Big 12-2/Minus 2 Conference done...how do we benefit

As silly as all of this sounds, these falling dominoes may eventually give non-"traditional" power a little leverage.

Texas and BYU are going to have to fill their networks with something. If I were a non-BCS AQ fielding phone calls from Texas or BYU, I'd say, "Sure we'll go on your network...for a home-and-home contract with the front end game played at our stadium."

Texas/BYU would get their independent schedules filled, and non-BCS AQ schools would get their stadiums sold out.

As far as conferences, we've got more to offer the C-USA than La. Tech. Our football facilities are better, our team will soon be better, and our men's basketball program is better.

Yeah, and I don't understand it all but there's also something about the timing of this BOR meeting and 72 hours? Does anyone know what that's all about?

By the way, there's currently 9,000 people logged onto TexAgs.com. That's a lot of work not getting done today?

Rick

The Ags are trying to move before the Texas Legislature stops them:

"The A&M announcement came a few hours after the Texas House Committee on Higher Education, which controls state university funding, announced hearings regarding “college athletics,” specifically A&M’s possible move to the SEC."

http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/college-sports/texas-aggies/20110812-texas-am-officials-eager-to-talk-about-sec-move-to-meet-monday.ece

Edited August 12, 2011 by NT80

Sad that the Big 12 would take the Houston program in trade for A&M. This is probably the reason Oklahoma, Kansas, and Missouri look elsewhere. Texas Tech sounds shaky, too, already rebuffing the Texas offer to broadcast its games.

The reality is, where do those other teams go? Texas Tech is only in the Big XII by legislative fiat; it was originally only going to be UT and A&M from the SWC. Who would take TT today? Not the PAC conference. Not the SEC. I doubt the Big East, but I could be wrong. And even if the Big East would take them, would that be a better situation for TT than the Big XII? TCU would gladly give TT their place in the BE for TT's place in the BXII.

Mizzou has already tried flirting with the Big 10, but they were rebuffed. Nothing has changed to indicate they would take Mizzou now.

KU could certainly expect a BE invite, but the Kansas legislature would not let it happen unless K-State goes as well. Even if it were to happen, the BE is a clear step down from the BXII.

The reality is, where do those other teams go? Texas Tech is only in the Big XII by legislative fiat; it was originally only going to be UT and A&M from the SWC. Who would take TT today? Not the PAC conference. Not the SEC. I doubt the Big East, but I could be wrong. And even if the Big East would take them, would that be a better situation for TT than the Big XII? TCU would gladly give TT their place in the BE for TT's place in the BXII.

Mizzou has already tried flirting with the Big 10, but they were rebuffed. Nothing has changed to indicate they would take Mizzou now.

KU could certainly expect a BE invite, but the Kansas legislature would not let it happen unless K-State goes as well. Even if it were to happen, the BE is a clear step down from the BXII.

Tech had a Pac-10 invite in the Summer 2010 round of "Big 12 Breakup." There's no reason to think they would not get another in a package with OU and Oklahoma State. It wouldn't shock me to see TCU offered a seat at the Pac-10 table as well.

Kansas and Missouri could both get Big East invites based on their basketball history. Big East is more basketball intense than football. Kansas would be in with the likes of Connecticut, St. John's, Syracuse, Seton Hall, Marquette, Cincinnati, Georgetown, Villanova...the Jaywaks are a perfect hit for the Big East. Mizzou is as well. They love basketball and have more tradition there than in football.

Mizzou has an outside chance of going Big Ten. Kansas State, goes, perhaps, to the Mountain West. Again, I think Mountain West replaces Big 12 as a BCS AQ when the Big 12 evaporates. So, it's would be a step down for K-State.

The only two schools I see having to hope and beg are Baylor and Iowa State. There was really no reason for Baylor to be in the Big 12. TCU was screwed over (in their minds) when Baylor was selected over them. But, let's be honest, in 1993 when the announcement was made, Baylor and TCU weren't football power. Baylor still isn't despite having been given BCS money all these years that TCU hasn't gotten.

Texas will be independent if they don't agree to scale back their tier three television rights. The Pac-10 was open to creating regional television networks, but not one for each school.

If Texas' third tier game rights are taken away, Longhorn network becomes nothing more than an infomercial.

Like I said, I think non-BCS AQ AD should hardball Texas into home-and-homes in trade for giving up their tier three television rights to the Longhorn Network.

