Georgia State To The Sun Belt

Did no one see my previous post?

But I guess its hard to face the facts with numbers. Georgia St. was voted in because they have a good chunk of change to draw on, good market, good facilities, good name, etc. The same reason we built our facilities, to move up.

Wake up people, THE REASON WHY THE SBC IS AT THE BOTTOM IS THE LACK OF MONEY/RESOURCES THE TEAMS HAVE! Look at those endowments. $389,000?? Seriously? If we can contribute with our funds and build up our program so can they. Only two programs have a higher endowment ,TWO. So how is it that we can be putting this team down already?

the endowment for Troy is 30 million and change

http://www.nacubo.org/Documents/research/2011_NCSE_Public_Tables_Endowment_Market_Values_Final_January_17_2012.pdf

still small potatoes, but a great deal more than 400K

and 166 million is really not a "good chunk of change" either

endowments usually pay out between 4.5 to 5% so that would be paying out 8,300,000 per year

Why do you place any great significance on endowments which has next to nothing to do with athletics? Unless of course, the endowments are to the athletic department. The reason the Belt is considered the bottom of the heap is that it is largely a collection of fc move-ups and/or little known teams. Something that is continuing with the inclusion of Ga St. Resources are a key issue, but that has to do with athletic facilities and budgets, not a school's endowment. You do know that endowments are mostly restricted funds that are seldom spent but generate investment income that is primarily used for scholarships, faculty compensation and research.

endowments are often not restricted in use it just depends on the donor

and endowments do matter in some cases because it is a source of funds that are often not restricted like state funding is and it is money that students can't point to and say "that is our tuition being spent"

true some portions of endowments are restricted if the donor request it goes to a specific program, but after that donation it depends on how the compounded gain is handled as well

if a million is given and the university has a policy of 5% payout then that would be 50K to some program, but if the university can grow that 1 million over a 5% rate of return for several years running than they hold the payout to 5% of a million for the specific program it was given for that would leave excess funds returned to the endowment that would generate future unrestricted returns

166 million is really pretty small overall, but when you are in the 500 million to 1B range and you have a great deal of flexibility in investments it can start to add up

or if you are in the 500m to 1B range and most of it is unrestricted that leaves some money to spend on athletics if you need to make a one time investment in a facility or program

Disagree on what, more money is better than less money? NT even more than most state schools was late in emphasizing fund raising, in fact it is oft quoted that the administration pre seventies was opposed to accepting any gifts much less soliciting them because they didn't want their independence compromised. Frankly, for most school particularly public ones, the amount of funds received from endowment investment is very small relative to other sources.

By the way, I didn't state that endowments were unimportant to the school, they definitely are. The point again is that they have little to do with NT athletics and probably less with realignment. I have not heard any discussions about Boise State's resources or any big movement to get an Ivy league school to move up to the fb division because they have giant endowments. On a realignment scale, I would opine that a couple more recent football victories or an extra million in the athletic budget would weigh much heavier than a few hundred million more in endowments.

at state schools endowments can make a huge difference

as stated with most Texas schools paying out 4.5 to 5% that is 5 million per year for every hundred million in endowment

so UH with 550 million in endowment is paying out at least 24.75 million more than a school with zero endowment every year

Tech with 475 is paying out at least 21 million

that is a lot of money for financial aid, hiring top faculty, building research infrastructure, buying research equipment, recruiting graduate students and post docs, and paying higher faculty start up packages to help lure recognized faculty.....none of those things are covered under state formula funding

in 09-10 state support for resident tuition for UNT was 34 million and change and non-resident tuition was 7 million and change

state support was 109 million and change

so an endowment in the 500 million dollar range paying out 24+ million a year would make a huge difference that is about 14%+ of a state support budget increase every year

and probably a 5 to 7% overall budget increase

Edited April 4, 2012 by GL2Greatness

at state schools endowments can make a huge difference

as stated with most Texas schools paying out 4.5 to 5% that is 5 million per year for every hundred million in endowment

so UH with 550 million in endowment is paying out at least 24.75 million more than a school with zero endowment every year

Tech with 475 is paying out at least 21 million

that is a lot of money for financial aid, hiring top faculty, building research infrastructure, buying research equipment, recruiting graduate students and post docs, and paying higher faculty start up packages to help lure recognized faculty.....none of those things are covered under state formula funding

in 09-10 state support for resident tuition for UNT was 34 million and change and non-resident tuition was 7 million and change

state support was 109 million and change

so an endowment in the 500 million dollar range paying out 24+ million a year would make a huge difference that is about 14%+ of a state support budget increase every year

and probably a 5 to 7% overall budget increase

Do you ever read before you post? Here again is the statement you are trying to respond to:

By the way, I didn't state that endowments were unimportant to the school, they definitely are. The point again is that they have little to do with NT athletics and probably less with realignment. I have not heard any discussions about Boise State's resources or any big movement to get an Ivy league school to move up to the fb division because they have giant endowments. On a realignment scale, I would opine that a couple more recent football victories or an extra million in the athletic budget would weigh much heavier than a few hundred million more in endowments.

From a strictly academic standpoint, Georgia State is superior to a lot of schools, some of which are already in the Belt...and particularly Texas State.

