When was the last time you saw a UNT booked at the Lewisville convention center?

Maybe just a little. This is probably not the most compelling argument. But, it is true that UNT has schedule conventions and events outside of Denton due to a lack of adequate facilities. I think we both agree that this project will be a big economic boost. I also believe that building the convention center can be a first step in increasing the needed cooperation between the City and the University. Building a convention center at the proposed location will result in the city having a vested interest in the streets, facilities and traffic flow near UNT sport venues and facilties on the west side of I-35. Edited June 10, 2012 by Mark Gommesen

The hotel/convention center will have amenities for a convention that are simply not available on campus. If anyone has attended an out of town convention will appreciate the convenience of a hotel, a restaurant, and a lounge connected to the convention center.

I may get shot down for this, but why would anyone (other than UNT) want to hold a conference/convention in Denton? Other than game days, there is nothing to see or do there. There's not even a decent public golf coarse close by. Why a developer doesn't turn the old Razor Ranch project into a nice 18 hole golf coarse is beyond me. There are a few nice restaurants in town, but is there anything special or unique that would really compel a business or other entity to come and spend it's money in Denton? Unique venues like big concert halls with mainstream bands, air shows, a local Schlitterbahn like in south Texas or other large, unique entertainment centers that would support a large influx of people on a regular basis. Business and other commercial development in Denton has been retarded for years. IMHO, the City needs to get inventive an create some venues that would encourage conventions to come here on a regular basis.

Addendum: Maybe there are some things in the works, development wise, that I'm not aware of. My main point is that the other "suburbs" (eg. Grapevine) have made themselves a very attractice place to come and visit for locals and out-of-towners. True, the airport is right there, but Denton is the convergence of two major interstate highways for Peats sake! Like it or not, Denton. Growth is coming. Make the most of it.

Addendum: Maybe there are some things in the works, development wise, that I'm not aware of. My main point is that the other "suburbs" (eg. Grapevine) have made themselves a very attractice place to come and visit for locals and out-of-towners. True, the airport is right there, but Denton is the convergence of two major interstate highways for Peats sake! Like it or not, Denton. Growth is coming. Make the most of it.

Hunter,Excellent point! If you look what other suburbs including Frisco, Grapevine, etc. have achieved, it is frustrating to see where Denton stands in the scheme of things. With two major universities, rail mass transit, the convergence of two major major interstate highways, Denton should be the cultural and intellectual center of the metroplex. Denton is the gateway to metroplex from the north, yet Denton does not offer anything to encourage people to stop and explore. Denton, has so much potential. This why an outside developer is willing to invest $85 million on a major hotel/restaurant complex.

Hunter has no idea what he's talking about. The Denton CVB could give you a dozen reasons to do business in Denton beyond UNT.

Why do you think Denton does millions of dollars a year in direct hotel spending.

And Gralevine isn't jus some suburban Tourism market, they've grown themselves into a full-scale tourism destination.

The tourism industry is a highly segmented industry and the small meeting market (1,000 or less) is a big part of the industry.

I admit not being in the loop as far as Denton politics is concerned, I just know that if not for UNT, I have no reason to come to Denton. Grapevine or Frisco, you bet, and have often.

I admit not being in the loop as far as Denton politics is concerned, I just know that if not for UNT, I have no reason to come to Denton. Grapevine or Frisco, you bet, and have often.

Bingo. I am the same way. Haven't been to the campus since the basketball charity event. There are way better destinations in DFW and Denton isn't doing much to make itself one.

There are way better destinations in DFW and Denton isn't doing much to make itself one.

23 is completely off base. Denton has a really good Connvention and Visitors Bureau and Denton is doing alot to make itself a better destination. The fact that they are looking at a convention center with hotel would disprove his point all together.

The horse country tour just won a bunch of tourism awards, the area between the square and train station is booming, Dentons festivals are getting better organized and growing, and then theres at other university in town.

The fact that other destinations have something to offer, doesn't discredit Denton as a tourism location. I'd rather visit Denton than Hurst, Irving, Amarillo, Waxahachie, Longview, Lewisville, Colleyville, or Waco (all convention centers that have had renovations in the past two years).