Iowa State will probably have to go MAC or C-USA. There's no one to pull for them politically. They were never a power in the Big 8. Their best football run was under Dan McCarney. Iowa cares as much for them as SMU does for us. They might beg into the Mountain West. I just doubt it.

Edited August 12, 2011 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

The reality is that Texas wants to keep as many in-state teams as it can. I predict they will want TT, OU, OSU, and probably Baylor--at least--to go wherever they land. aTm is too far into this now to back out. Will be interesting to see how the Texas legislature reacts.

This is an interesting twist.

http://withleather.uproxx.com/2011/08/are-fsu-and-texas-am-joining-the-sec

By the way, there's currently 9,000 people logged onto TexAgs.com. That's a lot of work not getting done today?

Rick

Come on, Rick! They're Ags: how much work do you think is really being missed?

The reality is that Texas wants to keep as many in-state teams as it can. I predict they will want TT, OU, OSU, and probably Baylor--at least--to go wherever they land. aTm is too far into this now to back out. Will be interesting to see how the Texas legislature reacts.

The problem remains the Longhorn Network. If OU, Oklahoma State, Tech, and Baylor weren't comfortable with it in the Big 12, why would they suddenly be comfortable with it in a new conference? No BCS AQ conference will be.

Texas isn't calling the shots this time around. They had their shot in June 2010. The tune is now being called by Texas A&M. After them, all eyes will be on OU and the Pac-12.

With the Longhorn Networks' contract details exposed, they have no pull with any conference. Every one they deal with will insist on them giving up some of their televised game rights. If Texas Tech won't play ball, there's no way any SEC, Big Ten, or Pac-12 schools will.

After A&M bails, OU is the lynch pin in keeping the Big 12-3 together. They've sat back and watched Texas hang itself with ESPN and A&M walk. They've been (probably) wisely silent.

However, if you were to get a copy of OU AD Joe Castiglione's phone bill, my guess is you'd see a ton of calls between him and Pac-12 Commish Larry Scott.

If TMZ had a sports sister, its people would be stalking Joe's house to see which airport he was going to this weekend. OU has in the past hired coaches and had meetings at hotels around DFW.

On another note, my guess is that the guy at ESPN who slipped out the details about the high school games and conference games on the Longhorn Network probably isn't the most popular guy at work now.

Edited August 13, 2011 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

The reality is, where do those other teams go? Texas Tech is only in the Big XII by legislative fiat; it was originally only going to be UT and A&M from the SWC. Who would take TT today? Not the PAC conference. Not the SEC. I doubt the Big East, but I could be wrong. And even if the Big East would take them, would that be a better situation for TT than the Big XII? TCU would gladly give TT their place in the BE for TT's place in the BXII.

Mizzou has already tried flirting with the Big 10, but they were rebuffed. Nothing has changed to indicate they would take Mizzou now.

KU could certainly expect a BE invite, but the Kansas legislature would not let it happen unless K-State goes as well. Even if it were to happen, the BE is a clear step down from the BXII.

BE is a step down from Big XII in football, but its a step up for basketball and academics, and that might be attractive to KU. Big XII without KU is a good but not fantastic basketball conference, but BE plus KU would be basketball's SEC if it isn't that already.

Edited August 13, 2011 by pastorgrant

I know this is off topic but did anyone alse notice longhorn network ads running on this topic page?

Tech had a Pac-10 invite in the Summer 2010 round of "Big 12 Breakup." There's no reason to think they would not get another in a package with OU and Oklahoma State.

Except for the fact that Stanford balked about taking Tech in the first place even with Texas involved. Look, the LHN was not a deal-breaker for the PAC10 in the first place and the PAC10 commissioner said so at the time. PAC is still an option for the leftovers of the Big 12, and that definitely still includes Texas. OU wants to go where Texas goes. They do not want to lose that rivalry.

The only two schools I see having to hope and beg are Baylor and Iowa State. There was really no reason for Baylor to be in the Big 12.

Except that Baylor has powerful allies in the Texas legislature and can turn a lot of screws in Austin. Bullock and Richards saw to that during the Big 12's formation. They still have friends in high places and are not powerless in the current scenario.

TCU was screwed over (in their minds) when Baylor was selected over them.

TCU was not screwed over. TCU had no leverage in Austin, and their program was a craphole. Their attendance and support was poor and they brought no television that OU, Texas, aTm didn't deliver. No one is going to give up their share of the pie for a crap program, and that's what TCU was at the time.

Edited August 13, 2011 by LongJim

OU doesn't need Texas. The big misperception here is that A&M and OU need Texas.