Do you ever read before you post? Here again is the statement you are trying to respond to:

By the way, I didn't state that endowments were unimportant to the school, they definitely are. The point again is that they have little to do with NT athletics and probably less with realignment. I have not heard any discussions about Boise State's resources or any big movement to get an Ivy league school to move up to the fb division because they have giant endowments. On a realignment scale, I would opine that a couple more recent football victories or an extra million in the athletic budget would weigh much heavier than a few hundred million more in endowments.

perhaps it does not make a difference to move into "the belt" but if SMU or UH had a 100 million dollar endowment they would not be in the Big East and if TCU had a 100 million dollar endowment they would not be in the Big 12

Boise got into the BE for one reason only and that is because they win and the BE needs their points

Endowment may not be the only factor of even one of the major factors, but it comes into consideration for sure

as for your comments on Ivy League there is a reason none of them are ever ask to move up and that is because they won't move up because they all specifically decided to move down to remove the emphasis and spending on athletics over academics and also because they all like playing each other in the Ivy League and they don't need the exposure of D1-A athletics so bringing them up is just nonsense

From a strictly academic standpoint, Georgia State is superior to a lot of schools, some of which are already in the Belt...and particularly Texas State.

so you are saying they would be right below FIU and even with or maybe just ahead of FAU then right?

From a strictly academic standpoint, Georgia State is superior to a lot of schools, some of which are already in the Belt...and particularly Texas State.

Agreed. My dad got his MBA & PhD from Ga St. I doubt many are aware of their business program's rep in Atlanta.

I don't understand the negative backlash. We know what the Sunbelt is: the southern gateway to FBS.

Until we consistently dominate in FB or men's BB, I find the superiority complex seen throughout the board confusing. Heck, let's start with a Bubba's Cup.

As long as we're in the league, I'll support but we all agree that better conference affiliations exist.

I don't care anymore. I just don't. We're obviously not the first choice of anyone.

We are reaping the damn foolishness of dropping to I-AA...still.

We are reaping the damn foolishness of hiring a high school football coach to take us from bad to worse...still.

We are reaping the damn foolishness of waiting so long to upgrade facilities...still.

And, we wait and we wait and we wait.

The crazier people on here laughed at UTSA. Laughed that they hired Larry Coker. Laughed at Texas State. Laughed that they hired Dennis Franchione.

We laugh and laugh and laugh, and yet, where are we? On the outside looking in...all the time...every time.

Georgia State is in Atlanta. They've got Bill Curry leading them. Although we might not like to admit it, they could very well surpass us in the realignment game. So might UTSA. Little Boise State did. Start from scratch South Florida did as well.

So, I say, "Welcome aboard, Georgia State." At least while we're being ignored and surpassed, we'll have more interesting cities to visit for away games.

The only thing that will ever cure any of this is winning.

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

I don't know that we can realistically ask for anything more to be done by our university to get us into the Alliance. My guess is that if we don't get in now, we ain't gettin' in. Here's why: We already have the facilities, TV market, budget and academic standing to fit perfectly with the Alliance now. If the Alliance still thinks we aren't a fit, then I highly doubt that anything will change that belief in the future. Yes, our football team has been awful, but our attendance numbers have actually gone up since we won the SBC in 2001-2004. I just can't see how winning the SBC this year would suddenly change the minds of the Alliance members if they believe that we don't belong in their conference now.

To piggyback on your points of what we still pay the price for as a university from poor decisions in our past, imagine being the chancellor or president at UNT if we stay in the SBC and then the league gets dropped down to a less than FBS level in the future. Can you imagine the outcry that will come from the dollars that have been spent on the football program recently? If we think the Denia/Denton residents that hate UNT howl right now, just think of how much ammunition that crowd will run with in their anti-athletics drivel if we don't get to move up anytime soon...

Also, we get laughed at when we ask people to come watch a home game againsta conference mate in Western Kentucky. I have already gotten laughs about a home conference game this year against South Alabama. I am fairly certain that trying to sell a home conference game against Georgia State won't be any easier in the future.

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

I don't know that we can realistically ask for anything more to be done by our university to get us into the Alliance. My guess is that if we don't get in now, we ain't gettin' in. Here's why: We already have the facilities, TV market, budget and academic standing to fit perfectly with the Alliance now. If the Alliance still thinks we aren't a fit, then I highly doubt that anything will change that belief in the future. Yes, our football team has been awful, but our attendance numbers have actually gone up since we won the SBC in 2001-2004. I just can't see how winning the SBC this year would suddenly change the minds of the Alliance members if they believe that we don't belong in their conference now.

To piggyback on your points of what we still pay the price for as a university from poor decisions in our past, imagine being the chancellor or president at UNT if we stay in the SBC and then the league gets dropped down to a less than FBS level in the future. Can you imagine the outcry that will come from the dollars that have been spent on the football program recently? If we think the Denia/Denton residents that hate UNT howl right now, just think of how much ammunition that crowd will run with in their anti-athletics drivel if we don't get to move up anytime soon...

Also, we get laughed at when we ask people to come watch a home game againsta conference mate in Western Kentucky. I have already gotten laughs about a home conference game this year against South Alabama. I am fairly certain that trying to sell a home conference game against Georgia State won't be any easier in the future.

Good post. I would add that if we are in a better conference, attendance should go up. The average person knows nothing about the other Sunbelt teams. Much less knowing someone who went to one of those schools. A friend who is an SMU grad plans on attending the future games with me. It will be fun. If we played Rice every year, I would never miss a game home or away. I want to play more Texas schools minus A&M. (I will cheer for any Texas school but them. I can't listen to the douche baggery. I look forward to the SEC owning them.)

Meanwhile my wife says "Who is Troy?" (everytime we play)

Better opposition will get people to games.

Edited April 6, 2012 by UNTexas