Don't get me wrong, I am all for the hotel/convention center being built, and the sooner, the better. I just don't think the elected officials are thinking out of the box when it comes to development. While the project will have involvement from the city, I doubt the idea originated with anyone in city government. Maybe I'm wrong. Just my opinion and impression of the City of Denton.

All great convention cities have one thing in common - establishments that feature American Folk Dancing.

The UNT Alumni assoc. just this year hosted a national conference of Alumni Associations at UNT and had a great turnout. The gateway center is way too small and has far inadequate space to host any event of any real size. Its' great for certain things and was built not as a convenetion center, but to handle much smaller events. It is even getting to be too small to host the Alumni Association's twice annual Ring Ceremony for graduating seniors. There is really no place in denton to house any conference of any size and that is the reason Denton does not compete with some of the cities mentioned in this thread. There is no one hotel large enough to house any group of any real size...thus, while Denton has seen a nice increase in hotel/motel rooms in the last few years, no one of the properties is actually large enough.

So, if you want to bring mid-sized (and even smaller conferences) to Denton and if you want a place in Denton to be able to hold larger events such as Chamber of Commerce events within the city of Denton itself, the this conference center and hotel is a pretty important development.

There will be the usual number of naysayers who want Denton to stay the sleepy little college town that they see it as (and, of course, which it has not been for over 20 years now), the same number of "not in my backyard folks, the same number of of just plain negative on everything folks that always come out of the woodwork in cases where Denton and/or UNT is doing some development, but the bottom line here is that this is a needed addition for Denton. The positives far outweigh any negatives that these folks can drum up...in my opinion, of course. Let the dirt start turning and flying on this project ASAP. The sooner the better for me.

Denton could use the conference center, considering its location right at the joining of 35 E/W, and considering that the town's bringing in more and more businesses and visitors. Let's also go into the fact that UNT itself doesn't really have the facilities for a full-on conference/convention like something similar to SHOTSHOW, and very few places in DFW have that capacity at all.

Edited June 12, 2012 by meangreendork

It would be great if Denton got a convention center, but I wonder why it has to be on NT property. Seems to me that land might be put to better use by NT than a hotel complex. Athletic facilities and student housing might be better for NT. By the looks of it, land in the concrete city around Fouts should not be cost prohibited. Denton seems to do so little for NT, why should NT subsidize a convention center?

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/politics/2012/06/stop-building-convention-centers/2210/

http://www.theatlant...n-centers/2210/

To answer your articles question:

No, it is not time to quit building hotel and conference centers and especially those that

have 31,000 & 10,000 seat facilities adjacent to them..................like UNT's will have.

Apogee Stadium and the Super Pit would make Denton's future hotel and conference center most unique to some groups who

may very well need a larger venue for their mass meetings during a (lets say) 3 or 4 day event.

A convention lasting 3 or 4 days coming to Denton is what some would call one helluva' cash cow for local merchants (and other local hotels as well).

I was not there in person, but photos I saw of Promise Keepers with the enormous numbers they had Fouts Field made our Ol' Lady about as full as I'd ever seen her, yet they had smaller meetings prior to their mass meetings elsewhere in the city of Denton as I recall reading their agenda. Still, they needed a college football stadium to hold their mass meetings.

GMG!

Edited June 14, 2012 by PlummMeanGreen

If Denton wasn't already a tourist draw with a huge government presence, then the criticism in the Atlantic might apply.

The article is also talking about big conventions, where Denton is making a play for a much different market.

Ask yourself if Hurst can support a convention center why can't Denton?

It would be great if Denton got a convention center, but I wonder why it has to be on NT property. Seems to me that land might be put to better use by NT than a hotel complex. Athletic facilities and student housing might be better for NT. By the looks of it, land in the concrete city around Fouts should not be cost prohibited. Denton seems to do so little for NT, why should NT subsidize a convention center?