A&M's product goes along nicely with the SEC. They've already got plently of history with LSU (50 games) and Arkansas (67 games)...as well as a decade long, JerryWorld contract with the Razorbacks. Adding in Alabama, Tennessee, Florida, etc. is a ton better than sticking with Baylor, Tech, etc.

As for Baylor, Richards and Bullock are dead. No one is going to be snowed twice.

Tech will have another invite to the Pac-12, as they did last year. And, TCU is already part of a BSC AQ conference now, so they're not going to crawl just to save Texas' bacon. They've got enough leverage and self-respect now to have to follow DeLoss Dodds orders.

Plus, many TCU people do feel the Big 12 screwed them in 1994, and are not going to bend over to Texas these days. They've shown they can survive and thrive without conference mates from any Texas school. Basically, in their success, TCU has discover the Texas-driven conference model doesn't work.

Texas' problem is that they don't realize they're not the center of the college football world. Everyone is looking out for their best interest now, just like Texas. The Texas overreach simply opened the remaining blind eyes and has caused them to lose control of the realignment momentum.

Texas is on the outside looking in, watching A&M now. Next week, they'll watch OU, Florida State, and Pac-12 take center stage. They will be the beggars this time around. They've whored themselves out to the nth degree, so now everyone is looking for a date with a better reputation. They're too high maintenance and the bang isn't worth the buck.

Edited August 13, 2011 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

The problem remains the Longhorn Network. If OU, Oklahoma State, Tech, and Baylor weren't comfortable with it in the Big 12, why would they suddenly be comfortable with it in a new conference? No BCS AQ conference will be.

Texas isn't calling the shots this time around. They had their shot in June 2010. The tune is now being called by Texas A&M. After them, all eyes will be on OU and the Pac-12.

Looks like the LHN added the second game, as well as HS highlights. Either Kansas or KSU. Whores.

aTm has officially notified the Big 12 that they are exploring options with the SEC, and are asking the rest of the Big 12 what the 'correct steps' are to leave the Big 12 should they decide to do so. Looks like Baylor's lawyers are turning screws.

It is rumored that the Texas/aTm game will no longer be played if the Ags leave, at least for the foreseeable future. That game would be replaced by a date with Notre Dame. ND/OU/Texas also apparently have a 'gentleman's agreement' regarding aTm as well.

This is getting interesting.

aTm has officially notified the Big 12 that they are exploring options with the SEC, and are asking the rest of the Big 12 what the 'correct steps' are to leave the Big 12 should they decide to do so. Looks like Baylor's lawyers are turning screws.

It is rumored that the Texas/aTm game will no longer be played if the Ags leave, at least for the foreseeable future. That game would be replaced by a date with Notre Dame. ND/OU/Texas also apparently have a 'gentleman's agreement' regarding aTm as well.

This is getting interesting.

It's getting ugly.

A&M leaving the Big 12 for the SEC is really not in their own best interest, it is to spite UT.

And UT replacing A&M with ND for their "rivalry" game? I'm sure it would generate excitement, but it would not get the whole state buzzing the way UT vs. A&M does.

Sounds to me like both sides are blinded by pride. I know A&M leaving the Big 12 at some point could have positive implications for North Texas. But it's really in the best interest of UT and A&M to keep A&M in the Big 12 and to keep the rivalry alive.

http://www.aggieathletics.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=27300&ATCLID=205247891

It's getting ugly.

A&M leaving the Big 12 for the SEC is really not in their own best interest, it is to spite UT.

And UT replacing A&M with ND for their "rivalry" game? I'm sure it would generate excitement, but it would not get the whole state buzzing the way UT vs. A&M does.

Sounds to me like both sides are blinded by pride. I know A&M leaving the Big 12 at some point could have positive implications for North Texas. But it's really in the best interest of UT and A&M to keep A&M in the Big 12 and to keep the rivalry alive.

I would see a game with UT vs ND generating much more buzz than vs A&M. ND is a national team, A&M is not even close to that level. For me personally, I never watched an A&M game until i started dating my fiancee, who is in a family of A&M grads. I also may be biased because I grew up a ND fan and if it weren't for UNT they would still be my favorite team. My best friend actually offered to take me to the ND-Michigan game this season for a bachelor type party thing, but I had to refuse as it is the same day as our first game in the new stadium. He thought I was crazy and stupid...

Edited August 25, 2011 by glick1980

Since SMU has announced they want to join the Big 12 to replace A&M, it looks like UNT would jump all over that vacant positon as well. It looks to me that UNT has more to offer than SMU, stadium size, student body numbers and would offer the same TV market.

I see Houston getting in if its a Texas school. They need to replace the coverage they are losing in that area. UH is a poor replacement but they are similar to us in that if they gain AQ they can be a big force (which is also another thing hindering both of us from being AQ, large public schools in the two most recruit fertile areas of the state.)

UNT and SMU have about the same low chance of gaining BigXII invite. Our endowment and reputation aren't there yet, and I don't think the BigXII wants a small private school.

IMHO the best thing would be for UNT to end up in the MWC. I never understood people's obsession with CUSA. Compare the 2

MWC

Air Force- national service academy, always draw well and usually a good team

Boise State- Built up the WAC almost single handedly, nationally recognized in football

Colorado State- 2nd state school, decent academics

Fresno State- known to have some decent athletics from time to time

Hawaii- state flagship, known for its BCS buster football

New Mexico- State flagship, basketball power

San Diego State- has been known as a good athletic program. Ranked last year, basketball power

Nevada- state flagship, was ranked last year

UNLV- basketball power

Wyoming- state flagship, not very good mostly mediocre.

CUSA-

UAB- decent endownmnent

Central Florida- recent football and basketball success. Ranked last year

East Carolina- good football and fan support

Marshall- was good when in the MAC, very sup-par now

Memphis- nationally known basketball, hasn't really been the same after Calipari left though

Southern Miss- don't really know much about them

Houston- recent success in football, semi name recognition.

Rice- good academics, poor athletics

SMU- bowl eligible last few years, not much else.

UTEP- mediocre team,

Tulane- same as rice

Tulsa- recent football success

feel free to add on. I fully admit that I don't know everything about these schools so if I got something wrong feel free to correct me.

The MWC teams aren't going anywhere, CUSA might lose ECU and UCF which would kill its prestige. Add Houston to that and the MWC is a no brainer.

It's getting ugly.

A&M leaving the Big 12 for the SEC is really not in their own best interest, it is to spite UT.

And UT replacing A&M with ND for their "rivalry" game? I'm sure it would generate excitement, but it would not get the whole state buzzing the way UT vs. A&M does.

Sounds to me like both sides are blinded by pride. I know A&M leaving the Big 12 at some point could have positive implications for North Texas. But it's really in the best interest of UT and A&M to keep A&M in the Big 12 and to keep the rivalry alive.

A&M doesn't need Texas, it's the other way around. Also, the whole state doesn't buzz with the UT-A&M game. I can think of very few, outside of their graduates - who don't constitute "the whole state" - who even care.

A&M is doing what's in its best interest - moving to the strongest football conference in the country, and leaving a crumbling conference behind. Only OU and Texas are stupid enough to believe the Big 12 is salvagable,

The list of replacements for Texas A&M is a joke. Houston? SMU? Air Force? Pathetic.

Edited August 26, 2011 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

I see Houston getting in if its a Texas school. They need to replace the coverage they are losing in that area. UH is a poor replacement but they are similar to us in that if they gain AQ they can be a big force (which is also another thing hindering both of us from being AQ, large public schools in the two most recruit fertile areas of the state.)

UNT and SMU have about the same low chance of gaining BigXII invite. Our endowment and reputation aren't there yet, and I don't think the BigXII wants a small private school.

IMHO the best thing would be for UNT to end up in the MWC. I never understood people's obsession with CUSA. Compare the 2

MWC

Air Force- national service academy, always draw well and usually a good team

Boise State- Built up the WAC almost single handedly, nationally recognized in football

Colorado State- 2nd state school, decent academics

Fresno State- known to have some decent athletics from time to time

Hawaii- state flagship, known for its BCS buster football

New Mexico- State flagship, basketball power

San Diego State- has been known as a good athletic program. Ranked last year, basketball power

Nevada- state flagship, was ranked last year

UNLV- basketball power

Wyoming- state flagship, not very good mostly mediocre.

CUSA-

UAB- decent endownmnent

Central Florida- recent football and basketball success. Ranked last year

East Carolina- good football and fan support

Marshall- was good when in the MAC, very sup-par now

Memphis- nationally known basketball, hasn't really been the same after Calipari left though

Southern Miss- don't really know much about them

Houston- recent success in football, semi name recognition.

Rice- good academics, poor athletics

SMU- bowl eligible last few years, not much else.