UNT is not subsiding the convention center. UNT is leasing the land and generating revenue. With the convention the city will have vested interested in the University especially in the area near Apogee. The University will be one the entities that will uses the convention center, why would you not want the convention center on campus? The convention center will allow the University to leverage its facilities and resources. This project will increase the University's visibility. "The xyz convention at the University of North Texas." THIS A BIG WIN FOR THE UNIVERSITY. Edited June 14, 2012 by Mark Gommesen

UNT is not subsiding the convention center. UNT is leasing the land and generating revenue. With the convention the city will have vested interested in the University especially in the area near Apogee. The University will be one the entities that will uses the convention center, why would you not want the convention center on campus? The convention center will allow the University to leverage its facilities and resources. This project will increase the University's visibility. "The xyz convention at the University of North Texas." THIS A BIG WIN FOR THE UNIVERSITY.

Having the convention center on UNT campus near the interstate will be a huge win for the university. However, even though I leved in cement city for three years during college I wouldn't mind seeing it torn down for something better.

City Council on May 15 with O’Reilly, UNT President V. Lane Rawlins, and members of the public in attendance – you can click here to see a video of the entire presentation. To add to the public nature of this presentation, I made a point of it in my regular Council Meeting Preview prior to that meeting.

And let’s be clear: this still has to be voted on and approved by the City Council. Nothing is set. Citizens have long been in favor of the idea of a convention center and they will surely have the chance to chime in on the specifics on this one prior to the approval of any such agreement.

CLAIM: The city is on the hook for $87 million for this project.

FACT: That figure represents the approximate total cost of the project, including the value of the land and the cost of building the hotel. $60 million of this is coming from private funding – the O’Reilly group proposes to fund the hotel and connected restaurant. The land is coming from UNT. If the plan is approved by council and goes through, the city’s investment in the project would be approximately $25 million.

CLAIM: The city is liable for the $87 million.

FACT: Once again, the city’s investment is much less – $25 million. This is still significant, which is why the council has insisted that the city lower its risk as much as possible. In order to pay off the debt associated with the Certificates of Obligation that would be issued in order to fund such a project, the ad valorem and hotel taxes generated from this project would be dedicated to pay this down. In addition, O’Reilly would make lease payments to the city for the convention center. And here is where the potential deal is great for the protection of our taxpayers: in the event funds generated from this project are not enough for the city to pay off the debt, the O’Reilly team will make up the difference.

I hope this helps clarify this issue for those who have been confused by various claims made recently. I guess it is more fun to conjure up images of slick politicians sipping on Scotch and smoking cigars in the seedy back room of some ambiguous local bar ran by the politically-connected. Sometimes I wish local government was that enticing. More often I find myself debating the nuances of setbacks during a 7 hour council meeting in front of an audience of about 3…

http://denton-tx.gra...d=3&clip_id=583

http://rodenfordento...vention-center/

Edited June 14, 2012 by Mark Gommesen

UNT is not subsiding the convention center. UNT is leasing the land and generating revenue. With the convention the city will have vested interested in the University especially in the area near Apogee. The University will be one the entities that will uses the convention center, why would you not want the convention center on campus? The convention center will allow the University to leverage its facilities and resources. This project will increase the University's visibility. "The xyz convention at the University of North Texas." THIS A BIG WIN FOR THE UNIVERSITY.

Yes,NT leased the land at the old hotel for far below market value. I have no idea what the terms of the new proposal are and I doubt few do at this point. One question why would the city or the hotel want it on Nt property if there was not an advantage for them to it.

If it is an advantage to NT to have it had Eagle Point, more power to them. I am not sure why having a convention center on your property is an asset. It sounds a awful lot like all these municipal contruction projects that are always going to spur development but seldom do. At the least, if it is development it will be something that NT will have to schedule around and it will take property out of control of the University. I fail to see how it enhances anything directly at NT.

The old hotel was a different thing altogether. NT had nothing over there and wanting someone else to deal with the golf course. If NT indeed leasing the property to the City or another entity they will pay just like anyone else to use the facility either directly or a reduction in lease income to cover NT use of the convention center. This very well may make financial sense to NT, but I hope they know what they are doing.