UTEP- mediocre team,

Tulane- same as rice

Tulsa- recent football success

feel free to add on. I fully admit that I don't know everything about these schools so if I got something wrong feel free to correct me.

The MWC teams aren't going anywhere, CUSA might lose ECU and UCF which would kill its prestige. Add Houston to that and the MWC is a no brainer.

UNT- Home to golfingomez, extremely endowed

Only OU and Texas are stupid enough to believe the Big 12 is salvagable,

The list of replacements for Texas A&M is a joke. Houston? SMU? Air Force? Pathetic.

It's funny to me that Byrne in this whole deal is nowhere to be found. He's not in favor of the move, but he'll do what he's told, I'm sure.

OU and Texas know full well that the Big 12 is dead. Neither want to be involved in the cesspool that is the SEC. (For that matter, Florida and Georgia are sick of it, as well.)

No credible (IMO) source has mentioned Houston or SMU as "replacements". The Big 12 is a dead man walking, but no one is going to be taken by surprise, which is why Notre Dame and BYU are already on OU and Texas schedules. It's plain as day. OU and Texas have known that aTm was eventually going to make a move for the money. I don't think they expected it this quickly.

I suspect Baylor and a few other schools in the Big 12 will turn the screws on the Aggies to pay the full amount of the conference exit fees--particularly since aTm was the only school that demanded their full share of the exit fees when Nebraska and Colorado left last year, while the other conference members dropped their share of the fees substantially.

At this point, most of the Big 12 AD's (an example in particular--Jamie Pollard at Iowa State) just want the Ags to shut up and get the hell out if that's what they want to do.

A&M is going to the SEC and they'll be okay.

UT may stay in a reconfigured Big12, create a new super conference, join the PAC12, or go independent - regardless, they'll be fine.

The loser in all this is college sports in the state of Texas. I like the Aggies and would rather watch them play Texas than LSU. I like the Horns and would rather watch them play A&M than Iowa State. Sad.

Sadder still, this probably leaves the Mean Green in that Hell Hole calted the Belt.

God bless Texas.

It's funny to me that Byrne in this whole deal is nowhere to be found. He's not in favor of the move, but he'll do what he's told, I'm sure.

OU and Texas know full well that the Big 12 is dead. Neither want to be involved in the cesspool that is the SEC. (For that matter, Florida and Georgia are sick of it, as well.)

No credible (IMO) source has mentioned Houston or SMU as "replacements". The Big 12 is a dead man walking, but no one is going to be taken by surprise, which is why Notre Dame and BYU are already on OU and Texas schedules. It's plain as day. OU and Texas have known that aTm was eventually going to make a move for the money. I don't think they expected it this quickly.

I suspect Baylor and a few other schools in the Big 12 will turn the screws on the Aggies to pay the full amount of the conference exit fees--particularly since aTm was the only school that demanded their full share of the exit fees when Nebraska and Colorado left last year, while the other conference members dropped their share of the fees substantially.

At this point, most of the Big 12 AD's (an example in particular--Jamie Pollard at Iowa State) just want the Ags to shut up and get the hell out if that's what they want to do.

Every report has the same list of school to replace A&M - Houston, SMU, Air Force, Notre Dame, and BYU.

Houston and SMU would jump at the chance. Air Force might. Notre Dame won't. BYU might. But, outside of Notre Dame, none of them have punch of A&M.

All of this goes back to the big schools eating themselves. The Big Ten, SEC, and Pac-12 are content to share and get along. Texas isn't; so, there will always be dysfunction in the Big 12. Sad for their supporters, too, because the Big 12 was the premiere football conference at the beginning of the century.

Greed tears things apart - even football conferences.

Congrats to A&M for seeing the light and getting out while the getting is good. And, like the OU and Nebraska fans who had to get over losing their annual Thanksgiving rivalry, A&M and Longhorn fans will live.

An A&M in the SEC will have a built in game with just as much national appeal. Texas will beg someone into the spot as a replacement. Since nothing is sacred to Texas except money, maybe they'll move the OU game to JerryWorld Thanksgiving weekend.

You know, all this talk about the former SWC schools and their "history" just doesn't hold much water with me. Any conference like the B-12 should be looking for growth potential. Out of the three private schools that used to be in the old SWC, the one that has really grown(status-wise) is TCU. And as someone else has pointed out, they've positioned themselves in a very good conference already.

I see us as a better " growth down the road" option for the B-12 than any of the private schools that used to be in the old SWC.

And if not the B-12, then the MWC would be the next viable option.